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Jun 24 2025 12:43pm
I never even mentioned the word Trump. You have no argument and are just attempting insults to distract


Your post was "here is why ad hominem is legitimate" lel. Like I said before you can weaponize that fallacy against anyone you don't like. This is Chimp level intellect bro
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Jun 24 2025 12:44pm
Do you honestly believe that Israel will withdraw from the westbank, uprooting its people that it has colonized there? the US did not colonize iraq or afghanistan, a better example would be to use the united states, or even Hawaii, and you probably know what happened to the indigenous populations better then me. your argument is not a stretch, its simply not credible.


this is based off of an assumption that lasting peace is impossible unless Israel withdraws from all areas of the west bank that have been settled. i dont think that's a correct assumption.

Israel would in some sense have to cede land back in a land swap for any WB state solution, but 100%? i dont buy that.

the day that Israel draws a border and says "our land stops here, yours starts here" that line will be a celebration. an independent state is a celebration. the same would happen in gaza even if it was announce they wanted a DMZ style deadzone between gaza and israel.

this exact process happened in the creation of the US border with both canada and mexico. its happened all over the world.
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Jun 24 2025 12:44pm
Your post was "here is why ad hominem is legitimate" lel. Like I said before you can weaponize that fallacy against anyone you don't like. This is Chimp level intellect bro


Nope, here's my post again. Notice how I didn't insult you and I don't mention Trump. Keep flailing please

This argument makes absolutely no sense

It's extremely valid to apply skepticism selectively because person X is different than person Y. If you found out your babysitter is a convicted child molester, you would be more skeptical of them than if your babysitter was your brother. It doesn't matter if the equivalent environment exists and they behave identically, their past affects how skeptical you are about their actions


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Jun 24 2025 12:45pm
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Jun 24 2025 12:48pm
I explained my argument without supporting or not supporting Trump. It included a specific example of the logical fallacy in your post

You responded with zero substance and can only attempt a personal attack. Embarrassing


I did not make a personal attack, i segwayed from your metaphor into an anecdotal story. A personal attack would be me attacking you. When reading your latest post, while it is not an attack, it is certainly confrontational. understand I was in no way seeking to escalate an argument, I was attempting, with my own dark humor, to de-escalate. Let me see if i can revisit the initial disagreement:

It is TDS when that skepticism is selectively applied to Donald Trump, and not others where an otherwise equivalent environment exists.


This argument makes absolutely no sense. It's extremely valid to apply skepticism selectively because person X is different than person Y. If you found out your babysitter is a convicted child molester, you would be more skeptical of them than if your babysitter was your brother. It doesn't matter if the equivalent environment exists and they behave identically, their past affects how skeptical you are about their actions


Elite made, in my opinion, based on the precedent of Biden, a true statement. Give me some rope now (both of you) to hang myself. Joe Biden, in my opinion, can be regarded as one of the worst presidents in US history. His handling of the Russia / Ukraine affair, over decades, leaves much to be desired, but he has not been vilified to the extent that Trump has (understand I am not a fan of Biden or Trump), therefore, with this accepted (by me) I would continue: Donald Trump is a highly divisive figure and he is both irrational and creates irrational (and rational!) dislike by those that really dont like him.

This is a topic related to the US-Israeli - Iran war. One needs only read through this thread to see the TDS XDS (where X can be applied to both Israel's and Iranians).

This post was edited by ferdia on Jun 24 2025 12:50pm
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Jun 24 2025 12:52pm
I did not make a personal attack, i segwayed from your metaphor into an anecdotal story. A personal attack would be me attacking you. When reading your latest post, while it is not an attack, it is certainly confrontational. understand I was in no way seeking to escalate an argument, I was attempting, with my own dark humor, to de-escalate. Let me see if i can revisit the initial disagreement:





Elite made, in my opinion, based on the precedent of Biden, a true statement. Give me some rope now (both of you) to hang myself. Joe Biden, in my opinion, can be regarded as one of the worst presidents in US history. His handling of the Russia / Ukraine affair, over decades, leaves much to be desired, but he has not been vilified to the extent that Trump has (understand I am not a fan of Biden or Trump), therefore, with this accepted (by me) I would continue: Donald Trump is a highly divisive figure and he is both irrational and creates irrational (and rational!) dislike by those that really dont like him.


My point is that TDS is a nonsense argument. I'm not saying anything about Trump or Biden

Saying TDS is essentially saying "you don't trust Trump", which is obvious and doesn't actually mean anything. One could say you have BDD (Biden derangement syndrome) but I wouldn't say that because it's a meaningless label. Of course you don't trust Biden because his previous actions make you not trust him and you are skeptical of anything associated with him.
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Jun 24 2025 12:53pm
this is based off of an assumption that lasting peace is impossible unless Israel withdraws from all areas of the west bank that have been settled. i dont think that's a correct assumption.

Israel would in some sense have to cede land back in a land swap for any WB state solution, but 100%? i dont buy that.

the day that Israel draws a border and says "our land stops here, yours starts here" that line will be a celebration. an independent state is a celebration. the same would happen in gaza even if it was announce they wanted a DMZ style deadzone between gaza and israel.

this exact process happened in the creation of the US border with both canada and mexico. its happened all over the world.


The fate of the indians is a bit closer to that of the Palestinians. They dont have a country. and the US has peace because there are no indians left, beaten down into submission. thats the harsh reality. while you can shy away from this and provide other examples, i believe my argument holds more weight.
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Jun 24 2025 12:58pm
The fate of the indians is a bit closer to that of the Palestinians. They dont have a country. and the US has peace because there are no indians left, beaten down into submission. thats the harsh reality. while you can shy away from this and provide other examples, i believe my argument holds more weight.


this argument isn't valid, sorry. we're talking about terms for them to be given a nation. perhaps i misunderstood you, are you saying no peace deal is possible without israel giving back ALL settlements? because thats how i read your post.

im getting specific because a lot of people have this list of demands, and they claim no peace deal is possible unless, for example: israel removes blockade immediately, israel returns all settlements to 19XX date borders, israel still provides power/water, etc.

i think that's all moot. ALL of it moot. because its fruit of a poisonous tree. without saudis or qatar agreeing to oversee the new govt the terms are meaningless. its really the lynchpin of the whole lasting peace. and if we are saying saudis wont get involved unless exact 1950s borders are reestablished i dont think thats the case. they're a lot smarter than that to set redlines in such a specific sense. and they do not want the blockade removed if they're taking control, insurgency will be too hard to suppress even with a blockade.
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Jun 24 2025 01:11pm
You're demonstrating ad hominem fallacy here. You didn't learn this?

I can apply this fallacy to every single anti-Trump person to dismiss anything they have to say


No it's not. Given his history it's credible to the argument to not take his word has gospel on this subject. Likewise, to further add credibility, he has immense pressure to convey success regardless of outcome given his previous stance in foreign engagements given the greatest win possible for the USA is essentially well he did exactly what he said he wouldn't but at least we're not sucked into a needless multi year war pissing USA money away in a fruitless effort.

This post was edited by SBD on Jun 24 2025 01:14pm
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Jun 24 2025 01:12pm
well since i don't play d2\d2:r anymore, this will be my last comment in d2jsp. this website is irrelevant to me for years.

iv been in this forum section for maybe 2-3 topic in regard of Israel, obviously.

i will post some feedback for the ones who are interested in a local\real point of view, im not gonna reply back.
some are my own opinions, some are facts. i will state FACT if it's not based on my own point of view, or if i can't prove it.
im not trying to convince anyone here. i honestly don't care, just posting one comment and im out.

im in my 40's , got a son in the IDF , a daughter in high-school, served in a combat role for over 10 years in the IDF, my wife served over 6 years as an officer in the Israeli navy.

Gaza-Israel issue:

from statistics, post-Oct 7 the majority of Israelis like myself ( Secular Jews, including Traditional-Secular ) who actually makes the majority of the country, are 100% against ANY solution that is based on giving land to the people of Gaza. already did that in Ariel Sharon days, tried it, received only rockets since then.

FACT: Hamas is a dead pony. the organization as a terror organization who was once well.. organized as such is now done. it's an empty shell only alive because it holds they key for the Israeli hostages. stating it as a fact, because i have my own IDF sources. yes, they can use booby traps and fire a missile once in while
but they are done. yet the problem remains ( hostages ) and i believe that now after the conflict with Iran, it will be sealed in a matter of weeks.

FACT: Gaza is one of the most complex, problematic, dangerous places on earth for military warfare. no army on planet earth could have done anything better than the IDF, Palestinian casualties included.

FACT: Palestine never existed. no such a country, no such economy, no Palestinian president, nothing at all. the term is pointless, rose up by the terrorist Yasser Arafat and pump-up by the ugly side of the left, liberals and idiots who supports the idea without understanding there is no idea. most of those people are Jordanians or Egyptians.

FACT: as an Israeli i live, work and walk among Arabs. some parts in our country are more populated with Arabs ( Muslims \ Christians ) or Druze ( northern Israel ) and i can tell you this: all of us live happily, work happily and say good morning how are you ? thanks, bye now. there are absolutely no issues with most* of Israelis, and most* of Arabs from within.
whatever sources you have, please stay away from those lies if the truth matters to you.
now why is that relevant ? because some idiots are thinking that if one minister in our government is stating: "let's nuke Gaza" - this means that the entire Israeli population is in agreement with this silly nonsense that some men say. iv seen similar cases in this forum actually in Israel-related topics, and it shows me that outsiders are unfamiliar with anything related to Israel.

how will this end ? my own point of view: some bodies won't be found for years, some hostages will rerutn alive, some bodies will return and Hamas will no longer be relebant in Gaza. in regard of the people in Gaza : some will leave by choice, others - hard to say. i don't see Israel forcing out anyone, i do hope that the Egyptians will find responsibility and take some in.
will there be a two state solution ? no.
will Gaza be a part of Israel ? no.

Iran - Hezbollah - Houthis - Israel issue:

il try to sum it up the shortest way i can.

Hezbollah was the main right hand of the Iranian regime. as it's proxy, the most lethal out of them, it was supposed to act as a shield for the Iranian regime.

FACTS:
- Hezbollah : is gravely crippled and deterred. what Israel achieved in months, was to cut the hands and feet of the organization to the point they didn't fire one missile in the Iran-Israel 12 days conflict.
the entire ranking-tree of the organization was vaporized to ashes, including the moral after taking out Nasrallah. they will never recover.

- Houthis : are like a mosquito at night in your ear. the major issue is intelligence in their controlled-area. while they are not a serious issue, they are a problem to solve.

- Iran-Israel conflict : Iran is a paper tiger. what their regime is posting to the Iranian people : "Tel Aviv is in ashes" , "the truce was the consequence of the barrage on the American base in Qatar" etc..
now everybody knows they are coordinated with the U.S the entire thing to make them look like a threat. thier ego and honor is more important than anything else.
Israel controlled the entire conflict, and i mean by a LONG shot.
Israel's targets were only the regime's.
Iran targets - 94% of the hits including murdering Israelis were on civilian buildings in urban cities. we are talking about missiles with 400-1000 KG of explosive warheads that they aim to urban cities.
Israel intercept rate is around 85% for missiles and 99% for drones.
it is unknown exactly how many fails the Iranian had ( for Ballistic Missiles ), but obviously we do know that they had missiles not reaching Israel and crashing in Iran or exploding on the way up.
Israel is protecting all of it's civilians both passively and actively, closing the entire state ( schools, kinder-gardens , shops etc.. )
Iran don't need to, since we never aimed for populations... they could care only for the regime sustain to last another decade, never for the people in Iran

Cease-Fire:
FACT: it was Iran's way out , since Israeli bombing started to take a MAJOR toll on the regime, and im being generous here,, iv seen some shit i can't and wont post.. our air force literally made judgments those bases
Israel didn't touch oil or civilian infrastructure
they lost a LOT of assets, some are very very strategic in the ballistic missiles manufacturing
the Americans aided with the big bombs or those big mountains - ye il give them credit for their easy part in this


the bottom line - we are a nation that was once surrounded by enemies and it narrowed in time. we take care of business, we are not crybabies like a lot of other countries who never been in out situation.

like it or not we are here, you can't do anything about it - only to whine about it.
there is no such thing as Palestine. never was.
goodbye take care.






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