Honest question, are you referring to people challenging Israels actions or are you referring to the western supporters of Israels actions ? Just seeking clarity.

I’m referring to A LOT of comments here about Israelis tendency for “victimhood” and , as I remember, “the magic word anti-semitism”.
Of course those kind of comments usually come from those challenging Israel’s actions.
/e “here” I mean in the 7oct topic.

This post was edited by WhiteSouned on Jun 19 2025 08:27am

with brevity, WhiteSouned, your right, but the term anti semite was not widely used across this thread (on review). The term anti-semite was not used nearly as much as anti-israeli. When I consider this nuance i am somewhat heartened to see that it is israels actions that are being questions, and there is little emphasis on religion. I gain a bit more clarity that the issue is not one of religion but rather of territory, sovereignty, and regional political power. When I look at what is going on I acknowledge what Israel says and does. i.e. its conflict in Gaza, the West Bank, greater Israel and near abroad. As a democratic state (if Israel wants to call itself such), it is not the Jewish religion that is being challenged, it is Israel. Religion is not the reason, it is merely a point. I try not to mislabel an intent. Finally, when i say i acknowledge what Israel says and does, i mean i take it for what it is, and i do not mislabel it as something else. I am getting a far better understanding of Israel's motives.

The TLDR here is: we are not arguing about what Jewish people are doing, we are arguing about what Israel is doing.

had to make a few edits to tidy it up, i didnt want to be too confrontational here.

This post was edited by ferdia on Jun 19 2025 08:40am

apologies now for double post:

It is my acquired belief (now that I understand several things better) that in response to Oct 7th, Israel was always going to attack Iran after dealing with its internal issues / near abroad issues. Iran has state funded terrorist cells around Israel for the last 3 decades and after Oct 7th, it would have been utterly pointless of Israel to only bomb Gaza, Lebanon etc. without also driving to the root of the issue - Iran. Therefore we have to accept that Israel has clear goals in relation to its attacks on Iran. While the US may have cautioned restraint, when Iran posted a video boasting about stealing a...treasure trove...of nuclear information from Israel, this would have been the straw that broke the camels back with Israel likely to have told the US in no uncertain terms that they had no option but to attack Iran, with the US agreeing.

From a logical standpoint the goals must include the complete destruction of Iran's nuclear programme (regardless of whether Iran wants to make nukes or not) as anything short of that leaves the door open for future problems. Therefore we have to accept that the war with Iran will escalate, noting for Iran this is an existential crisis, therefore in response to Iran, the US is more likely to become directly involved (imminently) and we are going to see mass casualties (in Iran).

All the while Gaza is being bombed into the stone age and more land is being annexed in the west bank, full steam ahead.

This post was edited by ferdia on Jun 19 2025 08:54am

I think this is a fair assessment of preconditions and near future however I fail to see how a protracted bombing campaign with civilians casualties in Iran will pave way for a popular revolt “Syria” style to take out incumbent government. Putting boots on the ground will be extremely controversial and will require a false flag of unprecedented proportions to drum support up.

Israel is currently engaged in open conflict with Iran, and the United States is increasingly aligning itself militarily and politically with that stance. Iran, for its part, has spent the last four decades recognizing and preparing for the threat posed by both nations. In this context, the notion that the U.S.–Israel coalition could somehow enact “regime change” in Iran is not just unrealistic—it’s illogical.

Regime change, in theory, implies replacing the leadership while preserving the structure of the state. But the policies and rhetoric coming from both Israel and, increasingly, the U.S., aren’t just targeting Iran’s government — they’re broadly hostile toward Iran as a sovereign actor in the region. Economic strangulation, sabotage, assassinations, sanctions on everything from medicine to banking — these are not tactics aimed at nudging a state toward liberal democracy; they’re designed to destabilize and weaken the country entirely.

So, no — this isn’t a classical regime change strategy like what was pursued in Iraq or Libya. It’s something more totalizing. And from Iran’s perspective, this confirms the belief that the West isn’t just opposed to the Islamic Republic, but to Iran’s long-term independence and regional influence altogether.

1.Israel supported iran not iraq
2. There is no counter argument to your fictions.
3.I live here, I was drafted, I served in as reservist for 20 years, I know how the IDF operates you can believe or not but you do not tell me how I think, or how I operate.
Anti semitism, means there is no right way every way is the wrong way.
Once we were too poor, than too rich, than we “controlled” the banks, now we control the media… come on.

This post was edited by Many_Names on Jun 19 2025 01:51pm

apologies your right, Israel supported Iran against Saddam.
I dont understand the rest of your statement. If you believe Israel has other plans for Iran, other then trying to cripple its military capabilities, feel free to post those plans, in your opinion (this is not the first time I said this but you declined to elaborate).

This post was edited by ferdia on Jun 19 2025 02:03pm

2.You’re presenting fiction as fact — there’s no real counterargument to made-up narratives.
3.I live here. I was drafted. I served in the reserves for 20 years. I know exactly how the IDF operates — believe me or not, but don’t presume to tell me how I think or how I act.
4.Antisemitism means that no matter what Jews do, it’s always wrong — too poor, then too rich; blamed for controlling the banks, now accused of controlling the media. Enough with the double standard

The plan is simple destroy their nuclear capabilities and their entire ballistic missile arsenal.
We can dream on regime change but this is not one of the goals