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Aug 30 2022 11:13pm
The peace and quiet of the right-wing chuds waiting for someone to tell them what their new spin is.
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Aug 30 2022 11:23pm
Quote (Sioux @ Aug 30 2022 10:13pm)
The peace and quiet of the right-wing chuds waiting for someone to tell them what their new spin is.


RNC just stopped paying for his legal fees too. At this point, he should just run for President.
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Aug 30 2022 11:47pm
Quote (thundercock @ Aug 30 2022 10:23pm)
RNC just stopped paying for his legal fees too. At this point, he should just run for President.


How much can a lawyer runnings ads on daytime tv in Miami really cost
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Aug 31 2022 04:50am
lmfao FBI got exposed for rigging the 2020 election by zuckerberg, how leftist idiots have not entered suicide watch yet & still posting here? :rofl:
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Aug 31 2022 05:14am
Quote (excellence @ Aug 29 2022 08:37pm)
yeah and according to all biden voters and anti-trump people, that was akin to 'hacking' the election


And when Democrats choose to use broken-by-design electronic voting technology created for $60k USD by an intern for their Iowa caucus, that is Trump's campaign meddling with their election.

https://www.technologyreview.com/2020/02/04/844926/iowas-high-tech-caucuses-crashed-and-paper-ballots-saved-the-day/

"sow doubt in in voters’ minds about the integrity of elections and the democratic process" - Good job democrats for sowing the doubt.

This post was edited by RedFromWinter on Aug 31 2022 05:16am
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Aug 31 2022 05:33am
DOJ out with a court filing regarding Trump wanting a special master appointed. They respond to many of Trump's claims:
https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.flsd.618763/gov.uscourts.flsd.618763.41.1_1.pdf

Twitter thread on it:

https://twitter.com/renato_mariotti/status/1564821334579941376

Quote
THREAD: What should we make of the DOJ's response to Trump's motion for a Special Master (among other things)?

1/ Tonight, shortly before midnight Eastern, the DOJ filed a response to Trump's motion seeking a Special Master and raising a number of unrelated concerns.

The filing provides us with new details about what happened prior to the search (and more).

2/ As a starting point, it's apparent the DOJ was concerned that the judge took Trump's motion -- which was bizarre, unprecedented, and without basis in law -- seriously.

Their filing is full of factual information rebutting Trump's false claims and compelling legal arguments.

3/ One point the DOJ makes throughout the filing is that Trump did not assert executive privilege over any of the documents or claim that any of them were declassified prior to the search, despite many communications, meetings, and a grand jury subpoena.

4/ I would expect them to make that same argument in a criminal case, to rebut arguments that he declassified the documents via a "standing order."

It is also obvious, from the filing, that the DOJ has an ongoing criminal investigation of Trump.

5/ For example, DOJ notes that some of Trump's personal items were commingled with classified material, and that those items were seized because they are evidence of criminal activity.

They are evidence of **Trump's** willful possession of the classified material.


6/ Another theme throughout the filing is that Trump's team repeatedly tried to stall and delay when NARA (and later DOJ) inquired regarding the records at Mar-a-Lago.

The DOJ also laid out for the judge Trump's lack of cooperation with government requests for the records.

7/ NARA eventually obtained, after much effort, 15 boxes containing highly classified records.

After that, "the FBI developed evidence indicating that ... dozens of additional boxes remained at the Premises that were also likely to contain classified information."


8/ The DOJ did not issue a grand jury subpoena until *after* it obtained evidence that Trump's team misled NARA into believing that all of the records had been turned over.

(Also it's worth noting that DOJ did not receive permission to disclose the subpoena until yesterday.)

9/ Once again, Trump's team asked for and received an extension. Then Trump's attorneys invited FBI agents to come to Mar-a-Lago to pick up documents in response to the subpoena.

On June 3rd, three FBI agents and a DOJ attorney came to Mar-a-Lago to pick them up.


10/ DOJ notes that Trump's attorney and the custodian there did not assert executive privilege or claim Trump declassified the documents, and the lawyer signed a certification (see below) that all the documents were provided.

(Reportedly Christina Bobb signed the certification.)

11/ The attorney (presumably Bobb) also represented that "all of the records" were stored in a storage room at Mar-a-Lago, that the storage room was "the remaining repository" of records from the White House, and that all available boxes were searched in response to the subpoena.

12/ However, the attorney explicitly prohibited the FBI agents and DOJ attorney from looking at any of the boxes in the storage room, so they were unable to confirm what she said.

(DOJ clearly implies that they believe this suggests the attorney knew she was lying.)


13/ Later "the FBI uncovered multiple sources of evidence indicating that the response to the May 11 grand jury subpoena was incomplete and that classified documents remained at the Premises, notwithstanding the sworn certification made to the government on June 3."

14/ Specifically, the FBI determined that records were kept outside the storage room and that records were "likely concealed and removed from the Storage Room and that efforts were likely taken to obstruct the government's investigation."

(They did not explain this further.)


15/ After executing the search warrant, the government seized "33 items of evidence, mostly boxes" containing "documents with classification markings or what otherwise appeared to be government records."

3 classified documents were found in Trump's desks, not in boxes.


16/ (As I mentioned earlier, the fact that classified documents were found where Trump worked and/or mixed in with other documents/records is evidence that the DOJ could use to prove that he was personally responsible for retaining the records.)

17/ 13 boxes or containers seized by DOJ contained documents with classification markings, and in all, over 100 unique documents with classification markings were seized.

DOJ notes that this is "more than twice the amount produced on June 3, 2022" in response to the subpoena.


18/ DOJ included this to highlight Trump's non-compliance with the government's requests and demands, and to underscore his efforts to conceal and keep the classified material even after the DOJ/FBI demanded the material's return and served a grand jury subpoena requiring that.

19/ DOJ also notes that among the TOP SECRET documents were documents that included "additional sensitive compartments that signify very limited distribution" that required FBI agents and DOJ attorneys to receive additional clearances before viewing them.

20/ DOJ also went out of its way to note that classified documents were found outside the storage room that the attorney (presumably Bobb) told them housed all of the documents.

They clearly want to show the court that Trump's attorney lied then and could be lying to her now.


21/ "That the FBI, in a matter of hours, recovered twice as many documents with classification markings as the 'diligent search' that the former President's counsel and other representatives had weeks to perform ... casts doubt on the extent of cooperation in this matter."

22/ The rest of the filing contains legal arguments that make clear Trump's request for a Special Master to review for "executive privilege" had no legal basis.

DOJ points out many times, as I have, that Trump is trying to assert executive privilege against the EXECUTIVE branch.

23/ They also note that the seized records were *not his* because the Presidential Records Act makes clear that those records are the property of the federal government.

(It is in that context that they noted that his property commingled with classified records is evidence.)

24/ There are many other legal arguments in the filing that I'm not going to discuss in detail here.

So what are some bottom-line conclusions that we can draw?

Here's an obvious one -- DOJ cares a lot about this motion, has the law on its side, and is fighting it hard.

25/ Perhaps the biggest news item is that the evidence of obstruction is more extensive than currently known.

The attorney who signed the false certification and made false statements to the FBI and DOJ has her own liability. But DOJ says there is other evidence of obstruction.


26/ That matters because it's a "plus factor" weighing in favor of prosecution here, in addition to being another potential charge and evidence of consciousness of guilt.

And as I said up top, it is apparent that DOJ is conducting a criminal investigation of Trump personally.

27/ DOJ also believes that, on top of the obstruction, they were misled (and unjustifiably delayed) by Trump's attorneys. In a typical case, that also would not weigh in the defense's favor when seeking restraint or a break from prosecutors.

28/ DOJ will be careful in this case, for obvious reasons. But it's apparent that they have Trump in their sights, and there is little question -- given the factual recitation in the filing -- that DOJ had ample justification to obtain and execute the search warrant. /end


Pic of classified documents recovered among Trump's personal items(Time Magazine cover):



What defenses do Trump and his cult have left? The declassification argument was never even made until after MAL was searched.... as I said, it's a post-hoc rationalization. Trump had some of these classified documents in his desk, among his passports. Others he had in boxes with his personal items. So the argument that he didn't know he had any of these documents is unmerited. Him and his attorneys misled DOJ about there being classified documents left, which could lead to an obstruction charge. DOJ dealt with Trump and his attorneys for months, they eventually subpoenaed the remaining documents, picked some up, and had evidence there were still documents left(which there were). DOJ obviously showed Trump deference, while Trump and his attorneys were uncooperative in many ways. This rebuts the claim that DOJ just showed up on Trump's doorstep one day to pick up White House menus.

Trump and at least one of his attorneys should be charged with multiple crimes.

This post was edited by IceMage on Aug 31 2022 05:34am
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Aug 31 2022 05:47am
Quote (IceMage @ Aug 31 2022 06:33am)
DOJ out with a court filing regarding Trump wanting a special master appointed. They respond to many of Trump's claims:
https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.flsd.618763/gov.uscourts.flsd.618763.41.1_1.pdf

Twitter thread on it:

https://twitter.com/renato_mariotti/status/1564821334579941376



Pic of classified documents recovered among Trump's personal items(Time Magazine cover):

https://i.imgur.com/wNPbYuL.jpg

What defenses do Trump and his cult have left? The declassification argument was never even made until after MAL was searched. Trump had some of these classified documents in his desk, among his passports. Others he had in boxes with his personal items. So the argument that he didn't know he had any of these documents is unmerited. Him and his attorneys misled DOJ about there being classified documents left, which could lead to an obstruction charge. DOJ dealt with Trump and his attorneys for months, they eventually subpoenaed the remaining documents, picked some up, and had evidence there were still documents left(which there were). DOJ obviously showed Trump deference, while Trump and his attorneys were uncooperative in many ways. This rebuts the claim that DOJ just showed up on Trump's doorstep one day to pick up White House menus.

Trump and at least one of his attorneys should be charged with multiple crimes.


As an independent, I don't think there is much to defend in regards to Trump having taken classified documents which he formerly had clearance for and securely stored. I'm wondering what is prosecutable here though? Also, what is the damage done?

Beyond that, the optics for the DOJ/FBI are at an all time low. We are on year 5+ of them literally filling in blanks to get to a pre-defined goal of thwarting Trump achieved. At times, they've even filled blanks in illegally. By the time DOJ/FBI actually achieves their goal, they will have lost any credibility they have left with the people merited or not by their sloppy approach.

This post was edited by RedFromWinter on Aug 31 2022 05:48am
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Aug 31 2022 08:39am
https://twitter.com/joshgerstein/status/1564974157514809352

Quote
Wording of grand jury subpoena for Trump records could turn out to be important: it asked for all docs marked classified in various ways NOT for classified docs. So, dubious Trump claim this was 'all declassified' wouldn't get him off hook for obstruction


Interesting.

So we have multiple reasons why, even if Trump's declassification claims had merit, it doesn't matter. It's National Defense Information, it's government documents, the documents were subpoenaed, and yet Trump and his lawyers still withheld them.

Open and shut.
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Aug 31 2022 09:15am
Quote (IceMage @ Aug 31 2022 06:33am)
DOJ out with a court filing regarding Trump wanting a special master appointed. They respond to many of Trump's claims:
https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.flsd.618763/gov.uscourts.flsd.618763.41.1_1.pdf

Twitter thread on it:

https://twitter.com/renato_mariotti/status/1564821334579941376



Pic of classified documents recovered among Trump's personal items(Time Magazine cover):

https://i.imgur.com/wNPbYuL.jpg

What defenses do Trump and his cult have left? The declassification argument was never even made until after MAL was searched.... as I said, it's a post-hoc rationalization. Trump had some of these classified documents in his desk, among his passports. Others he had in boxes with his personal items. So the argument that he didn't know he had any of these documents is unmerited. Him and his attorneys misled DOJ about there being classified documents left, which could lead to an obstruction charge. DOJ dealt with Trump and his attorneys for months, they eventually subpoenaed the remaining documents, picked some up, and had evidence there were still documents left(which there were). DOJ obviously showed Trump deference, while Trump and his attorneys were uncooperative in many ways. This rebuts the claim that DOJ just showed up on Trump's doorstep one day to pick up White House menus.

Trump and at least one of his attorneys should be charged with multiple crimes.


Note the "TK" classification marker on some of those documents. TK = Talent Keyhole, which is intelligence acquired by spy satellites or planes. And this stuff was just put in boxes along with framed Time covers.

https://twitter.com/ScottMStedman/status/1564841212338507776
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Aug 31 2022 09:20am
Quote (Sioux @ Aug 30 2022 10:13pm)
The peace and quiet of the right-wing chuds waiting for someone to tell them what their new spin is.


nothing has changed
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