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Dec 25 2011 12:31pm
Quote (Derkaderk @ Dec 25 2011 01:28pm)
You don't recognize how human psychology has advanced from natural instinct?

afk beating my rival clan to death and cannibalizing the dead


idk how far back you are referring to. Certainly primates have evolved throughout history.

But humans hard-wired psychology stopped changing when humans removed themselves from natural selection, and it will not change as long as we remain removed from natural selection.
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Dec 25 2011 12:34pm
Quote (impulse155 @ Dec 25 2011 01:05am)
So then stating that they would be bacteria or humans is completely inaccurate. They can be a species of ManBearPigs for all we know.
Thats the point I was trying to prove.





If you say looking at history, what diverts you from the fact that there wouldnt be another war, or some hostile encounter (enslaved, or just extinction)


You seem to have misread what I originally stated =/
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Dec 25 2011 01:01pm
Quote (kayeto @ Dec 25 2011 12:31pm)
idk how far back you are referring to. Certainly primates have evolved throughout history.

But humans hard-wired psychology stopped changing when humans removed themselves from natural selection, and it will not change as long as we remain removed from natural selection.


are you saying the brain stopped evolving?
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Dec 25 2011 01:22pm
Quote (Derkaderk @ Dec 25 2011 02:01pm)
are you saying the brain stopped evolving?


When humans removed themselves from natural selection, our evolution stopped.
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Dec 25 2011 01:36pm
Quote (kayeto @ Dec 25 2011 01:22pm)
When humans removed themselves from natural selection, our evolution stopped.


You think so?

http://www.futurefoundation.org/documents/che_pro_wrk5.pdf

I wish I could find the article detailing the data differences between the African, the European, and the American brain. I'll have to ask my friend about it later.
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Dec 25 2011 01:38pm
Quote (Derkaderk @ Dec 25 2011 02:36pm)
You think so?

http://www.futurefoundation.org/documents/che%5Fpro%5Fwrk5.pdf

I wish I could find the article detailing the data differences between the African, the European, and the American brain. I'll have to ask my friend about it later.


obviously there are differences

primates populated the whole earth before they removed themselves from natural selection

those differences are built in from when humans were still evolving.
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Dec 25 2011 01:55pm
Quote (kayeto @ Dec 25 2011 01:38pm)
obviously there are differences

primates populated the whole earth before they removed themselves from natural selection

those differences are built in from when humans were still evolving.


Okay, so the human brain has stagnated.

That's why we had a civil rights movement. That's why we had the Renaissance. There was the scientific revolution, the enlightenment period, organized religion is beginning to decline. We even had the Hippie movement. So remove the biology factor, and psychology is still changing (I still disagree that you can remove the biology factor). How do you reconcile racial differences? Do you dismiss them and claim them a fallacy? Do you not think there's a reason behind the overwhelming amount of African American athletes?

Do you honestly think that the way people think has remained constant since this "removal from natural selection"? Frankly, I feel it's obvious there's more to the human condition than biology. There's culture.
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Dec 25 2011 02:00pm
Quote (Derkaderk @ Dec 25 2011 02:55pm)
Okay, so the human brain has stagnated.

That's why we had a civil rights movement. That's why we had the Renaissance. There was the scientific revolution, the enlightenment period, organized religion is beginning to decline. We even had the Hippie movement. So remove the biology factor, and psychology is still changing (I still disagree that you can remove the biology factor). How do you reconcile racial differences? Do you dismiss them and claim them a fallacy? Do you not think there's a reason behind the overwhelming amount of African American athletes?

Do you honestly think that the way people think has remained constant since this "removal from natural selection"? Frankly, I feel it's obvious there's more to the human condition than biology. There's culture.


Obviously there's tons of factors which could change in many different ways. Culture is one of those things that could change. There are so many different ways it could change, thousands of novels could be written about all the possibilities. I never said otherwise.

Only thing I said in the beginning was that the hard-wired human psychology is won't change. It's nearly impossible to imagine humans regressing to the point of being subject to natural selection again.
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Dec 25 2011 02:03pm
Quote (kayeto @ Dec 25 2011 02:00pm)
Obviously there's tons of factors which could change in many different ways. Culture is one of those things that could change. There are so many different ways it could change, thousands of novels could be written about all the possibilities. I never said otherwise.

Only thing I said in the beginning was that the hard-wired human psychology is won't change. It's nearly impossible to imagine humans regressing to the point of being subject to natural selection again.


Oh well yeah. That's sort of been my entire point, and I feel like that indicates how humans will strive for a peaceful, co-operative interaction with aliens. I mean, trade is a huge part of our global system. I can only imagine capitalists wanting to get in on the intergalactic system as well. Besides, economics demonstrates how an effective trading system benefits both parties, so it'd be in our best interests to deal with them from a business perspective.
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Dec 25 2011 02:10pm
Quote (impulse155 @ Dec 25 2011 02:05am)
If you say looking at history, what diverts you from the fact that there wouldnt be another war, or some hostile encounter (enslaved, or just extinction)


impulse55 sees only part 1

Quote (Derkaderk @ Dec 25 2011 03:03pm)
Oh well yeah. That's sort of been my entire point, and I feel like that indicates how humans will strive for a peaceful, co-operative interaction with aliens. I mean, trade is a huge part of our global system. I can only imagine capitalists wanting to get in on the intergalactic system as well. Besides, economics demonstrates how an effective trading system benefits both parties, so it'd be in our best interests to deal with them from a business perspective.


you see only part 2


Look at the history of black people in America. It started out as a conflict and trended towards peace and tolerance. Same pattern with every encounter of unknowns involving humans. That pattern of behavior isn't going to change. Fearing what we don't understand is hard-wired into our psychology. But so is learning to be tolerant as we gain understanding. If you read Orson Scott Card's Ender series I mentioned earlier in the thread, he lays it all out pretty clearly.
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