Quote (ChantDownBabylon @ Dec 9 2009 11:58am)
Oh lol, nice guess bro.
I live in an apartment building in far Northern Estonia. Not many species to push out around here.
Your logic fails in so many levels.
WOW, how stupid are you not to realize that ANYWHERE there is a city/town/house/apartment land had to be cleared away. That in itself pushes out many species wether it is a frog, salamander, bird, worm, etc...
So in fact you HAVE "pushed out" many species just by living in your apartment
Quote (Kamahl16 @ Dec 10 2009 04:09pm)
This doesn't really fit this forum's criterion, but I would say it is ethical mainly because we provide for them in a humane manner when they are in zoos and we have a lot to learn from them which may eventually better their species and our own.
One of the best replies in this thread. Most zoo's are here so we can study the different species and learn how we can best co-exist with them.
Quote (ChantDownBabylon @ Dec 11 2009 02:19am)
Man is civilized and civilized people should realize that torturing animals for fun is not acceptable. We should live peacefully in a way that does not include exploding animals.
And yes man is omnivore, but that does not mean we can do whatever we want to with other species.
(we as a society don't usually "explode" animals)
I never saw anywhere in this thread were someone said "torturing" was acceptable.
I noticed you have a dog, do you think your dog likes to live with you?? Do you think dogs have been domestic since they were created?? Aren't you "exploiting" your dog by making it live with you because YOU want it to?? Do you eat beef, pork, fish?? Do you think any of those species started out domestic?? Did they live on farms since they were created?? You seem to be a little hypocritical to me.
Quote (indiadrummer @ Dec 21 2009 12:25am)
It's completely understandable that the hippie fucks on this website are gonna start crying about how unethical it is to "keep the poor little animals pent up". The truth is zoos
a) provide largely excellent care to the animals (assuming its not a shitty little hell hole).
b)preserve animals that would otherwise be wiped off the face of the earth.
and
c) don't actually depress animals to any extent. Most animals are NOT like us. They don't think like us, they don't have the same kind of conscience as us, and they certainly don't give a shit if their food is warm or cold. They just want territory, mating, food, and shelter.
Read the Life of Pi. It explains this all much better.
The best post in this thread by far with one exception. Some animals DO care if thier food is cold or warm, in fact most species (with the exception of scavangers) won't eat cold food, it has to be warm and moving for them to even HAVE a feeding response.
Quote (dGVdPSdT @ Dec 21 2009 07:54am)
Well, at the moment most well established zoos are using the following criteria:
Dead: Unhappy.
Alive: Relatively happy.
Dead is what a lot of the species would be without conservation programs.
The bolded part of your quote is the only true part of this statment. Most well established zoo's are creating more "natural" enclosures and have always worked on giving the animals in thier care the best care possible and have NEVER had the dead/alive criteria.
Quote (shem @ Dec 31 2009 08:53pm)
Also, I would hardly consider the diets of captive animals "dog food", or something of similar quality.
The fact of the matter is that most animals in captivity eat better than alot of humans do. They are fed what they would normally eat in the wild but are fed more regularly than they would be in the wild. Most wild animals eat on a feast or famine regime (sometimes they go a week or more without being able to catch food) where as in captivity they are fed everyday or every couple of days.
Quote (archie101 @ Jan 2 2010 09:31pm)
Let me explain any animals life in the wild.
WAKE UP.
FIND FOOD FOR SELF AND OR FAMILY.
PROTECT FAMILY.
FUCK AND HAVE KIDS.
DIE.
Basically Zoos provide a place where they dont gotta worry about shit. Just eat and relax all day. Kinda like the Caribbeans.
Correct for the most part, but, the animals in zoo's don't just "relax", they are provided with exercise and other stimuli, but yes, they don't have to worry about another animal farther up the food chain eating them.
I own a chinese water dragon and he is fed every day, given exercise, and taken to the vet for regular check-ups, and has a very large enclosure. He will live 10-20 years in captivity. If he was in the wild he MIGHT live 5 years if he was lucky. I don't think it is an ethical/unethical question really, there will ALWAYS be captive animals wether they are dogs, cats, lizards, snakes, etc..
What we need to ask ourselves is "what do we need to do to provide the best possible care to the animals in our care and how can we best preserve the natural habitat of the animals still in the wild".
We as a society will alway be encroaching on SOME animals habitat and we as a society need to find ways to minimize the damage we do to it.