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Jul 25 2009 04:44am
Solar thermal > all other technology.
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Jul 27 2009 01:16pm
Quote (01100110 @ Tue, Jul 14 2009, 08:13pm)
what do we do in 15?

TELL ME.


solar panels last a hell of a lot longer than 15 years I'm pretty sure, u just gotta dust them.



Even if they do wear out then we have 15 years to make new ones to replace them (we made them in 2 years, so why can't we remake htem in 15)
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Jul 27 2009 03:32pm
I think Wind may be better, or both combined.
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Jul 27 2009 05:31pm
"
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The following plan would solve all our energy, economic and pollution problems within a few years.

Declare war for solar energy: The President would make an executive order to build and install enough solar cells to supply all of the US energy needs in two years and we would probably end up doing it in one year. We were the people that even with millions of men out of the country fighting made one B-17 bomber every hour on an assembly line a mile long. Before the war, the factory that did it made cars with a few thousand parts. The four engine flying fortress that was ruling the skies over Europe had over a million parts. We were the guys that made a complete ship from start of finish in four days at just one shipyard. Women were doing a lot of the work. Imagine what we could do now?

We mobilize our manufacturing as we did for World War II to build a new free clean energy system. If we could do it during a war, we can do it in peacetime even faster. We form a war department to build it.


manufacturing? What manufacturing?? We still have that in the USA?

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]Mobilize for peace and prosperity: We build the mile long factories like we used to build planes and ships fast in Would War ll. We built the factories to build the planes and ships in just a few months and we could do it even faster now. We build them in different parts of the country that have high unemployment. These factories would be able to spit out miles of inexpensive solar panels everyday. Other companies would transport and install them in our counties deserts and on both sides of our interstate freeways, railroad tracks and on roofs. Putting them next to railroad tracks makes installing and cleaning easy.

Like laying track: We have competitions between companies and give bonuses to the companies that make the most and lay the most solar panels in a day. When we were building the transcontinental railroad, the companies were getting bonuses for every mile of track they laid. This motivated them to build many miles of track a day. We just do something similar for laying solar panels.


Problem: We need a LOT more silicon. The shortage in Si is one of the reasons they're so expensive currently. Also, they're doing this already in the midwest in a few states (the building solar panels along the roadways).

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We get our defense contractors involved in making it happen.

Pentagon: We get our pentagon involved in the war for free energy, just as we would do for a war. They have the organization skills we will need. It is why it was really created. The pentagon will be used to create a heaven on earth. We handle the whole thing like a military operation. If we do, we can do it fast.


The pentagon is not efficient. They'd spend $1 billion on red tape.

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We form thousands of companies to work on different parts of the system in different locations. We start with the thousands of miles of tracks we have in our deserts and other high sunshine locations and just go from there. At the same time, we install solar panels on every home and factory. Money will not be an issue. The government will supply the hardware and labor. We would be adding millions of watts of free clean electricity to the power grid everyday by installing miles of solar panels everyday. We would just keep doing this until the solar panels supply all Americas energy needs.


The government already has HUGE subsidies for Solar- the solar companies can barely keep up with demand in some areas. Right now there is a 30% federal tax credit and many states have $2-5 per watt off. To give you an idea a normal price is $7-10/watt, so they're already footing a huge amount of the bill as it is. Why dont you take advantage of this and do it yourself?

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At the same time, our automotive industry starts mass-producing inexpensive electric cars to use the inexpensive electricity we will be creating. They will also make natural gas and hydrogen cell vehicles. This will make the struggling auto industry start booming. When we wake up we will not spend billions retooling to make a different new car every year, we will just make minor improvements to a proven design. This will cut waste and costs related to vehicles in half. It will create more jobs, not less. Our total economy will start booming and so will the world’s economy, because they will starts doing the same thing with our help.]


Sure, lets just hand out tesla roadsters! Electric cars are not cheap yet- the batteries are tricky. It will happen naturally (go tesla!). Right now though, its still a LOT of money. Fuel cell cars are way off, and do you really want high pressure, very explosive gas in your car before the technology is there? Keep that in the buses for now... Lets hope that algae/non food biodiesel takes over in the interim. They'll still retool a different car every year- its what people want. Curvy one year, boxy the next- it makes them money.

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]On a smaller scale, we start developing and building the towers, geothermal, windmill and any other promising technology and down the road after we see what is most economical, we gradually replace the less efficient technologies. The government will provide large grants to any company developing promising energy technology and more efficient solar cells, such as nano cell technology.

We go full out on the solar cells, because we know we can do it now.

We just put less proven technologies on the back burner until after we have built a solar cell system using the current proven technology.


Geothermal less proven?? Ever heard of Iceland? Know anyone with a heat pump?

We're doing a lot of this now, with government subsidies. Encourage your politicians to support it, do your part and let it happen naturally. A crazy amount of technologies are being developed as we speak- no reason to screw them over by doing all of this now. If you want to get the whole country doing something why not have them reinsulate their homes, build more efficient roofs, cut water use, use efficient windows. Subsidize solar and just let it pick up (it really is!). In a few years we'll have dye sensitized solar cells which should be much cheaper and more efficient.

Not to mention if you did this you would KILL the rest of the high end electronics industry. High grade Si is not cheap, and the faster of a processor you want the more we need.

Solar thermal is also a nice option that needs a little time to become popular (its catching on fast though, power day and night definitely helps)- the efficiency is great and you can use the hot water as well. And whoever said 2% efficiency is off by a lot. PV is around 19.5% now for affordable, commercially available mono-Si cells. They have lower efficiency poly-si and thin layer sheets, but they're also much cheaper and even those are at 7-10%.

Seriously though, just let it happen... there is not ONE solution- there will be many
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Jul 27 2009 07:17pm
We have to go full out on solar, because we have the technology for it, and we know it will work. We have to do it fast, or we risk going to the point of no return by destroying the environment. It is necessary, and when we wake up, it will be the obvious solution. Read the rest of the section in that book and you will see what I mean.
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Jul 27 2009 07:50pm
Quote (Thor123422 @ Mon, Jul 27 2009, 03:16pm)
solar panels last a hell of a lot longer than 15 years I'm pretty sure, u just gotta dust them.



Even if they do wear out then we have 15 years to make new ones to replace them (we made them in 2 years, so why can't we remake htem in 15)


its true, the probes on mars uses solar panels and it is still running =)

just needed to be dusted off, by Mar's wind

edit- but then again Mar's doesn't really have weather, so think about earth with it's weather and how it affects the panels which are unprotected since it needs to absorb light from the sun etc

This post was edited by boisssy on Jul 27 2009 07:51pm
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Jul 30 2009 05:42am
Quote (boisssy @ Mon, Jul 27 2009, 08:50pm)
its true, the probes on mars uses solar panels and it is still running =)

just needed to be dusted off, by Mar's wind

edit- but then again Mar's doesn't really have weather, so think about earth with it's weather and how it affects the panels which are unprotected since it needs to absorb light from the sun etc


They use tempered glass to protect the panels. I'm pretty sure some of them could handle golf ball sized hail without any damage to the photovoltaics.
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Jul 30 2009 12:13pm
Quote (DivineGod @ Wed, Jul 15 2009, 11:10pm)
Solar pannels are around 2% efficiency just so you know...


In 1970 maybe, Republican.

They are up between 20 and 40% now

http://www.renewableenergyworld.com/rea/news/article/2006/12/solar-cell-breaks-the-40-efficiency-barrier-46765
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Aug 6 2009 10:55am
This is scary imo.
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