good to know this is still goin strong

god i miss lod

don't like the build too much, i prefer to use more ias, less points in cs/syns for something that will do negligible dmg vs people with res anyway, cta bow so you get more skillers (if teams, faith is good, but it's pretty marginal damage still), and use more +skills in general because 82k won't take a decent char down to 1life...

my build:

20 poison, plague, 1 cs, 1 lf, 1 pierce (very good), 1 valk, 1 ga, 1 multi, 20 avoid, 18 evade, 10 dodge

seems pointless to have this much d/a/e, it's ofc nice to have the extra %'s, but the other options aren't good either:

ga -- more skills here doesn't improve damage much at all
cs -- 3k cs damage is not good for anything but finishing 1 lifers anyway, so 800 cs is fine (and lf or ga or multi are better finishers for 90% enemies) -- you absolutely SHOULD expect the opponent to have max resistances and at least gm sorb (tgods)
lf -- very marginal improvement, still won't be enough damage to do much

4k life (no prebuff) -- not sure what the life is for this guide
13 frame tele
97k plague (104k with trangs)
112k poison (120k with trangs)
57/70/60 d/a/e <- +10% all is significant
90 ias jav (very important because you won't get javs off without ias sometimes even though it looks like you did bc dodge animation doesn't usually display) -- also much faster LF... the phys dmg on titans doesn't make much difference
75% block
80/75/75/50 res (no anyas) -> treks for pr... rarely see other poison chars, not too worried about losing 6% block by not using waterwalks because rabies druids aren't likely to hit me, weaker poison hybrid bowas aren't scary, venom doesn't hurt much
105 frw

items (<-- extra gears)

rare circ -- 2zon, 20fcr, 30frw, 17dex, 2x 15ias/15res'd
craft amu -- 2zon, 20fcr, 6str, 59life, 12mana, 7% mana regen
6/40 jav
enigma
stormshield -- 7fhr, 9dex, 8@res, 37lr jewel spirit monarch (extra fcr bp and skills when don't need block)
3jav/20ias gloves trangs
ravenfrost bk ring
rare ring -- 10fcr, 20str, 15dex, 24lr, 29fr
arachnid's mesh tgods
waterwalks treks, 30frw/res boots for stack, infernostrides (hotspur bm where i usually duel, but the 30frw is nice anyway)
cta matri bow faith matri (7 fpa with my ias -- 735-1575 ga), hand of justice + stormshield (max block + holy fire to kill 1lifers)
java lifer gcs
20/5res sc's + a few 20/11 fr sc's

and stack res gear is obvious

tops out at 140k poison, 121k plague w/ 100 fcr bp

not too sure why so many people think kb is so useful here, it's really not... most chars tele, paladins charge, barbs don't get kb'd in ww, so all kb can possibly harm is bowas and fury/rabies druids, which aren't hard anyway

82k poison doesn't take 6800 life...

what's the physical damage on lf? about 2k? this actually helps vs 6k+ life barbs? then even 4k light dmg reduced to under 200 life taken with 75 res (i expect this build has a little less than 4k light dmg, just looking for best case)

Looks like a troll build.

Lol no it looks real and could work..

IMO there are 3 ways of doing this: (build is still full psn, 1 ga, rest cs)

1) 45/45/20 fc helm, 2/20 amu, 4/30+/repl javs, 2/20 kb, fc ring, free sock in storm, faith shadow
7 fpa bow, 95 ias javslot, 68 fcr bp

2) 2/20/30/2 sox 15-15s, 4/30+/repl javs, faith mb, 15 ias in storm
7fpa, lower bow dmg, 95 ias javs, 68 fcr, more cs and psn dmg

3) griffon 15/15, cats/hl, 4/40/repl, faith mb, free sock in storm
7fpa bow w lower dmg, 48 fcr, 95 ias javs, more cs dmg, lower psn dmg

what's best? dno I've just tried the 1st build for like 1 day and I had 5 skillers lol, standard osama seems stronger ^^

pew pew


i nulled my vote cause i didnt see a realistic option

This post was edited by diglett on Jun 19 2011 09:32pm

theres a lot of inexperience showing its head, but at least those are workable builds. But no, knockback is dead necessary.
Stuff like



Is so very very wrong. The point of knockback is that it puts your opponent into a FHR animation every time it connects- interrupting them, same as mind blast or smite or high damage attacks.
With ranged weapons, you have a 1/2 penalty to damage to FHR, so you need to inflict 1/8 of someones HP just to have a 37.5% chance to FHR them with a guided arrow- not going to happen normally
With knockback, its 50% chance on every attack, whether its 10000 damage or 10.

The damage on guided arrows isn't really consequential. Its plague javelin that kills people- plague, cs, fury. But garrow and fury both need knockback to interrupt peoples teleports.
Hell, people teleporting is the whole reason knockback is awesome. Don't understand how someone can fail to notice that.


KB is dead essential to winning against barbarians. Thats the whole duel- trying to knockback them out of teleports as they go on top of you. If you can hit them with a chain of furies, it locks their teleport and likely sends them into a namelocked or long range whirlwind, and you instantly win the duel. Without knockback, they are free to bounce on top of you nonstop- they can just ignore your plague and out-DPS you. With KB, you can catch them with a chain of arrows when they're on your minimap, a chain of furies when they're closer range, and then interrupt them and have them get smacked by 5 arrows and 5 furies at the same time while they slowly whirlwind towards you, easy bait for fury & cs.


Stacking 140k poison just isn't necessary. I kill 7000 hp barbarians with an 82k plague, all you have in that build is a *pure* plague java with no other real attacks. 600 damage arrows shot at 15 FPA on a cta bow is just plain silly with no knockback. They can't damage anyone, they can't stun anyone, they can't do anything- they just put you at extraordinary risk. No sense using a CTA bow at all, just use a cta crystal sword and SS for all it matters at that point. This build uses a faith bow and never a CTA bow- cta in inventory or cube. Works great.


6/40 java or any rares with no physical damage are a complete and utter waste. The tiny bit of extra poison or lightning damage is no match for the high physical damage on 400/eth or eth titans. Lightning fury is probably your main attack on a damach zon, skimping on physical damage is like having a cracked short sword on an auradin- awful. Physical damage makes up the bulk of what you dish out to people, whether its throwing those chains at a BvC, locking down a wind druid, or hazing a Zon down at medium range. Hell, I don't think *any* zon should ever use a 6/40 unless shes a farcaster or a dodge-less cs vs cs only zon (which is a retarded duel). Ideally, you'd want 40% ias 400%+ ed eth rep +4 skills javas. But those aren't common- and titans are, and do a good impression. Any high ias build with no physical damage is not worth shit- skip those non-physical javs.



For those who missed out on the last 83 pages, we hammered out the finalized build- its not the same as the original post:




for why you need that extra bit of FCR, read this:
http://forums.d2jsp.org/topic.php?t=52434886&f=87

heck I think rabies druids are one of the only duels where knockback doesn't matter much (still does tho)
even vs paladins who charge you nonstop like smiters, its still incredibly handy (charger getting knockback'd an inch from you by a fury is instant death for him)

This post was edited by Goomshill on Jun 19 2011 09:59pm

honestly from the sounds of what you say...you duel complete idiots or just that awful of built characters...

goodfun's zon is much much much much much better



rabies druids cant teleport

you can ~ i dont see why you think kb is needed

This post was edited by diglett on Jun 19 2011 09:48pm

from what you say, it sounds like you haven't even played this game. or read my posts.
I can't imagine anyone competent losing to a zon who's only attack is plague javelin.

its not hard whatsoever to avoid. Without a meaningful fury, garrow or charged strike, people just simply teleport around your plagues and outrange you from a safe spot
What are you going to do, telestomp them with plague java?

This post was edited by Goomshill on Jun 19 2011 10:02pm

poison jav to hit them because you can throw lots, then go for a plague (or plague if they're about to telestomp you)... i don't typically telestomp plague

your GA/CS aren't meaningful either... 3k cs will do nothing vs tgods, and not much vs 75 res either... 500-2000 GA is completely tankable for a decent char (and yet i do have nearly the same damage + faster speed if i choose to use my faith)... the cta is for gm non-prebuff... it's used for ga or multi for 1lifers from a longer range than javas, i'm not spamming arrows with a slow bow...

maybe LF is decent, but i am guessing it's about 3-4k lightning and 1500 physical at most (lmk what it is), which is really very small damage for blockable physical and 1min lightning part... and since by far kb seems to be the most useful part, you can get that without all the points in it -- although 40ias jav throw is quite slow and they could just tele away rather quickly even if fhr'd, certainly not long enough to throw poison across the screen

you aren't going to interrupt more than 1 teleport in a row with 8 frame ga (and it's blockable)...

i just now plagued my friend's 7500 life barb with 83k plague and it left him with 400 life -- i typically use 97k dmg plague, but 140k is worthwhile vs necros because (1) ga does no dmg because of bone armor, (2) it drains them faster, (3) nn block, (4) more fcr helps here... if you get slow golem'd, really all of your attacks except plague are not going to be very useful

no good barb is going to namelock ww... and he certainly isn't going to be teleing from near enough that lf is easy to hit with to kb more than once in a row (particularly with <= 40 ias). if he's on your screen he should be on top of you or he shouldn't be there at all

same with chargers, i'm not sure why they're staying near you to get kb'd unless they've desynched to on top of you and you're being kb'd by charge or they're smiting... they should go in and back out quickly if they miss their charge