Quote (Bryant @ Oct 17 2010 04:09am)

Exactly why it's borderline useless.

Quote (MoXeR @ 19 Oct 2010 16:09)

Wouldnt it be better to use a feral/runic Chaos to WSM and a high dmg fools of any claw typ ( ofc with 3 ls and maybe 2 sin mod) ?
Ofc the Fools wont hit the same dmg like the Chaos but its has a better chance to hit since the ar boost only counts only on the fools claw.
Imo this would deal more dmg and we also have a bigger pool of claws to choose!!

True / False? and why!

btw I actually read every single post in this tread so plz give me a satisfying answer
thx

E: Im on euscl and we have no gclaws! Keep that in mind when reading this.

Quote (MoXeR @ Oct 19 2010 12:09am)

Wouldnt it be better  to use a feral/runic Chaos to WSM and a high dmg fools of any claw typ ( ofc with 3 ls and maybe 2 sin mod) ?
Ofc the Fools wont hit the same dmg like the Chaos but its has a better chance to hit since the ar boost only counts only on the fools claw.
Imo this would deal more dmg and we also have a bigger pool of claws to choose!!

True / False? and why!

btw I actually read every single post in this tread so plz give me a satisfying answer
thx

E: Im on euscl and we have no gclaws! Keep that in mind when reading this.

Quote (Soka_Gakkai @ Oct 19 2010 08:40am)

if I am not wrong after reading the guide, the reason is because in order to gain the full ar mods on fools for ww, fools has to be on the primary side. But in co-junction with traps laying speed, wsg works only if runics/feral is on the primary side and suwayyah on secondary. Which boils down to no other option than to only choose runics/feral for fools and suwayyah for chaos.

Quote (Sa_Se @ 21 Oct 2010 19:42)

Hi, i would like to know your opinion about the usability of the right claw

Usable Dmg Claw ? Good vs Necs / Sorcs ?

I am not owning the claw, but i could get it

http://img689.imageshack.us/img689/5324/sindr.jpg

Quote

myfryhole: that rules that you did that.
did do the variation of 2x um vs 1x um and cruels?

Tails chao: I'm not really sure where to begin on that, too dependent on the factor of how long you whirl for, your chance to hit etc. :/

myfryhole: maybe it would represent best in damage per second with ar variation neglected for the time?

Tails chao: Remember, Open Wounds lasts for 8 seconds. DPS would work to an extent but it means nothing when you're still whirling them after OW procs, since you're almost guaranteed to activate it again in those 8 seconds and be doing the exact same open wounds damage as you would with a single Um rune.

Also, you probably already know that OW is highly useful against Smiters/hdins etc, in those cases you usually won't be hitting with whirl for a whole second. I think this one's more up to preference

Azn Masta: its a little hard to generalize, but heres how i looked at it:

openwounds is most useful vs sorcs and amazons
brute power is most useful vs characters like other sins/barbs/pallies/druids/ and necros (to break bone armor faster)

regarding it this way, i find that having a more powerful ww and with 25% ow from each claw is sufficient enough a sacrifice to get that extra 300ed or so from cruel's mod. you are trying to compare a ratio that if worked would be the same for 25% and for 50% vs 100% more damage PER hit check. 25% openwounds is still openwounds and thats still a decent ratio considering ww hits like 4-5 times or so. Brute power on the other hand will be applied with every hit check - so as long as you are pounding your opponent down, it will be more effective than bleeding them.

unlike a ghost, your hybrid will also have traps that can be used either offensively to attack/stun or defensively to chip away your opponent's like and force them to attack you (like how rabies or openwounds works).

Because of that reasoning, i find that 1xum + cruel's mod would actually be more effective vs a larger range of opponents than having 25% more openwounds with dual ums in a weaker claw. After all, against sorcs and amazons, you should beat them anyways regardless of which claw and when you actually need the power, it will be there should you choose to have the one with the cruel mod.

Basically try something like this
claw: fools mod/150+damage/3light sentry/kb in a feral or runic eth + self-rep?/ eth + 2sockets

imo having 5+ sin skills (2sins and 3base ls) with 100+ damage is the most important thing u can have on a hybrid sin's fools claw.

damage is nice, but u need a balance of both. otherwise, u might as well use a ghost sin.

Quote (kevintheripper @ Oct 17 2010 03:38am)

btw for hybirdsins..do u use dlfight? it has a 1 second lag which makes it kind of useless

Quote (Tails chao @ 21 Oct 2010 23:51)

I rate OW a lot higher than I used to, I 100% recommend any open sockets you have in a claw to be full of Ums. I would rate it: Cruel's>Um>Lo in priority order on a claw, that's ignoring +ls/ias/base claw type etc, just the whirl damage boosts.

OW pierces ES, bone armour, it makes it harder for your opponent to rep and it's passive damage. Most importantly, it's significant passive damage.

In any case that claw is too slow lol.

Quote (Soka_Gakkai @ 21 Oct 2010 16:02)

I see where you are coming at.

I'm playing @ west nl now, pubs generally pot red like no tomorrow, and town if you're not fast enough. I don't think um's or ow is the best strategy over there. It's best to have attacks that's fast and locks the enemy well, and have also able to bite a huge chunk of life in one go, for exampe a good tri-ww lock with phy-dmg claws, this way, they will not be able to red pot efficiently. They have no excuse to rejuvenate also because it will give others a good reason to do so.