you won't buy anything w/ that post count.

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Also, ``

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We both know thats not how bone spirits work. For duels against competent people, they are almost always flying in a straight line unless they're namelocked


Yes decrep can be a bitch, depending on what rules you consider GM or not. But even with golem recast, you're looking at an AMP damage'd necro against a BvC. If you penetrate his bone armor with even a single hit, hes a dead undead man.


1 pt zerk is enough for anything, dumping points into it was always silly. But yes, the sacrifice with my build is 1 ww instead of 20, but the damage is sufficient enough, and when the target is amped, its clearly dealing more damage than a normal BvC. Yeah thats the trade off, so the WW is slightly weaker than a pure WW bvc, but thats a matter of the build itself. After all, once a necro is amped, if I whirlwind him, hes dead. It doesn't matter if my ww is level 1 or 20 at that point.




And theres not a single barb I know that could go 99 to 1. You are completely exaggerating. Sure, there are barbs that with my current gear, I might go 1 to 9 against, maybe even 1 to 19. And thats pretty bad, but hey, thats better than a BvC would do, and thats with a budget build. Against an average BvB, I would go between 25:75 & 50:50. Against a BvB with equivalent gear, I would go 90:10, easy.

I think the main thing here is that you're really really underestimating the damage output of lacerators. Its easier for me to hit at a range with my lacerators than it is for a bvb to whirlwind me, thats purely a matter of mobility, and a BvC should easily win a mobility race. It doesn't make it easy by any stretch, but no BvB is going to win 100% of his duels against it.

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......and back in reality land, where people play barbarians and not supercomputer overlords that never make mistakes, I have a good fight against most BvB's, and some kill me. I can kill a good chunk of them with just outplaying them, and some outplay me. I think you're not taking into account that neither player is going to be *perfect*, but the throwbarb has an easier time hitting the whirlwind barb than the bvb has hitting the thrower. In a perfect duel, it would be a stalement, but with equally skilled, medium level players, a throwbarb can win eventually, even if its a hard duel for him

A BvC is made for killing casters, but they still have difficulty against max block/dr bone necros with clay golem & lots of fhr/recast/fcr. Isn't that necro a caster? Just because its named a BvC doesn't mean he automatically wins. Sure, a BvC still has a good chance vs a necro, and its not automatically in either classes favor, but hes not going to win just because he was made for killing casters, and a necro is a caster. A BvB is made for killing other barbarians that whirlwind, and that is something they are good at. They are not, however, made for killing other barbarians that use throwing axes or guided arrows. These are things a BvB would rather be a BvC for, for the extra fcr and leap and such.

And before you ask, I do ok against other BvC's, maybe a 50/50 draw. But this is purely because those BvC's tend to have 10000x my value in items (I'm using a 34/341 grief, 0 life from charms, etc). The very fact that I can go even with them is simply due to my amp damage advantage, so to speak. Otherwise, if I went pure BvC against them, I'd watch them rape the pantaloons right off me.

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Whos talking about warshrikes? I think you meant lacerators and that was a typo so I'll go with that.
No.
360 ammunition of lacerators that do between 500 and 27000 effective damage? In a naive interpretation, with deadly strike, they would do 1250 exact HP on average. Thats what, 5 hits to kill a tank of a barbarian? With a 1/8 chance to hit them, thats 40 ammo out of my 360. In reality its actually much lower, but its not 12x that, which is what you'd need for that to be true. But lets do some exact math here for a second.
500-4500 damage'
50% deadly/critical
33% amp

Now remember that after you amp someone, the next few hits are amp for free without needing to proc. So I think its only fair to say that for perhaps 50% of my hits I'll have amp up, even if it only procs at 33%. This is very easy to see in a duel, because my damage will start low and ramp up dramatically often, because after amp lands I'm dealing ludicrous damage. So lets just change amp to be -100% DR with a 50% chance, for sake of making the calculation easier. I think this is a pretty fair number.

So:
2500 average damage becomes 3750 average damage after DS
3750 average damage has a 50% chance to be 312.5 HP, and a 50% chance to be 937.5 HP
= 625 HP, on average.

So my average axe hit would take about 625 HP away. Now, compare that to a 7000 HP barbarian. Thats 10 hits (open wounds rocks socks even at 50% ranged penalty, remember)
So 10 hits, and we said a 1/8 chance to hit on a 'hit' axe. Thats 80 axes. Lets say I miss half my throws just because of a moving target. Thats still only 160/360 axes

Its true, I'll often run out of lacerators dueling against barbs, but heck, I usually start those duels with 40-50 quantity on each axe, and thats because I've already dueled them a few times already. If I did a single duel starting at full ammo I'd never run out of axes. But hey, you're right that its a pain in the ass when you run low on axes because its BvB. But I keep 2x non-eth lacerators in my stash, too. hehehe Problem *solved*