haha yeah a lot of ppl seem to bee but im working on changing that Btw theres no way you can do 8.3k all physical damage :-p

I like the build dude, theres a few things i'd want to change, but in general, i like it

I think another helm other than coa would work nicely, since coa has high as hell strength req

This post was edited by donieb7 on Mar 6 2008 09:56pm

This Deserves Sticky

Psn is a big NO on zons.

I am not sure how vita zons fare as there are very few of these on us west nl. I am myself a bvc player, I would like to know how you kill a barb with 2x doomz when your zon don't even have max block.

The damage between 8fpa and 7fpa is a lot. Bow zons do not do a get ready 3-2-1 go duel. They spam ga's long before she allow the person to get near to her. On paper, the difference between 3.1 arrows/sec and 3.5 arrows.sec max not be too great, but when you let her spam for 3-4 secs, it is a lot of difference.

I personally do not have problems with zons firing at 8fpa. If you want to go vita, i suggest you to use mat bow instead.

This post was edited by Soka_Gakkai on Mar 6 2008 10:55pm

honestly if you can stand there and outtank a trapper the trapper needs to delete asap...5x traps on you + stun from mindblast + dodges will make it so you shoot MAYBE once every second, the whole time you are taking 12k+ traps up the ass. and if your reply is 'just put on tgods and a wisp' then i will laugh heartily when you get ganked by 5k+ fireblast and 1k-1.5k wake of fire. the only way you have a chance vs sins is to not let them get a lock on you.

same deal for necro- they nl tele on you and start spamming spear on you, you get locked, and you cant shoot them due to a glitch with guided arrow. this is where you need either javalins to light fury or wsg to get out of the dodge/stun lock. a good nec just chainlocks and you never have a chance to hit

a decent ele druid will toss out a bear that will take the 2-3 hits from your low damage ga's and do the same as the necro, recasting bear when necessary. the way to beat druids is strafe honestly, their fbr is shit even with a stormshield out, and since they are minion stacking you will get all your arrows off right onto them and pierce your way through. or you can use fury to kb them off of you, same with the necro

barbs will just hop on you and tri-whirl, keeping you either dodging or being hit, getting smacked by a barb with grief/beast on hurts no matter what, especially vs 3-3.5k life 30 dr chars. if they toss a stormshield on or are a bva, then you really get fucked because now you are getting blocked as well as locked. here's where you need a jav switch. you get mb, max dr, and a 4k+ physical damage attack. yes its less than your arrows damage, but you dont have mb max dr with your bow out do you?

zvz dueling when you get on that zons screen and nl her, you will get nl'd as well, and the other zon will be shooting faster, doing more damage, and putting you into fhr animation, not to mention she may just wep switch, charge you, SM you, and then run away laughing while she pounds the fuck out of you from half a screen away and you cant do jack shit because a) you're slowed ga's arent going to hit her, you just became a sitting duck and you cant charge her and jab her ass to death now cuz you dont have javalins on switch

this build has a ton of flaws, and before you ask, ive built glass cannon, vita, and variations of dex/vita hybrids. best one i found so far is 65% dex 35% vita, gives you over 1500 life with decent charms.

a short list of problems i see other than dueling strategy listed:

stacked resist: you're a zva, yet you dont have jack for stacked resist. use 5frw/5res scs, that way you gain a LOT of resists while keeping the frw necessary for a bowa to be viable
lack of switch options: theres nothing wrong with using a cta most of the time. but a good portion of the time having javs on switch with jab/light fury/light bolt available to you is majorly useful.
low frw: yeah, you're a tank, but tanks die if they arent able to get the hell out of a bad situation quickly. i would use minimum 125 frw on a bowa, imo 80-100 is too low for a hld bowa
helm choice: ever hear of a rockstopper? you may consider trying that one out, and it will save you quite a bit of str to use one



another thing, zvz isnt team dueling, zvz is 1v1 zon versus zon. bo isnt allowed in most zvz for a few reasons, the biggest of which being the incredible amount of time it would add to zvz matches. if every zon in there had 3k+ life and lower damage, and were participating in duels that are for the most part defensively oriented with the focus on long range, invisible attacks, the amount of time it would take to complete matches would be increased by a metric fuckton. not only that, but 'league' dueling like that has set rules by those who host the tournaments, or those who duel together for fun on a regular basis, and its based on their choices and observations as to what makes the matches the most fun. if you think 3 hour zvz battles with 10 timeouts per player for arrows is fun, make a tourney full of vita/bo bowas. its just the majority of people who do zvz use rules that they have used since they started doing zvz, and they enjoy it. if they had a problem with it, they wouldnt do it anymore, i assure you.

i like this... very well thought out

ty, PM MrBommel and tell him that, i would love to get this added to the sticky forum.


You're an idiot if you believe psn cancels critical strike. It has been tested by myself 3 times and by numerous people on this site and others who have debunked the myth. Its an old myth that has stuck around for far to long!



Dual wielding barbs go down easy as they have no shield. Just shoot and manuver. Like so many people you are mistaken when you assume i can only take one hit. Lets not forget with high passives, mass life and dr she can tank liek a barb Only chance they have is if they are using a doom z even then that lowers their dmg when compared ot botd for example so it takes longer for them to kill me. Btw no barbs ever use 2x doom, 1 is more than enough to do the job.



For mat faith with 50%
3.5 * 33.5 = 117.25 per sec
For gm faith with 50%
3.1 * 43 = 133.3 per sec
(avg dmg values taken from the arreat summit)
as you can see, the gmb shoots slower but still its dmg per second is greater.







Rock stopper? lol, this isnt 1.08. I think its time to move onto better items.

Strafe blows 90% of the time because you get locked into position shooting and unless u get some good hist in they will jump you. Also bad in pub games where someone might sneak up behind you. You need to be able to run at a moments notice.

What do you mean i dont have jack for stacked resist? my zons resistance add up to 120+ if you ignore the 75% cap. Even without perf gear they would be in the 100+ range. Keep in mind i have 7x 20/5s, this was missed when i typed up the original build but is corrected on page two.

"125 frw on a bowa, imo 80-100 is too low for a hld bowa" Just as you said, its just your opinion. So How can an opinion be a flaw in the build?

Like you said, "people who do zvz use rules that they have used since they started". They are set witht heir old ways and refuse to move on, thats the only real reason BO is not allowed in tourney 1 on 1 ZvZ duels. However, in team tournaments its allowed, why? because without it a zon wouldnt stand a fighting chance. And yet people duel pub games without it and wonder why they get owned.

This post was edited by Spartikis on Mar 6 2008 11:43pm

old ways? it's to prevent 4 hour duels caused by 4k damage, 3k life zons with 40+ life replenish.

the whole guides an opinion, so how isn't it a flaw?

well if i have an opinion on something and someones opinion is different that is fine. But its not a flaw in my build or my guide, its just an difference in opinions. Therefore my guide or no one else guide can really be flawed if you are just looking at the opinions. Certain subjects have facts to back them up. Like break points are facts of the game, they are set at certain percentages based on the items you wear. But deciding which break point to use would be an opinion.

This post was edited by Spartikis on Mar 7 2008 12:03am