General question; would a trap sin who dumps all remaining points into mb be better than one who dumps all remaining points into fb?



So basically I have to avoid spirits while moving in until I can get directly on top? If I can't effectively get traps down or mb the necro before moving in should I just dclaw stomp (ghost) or fb stomp (trap) once I get on top? Or should I wait till I can effectively stun them with traps and mb before moving in?



So I'm guessing mb is the key to the match-up, and since hybrid sins never have more than a 1 point mb it kind of rules them out?



Don't you mean a good trapper or ghost? Thought it was all generally agreeable that the hybrid was the least effective.



iso serious discussions

I would say a pure Trapsin would be the most effective built
Playing defensivly but also not letting the necro haveing enough time to spam millions of bone spirit at you!

max mb or at the very least extremely high mb works best.



Remember that being on top is only safe when you have your Shadow Master, if you blindly fb stomp without your master you'll get absolutely raped by wsg spear. As long as you're close enough to namelock them you can walk spears (just side-stepping them and laying a trap right after), don't sit there staticly while spamming mb on a namelock unless you got traps to support it. If you've forced a nec to wsg out of a traplock then you can be much more aggressive with your namelocks/re-locks.

Ghosts can just tele on-top, master eats spirits while they dclaw a nec.



it helps a shitload because a sin that can't chase a nec as well will have a much harder time. hybs have low mb AND 65 fcr. :x

Before I sold her, my hybrid sin never had any trouble with necros.

http://forums.d2jsp.org/index.php?showtopic=17012798&f=87&st=0 got this from right here


high mb = best.
keep master up
circle in. Do not go straight in
use walls/etc to avoid a train or if your being followed to kill the spirits.
use combo of wof + ls


Ghost
dclaw
triwhirl if you a ghost (riskier if you arent good at whirling)
vita = dclaw chain = ez'd. Max block low dr = dclaw/ww Max block max dr = hit and run. Force the wsg for playing a mix of offensive/defensive without giving them range advantage (saying dont consistently stomp)

trapper
trapper = fb lock --- 1.5k + will kill him eventually. Higher the better. Chain!!!!!!!
fb + master = no traps needed but make sure swirlies
Without master... You need to recast if possible, if not, use ls range until you can recast. Or just tele away (but beware of ibs)
if they wsg/avoid traps. Just anticipate and trap ahead of them and regain lock.

Best build vs them imo from d2pk.... 8k+ ls, 500 fb, ghost ww (minus 7k ar but i still hit 10k+), high venom, max mindblast, 1 wof/dclaw

yeah i forgot to mention to force mb necs into wsg situations when using ghosts, since you can hurt them badly with 25% block.

well


a lot of people say "for 1v1 dump your rest points into FB (or max fb rest syns) with lvl 1 mb, and for team dueling go with max mb".

i have played both in 1v1 and even if a high fireblast is nice to have i still think that a maxed mb sin is better overall even in 1v1s.
the reasons for that are that one the one hand that fb becomes much less effective if your opponent uses hotspurs (if gm) or 85FR. this surely doesnt make it bad at all but it still makes you do significantly less damage.
maxed mindblast has several positive aspects. first of all it will make your sm mindblast much more often which is obviously very nice (there has been enough talk about that lately). then it also deals actual damage. on my trapper i achieved a lvl42 mindblast i think with all +skills and mods from claws (should do something about 250 physical damage) and over time this can add up. plus it's helpful to have a high MB stun duration (swirlies) even if this is not the most important thing.

against some opponents, e.g. barbs and paladins in general, fireblast is usually not really worth using while a maxed mindblast helps a lot. and i wouldnt even say that a max mb is worse against casters compared to fb build since it really makes you better at chasing. i liked to have a umum fools against slippery casters to deliver ow with lvl1 base DT which makes up a bit for the missing fb damage (not everyone likes kicks on trapper but try it if you like).
oh and a lvl1 base fireblast is still worth using definitely for stunning/tanking purposes and does even deal some damage 1.5k-2kish or something).



meh i guess it's still preference and i do like playing fb/ls trappers too, but i think if i played a league or so where i want to most effective build to win the most matches and assuming that my opponent will do anything possible (as far as allowed by the particular gm rules) to win (in terms of equipment and playstyle) a maxed mindblast build is what i would want to play.
and on a sidenote it means you dont need another character if you want to do team duels.

I agree on most of this

Kicks are indeed nice. Im just using fury on my trapper. Never really used fools, but the ar is indeed a bit low, 3kish or so

I agree that fireblast is totally useless against barbs, but I believe it has some used against paladins.

Vs hammers you can actually stomp them if you get the opportunity(you need trapsupport though), or you can use it to tank them when they try to telestomp you. I use fireblast vs hammers even on 1fb build, but when I tried higher damage fb builds against hdins, it was pretty cool. You can also fireblast on your foot against smiters when using c/c switch, but I'd say maxed mindblast is overall better. I'd probably take maxed mindblast over fireblast vs hammer as well, but fireblast has some uses in that matchup as well

And yes, maxed mindblast is pretty cool against casters as well, although fireblast is probably better vs necros (at least most of them)

Having maxed mindblast is overrated in this matchup imo, partially due to the fact that bone armor eats it up. The increased duration is nice, but not a huge necessity imo.

You completely missed the biggest point to it and you say it's overrated lol