Quote (ZPureHate @ Aug 25 2023 07:56pm)
If you’re trying to proc ow as a hybrid or spider 4 frame better. You roughly do 1.5k more with a wf/suw vs runic… 1.5k x10 vs getting 2 more hits which at most is roughly 8k extra dmg…
Reason why all the top ghost run this combo
Well, lets check.
Here is an build with guillaume and runic, 50% DR, max res, 48fhr, 65fcr, 9fpa traplaying and 4fpa wirl even when 10% slowed.
One can use feral and still have max wirlspeed vs 10% slow, but will not reach 9fpa trapllaying then.
https://maxroll.gg/d2/d2planner/do010yilWirl damage:
Runic:
Physical: 1802 average (critical chance included) DPS = 1802 * 6,25 = 11262,5 DPS (Vs 50% DR = 11262 * (1-(50/100)) = 5631 or 1802*(1-(50/100)) = 901
Poison: 2728 average ------- 2728 * 0,17 * (1-(PLR/100)) * (1-(PR/100)) ------ 2728 * 0,17 * (1-(-100/100)) * (1-(75/100)) = 231 over 0,8 seconds. 231 * 1,25 = 289 DPS
CB: 50%
OW: 10%
Chaos:
Physical: 1477 average (critical chance included) DPS = 1477 * 6,25 = 9236 DPS (Vs 50% DR = 9236 * (1-(50/100)) = 4618) or 1477*(1-(50/100)) = 738
Magic: 366 average -------- 366 * 0,17 * 6,25 = 387 dps
Poison: 2728 average ------- 2728 * 0,17 * (1-(PLR/100)) * (1-(PR/100)) ------ 2728 * 0,17 * (1-(-100/100)) * (1-(75/100)) = 231 over 0,8 seconds. 231 * 1,25 = 289 DPS
CB 50%
OW: 35%
Okay, so lets say we duel a barb who has 50% DR by some stupid reason, 75% PR and no block, 7000 life.
Since CB is at 50% we assume for easy calc that 1 claw always hit CB and one does not.
To make it easy we just say that first hit is at frame 0 and next hit is at frame 4. Both claws attack at the same time.
We also dont use hitchance formula in this example. To much to write etc...
Hit 1/Frame 0: CB acts first: 7000 - (7000/10*(1-(50/100))) = 6650 life left
Hit 1/Frame 0: claw 1 physical 6650 - 901 = 5749
Hit 1/Frame 0: claw 2 physical and magic = 5749 - 738 - 62 = 4951
Hit 2/Frame 4: CB acts first: 4951 - (4951/10*(1-(50/100))) = 4703
Hit 2/Frame 4: claw 1 physical 2901 - 1802 = 2901
Hit 2/Frame 4: claw 2 physical and magic = 2901 - 738 - 62 = 2101
Hit 3/Frame 8: Cb acts first: 2101 - (2101/10*(1-(50/100))) = 2091
Hit 3/Frame 8: Claw 1 physical 2091 - 901 = 1190
Hit 3/Frame 8: Claw 2 physical and magic = 1190 - 738 - 62 = 390
Hit 4/Frame 12: CB acts first: 390-(390/10/2) = 370
Hit 4/Frame 12: Claw 1 physical: 370-901 = -531
Hit 4/Frame 12: Claw 2 physical and magic = -531 - 738 - 62 = -1331
Anyway. on frame 12 enemy is dead in this scenario. If i would count in the 3 fire damage output and the 2 cold damage output and the poison output that in sum is only 112 at frame 8. So only with successfull ow he would be dead at frame 8.
So you can min max this, if one is satisfied with 10fpa traplaying and use feral this enemy would be dead at frame 8.
One the contraditcing side war fist + suawaya will reach 5fpa wirl still if slowed by arach. But it will be at 12 fpa traplaying speed when 10% slow. And at 11 fpa traplaying speed with 0% slow.
Lets check:
Omg fuck it..
I forgot to make claws eth in planner. So i have been using to low damage all along xD Anyway:
war fist + suawaya will give you a high direct physical damage, at the cost of 4fpa wirl and at the cost of around 3-4 fpa traplaying speed. You will have less chance of triggering OW/CB/Psn/Magic damage.
Feral claws will have slightly higher damage than runics, at the cost of 1 fpa traplaying speed.
Runic talons will have better stack vs slow and always 9fpa traplaying speed.
fcr+Visio allows use of HL. Which gives you better ar which may be needed on chaos side espesially and also slightly higher deadly strike %, although one can use dual LO in runics if want. etc.
Guilaume adds CB, assas damage is very low so CB has better effect here. CB is ofc best vs high lvl enemies, the ones that assa struggle most vs. And CB is affected by DR%, but amplify damage helps it greatly if team duels or low dr chars. CB and Poison also has the positive effects of piercing bone armor and energy shield.
Anyway, if you want to go indept you should set up each type in planner.
Then calc damage urself, cause is displayed in a bad manner on planner in my eyes.
Then you can check min max and how long time it takes to kill.
To be deadly excact it works like this:
Wirl:
If both claws has same FPA then both claw hit simultaniously.
Wirl will hit first at frame 2(or 4, cant remember xD), then each fpa frame after.
If its 4 fpa its like this: frame 2, frame 6, frame 10, frame 14 etc...
If its 5 fpa its like this: frame 2, frame 7, frame 12, frame 17 etc...
But i prefer to just use the first hit as "Frame 0" Cause easier to calc, this is what matters in difference anyway.
Physical: (AllMin+AllMax)/2 * (1+((CM%+Statbonus%+Wirl%)/100)) * 0,17 * (1-(DR%/100))
Poison: (Min+Max)/2 * 0,17 * (1-(PLR/100)) *(1-(PR/100))
PLR is -100 for players in hell, so if enemy has 75plr gear then he is at -25plr. Thats the value you should put in formula.
Fire damage: Fire damage from demon limb after res and pvp penatly etc you can use 3 each claw each hit.
Cold damage from raven: Use 2
CB is affected by player status and dr%. So its: EnemyRemainingLife/10*(1-(DR%/100)) (some say CB DR% caps are 0 and 100 instead of -100 and 100, but based on my test with CB its -100 as bottom cap).
Magic damage is: (Min+Max)/2*0,17 unless they have craft shield which they dont.
Then you can choose an enemy life, dr and resists.
Then set up each frame like i did. Frame 2 you can count as hit 1. Within this frame both wepons hit. You can end up with 2 claws having different fpa, then you must count them on different frames.
Anyway, this way you can check how fast you kill enemies based upon hits.
Ofc there is defense and block% as well which is relevant. OW and Poison becomes stronger vs them, since you will land less hits. As well as hitchance is very valid always, espesially vs high def chars.
So best practice would be to use those as a "effectivness %" which you multiply with. I would just use hitchance in math. So if ur hitchance is 63% then you can multiply result with 0,63, and if hitchance is 35% you can mulitply resuslt with 0,35. Block will be the same with every setup, so would not even include it.
Hitchance = 2*attakcerLVL / (attackerLVL+defenderLVL) * AR / (AR+Defense) ; Multiply by 100 to get in %.
Venom will usually be 0,8 seconds in hell, but its based upon PLR ofc.
0,4 * (1-(PLR/100)) = End duration. (Remember the -100 from hell, which is standard, example: 0,4 * (1-(-100/100)) = 0,8seconds.
There is 25 frames in 1 second in d2.
So 25*0,8 = 20 frames for a full 0,8 second duration.
This way u can include poison each 4th or 5th frame depending on ur FPA.
4/20*VenomDamageEndResult = answere for how much psn did after 4 frames.
This post was edited by gel87 on Aug 27 2023 06:22am
D2:R