hi i am left liberterian and i would like to know how you guys would comment Trumps speech about sweden?

Nothing spectacular happened that doesnt occur every hour in the US.

Just joke of a president

>liberterian

From my understanding he has said "that something happened in sweden last night"

which was incorrect, cuz nothing dramatic happened here that night.

He then later explained that it was a reference to the fox news that aired the night before
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=325&v=OSzjfAMk-RI)

Which is an interview of the documentarymaker Ami Horowitz and views pieces of his doc he made here in sweden a while ago.

He also, just a few hours ago said on Twitter:
"Give the public a break - The FAKE NEWS media is trying to say that large scale immigration in Sweden is working out just beautifully. NOT!"

What, more specific would u like to have commented?
there are many things to be said - and many things claimed by both trump and horowitz
if u formulate questions i will try to answer them the best i can

This post was edited by BraSma on Feb 20 2017 12:18pm

He's right about the situation though..

Murders with automatic weapons every other day. Rapes, theft, burglary, welfare dependence all gone up a lot... Crimes gone up a ton in general. People are not secure in many areas.

It's not the same country it was in the 80's and 90's that I grew up in. Far from it.

This post was edited by Kosmos on Feb 21 2017 05:18am

Some false, some correct and some partially false.

Vet inte om du är svensk eller inte Kosmos, men jag skriver allt på engelska så TS kan hänga med.

1 -
Rapported Murders has indeed increased last several years 2014-
using of a gun as a murderweapon has also seen a slight increasing, generally speaking 2012 and forward

Tho the statistics does not show that it was better in the 90's. The latest statistic show that we are back to the same levels as it was then, after many years of decreasing
(https://www.bra.se/download/18.358de3051533ffea5ea7eaf8/1462804743722/2016_D%C3%B6dligtv%C3%A5ld_2015.pdf)
its in Swedish, but perhaps there are some sort of translation tool to be used. otherwise just scroll to see Pictures to get a clue

SUMMARY: YES, murders and deadly force trauma has increased last couple of years.


2.
Sexual crimes has increased (rapidly last years)
and there are reason to Believe that so has rape

to get the best Picture i Think it is best to use statistics where they have asked people (surveys), instead of watching rapported crimes. This gives u the best chance of eliminate the greyzone areas (people dont rapport crimes, etc)


(gathered and made by nationaleconomics proffessor tino sanandaji. Got from his fb page)

the marked category (in the top) specifies as "sex crimes" which includes a great deal of different types of crimes, just not rapes.
tho the study finds that approx 140 000 of these were concidered as "severe sexual crimes" ( rape or attempt to rape)
which was also a big increase from the year Before. This results are not definite, but gives a quite correct view of the situation and the current crimedevelopment

This also shows that personrån ("personal robbery", aka personal theft etc) hasn't really increased.
And misshandel (psysical abuse) has actually dropped and is the lowest in some time.
tho other categories has increased

this survey has only been made from 2005 and forward so the levels of the 90's and the 80's cannot be compaired by the same measures.

(https://www.bra.se/download/18.37179ae158196cb172d6047/1483969937948/2017_1_Nationella_trygghetsundersokningen_2016.pdf)

Summary: Yes, there are reasons to Believe rapes has increased.
Tho other categorys of crime has not, and has in fact decreased, generally speaking.

3. Social Welfare dependence is a quite broad field as it includes very many things, so that u will have to specify what u mean, and also show proof to that statement.


And to answer your question: yes im a total nerd xD
but it is my opinion that in times of many fake news and media-dominance it is very important to build opinions based on objective facts and statistics, as they mirrors the reality far more truthfully.

This post was edited by BraSma on Feb 21 2017 08:13am

Är svensk.

Jämför nu siffror mot säg, 1990...

2005 hade vi redan en hög andel invandrare från MENA länder.

This post was edited by Kosmos on Feb 21 2017 08:56am

Vilka siffror? Dödligt våld har jag visat dig siffror på.

Om du menar de andra så finns de tyvärr inte från NTU som går tillbaka så långt (vilket jag skrev)

Vad är din poäng?

Since i am alrady typing i guess i'll also adress the question at hand:
Is this development caused by immigration?

1. In the case of sexual crimes and rape i would say partly yes, there are proofs to support that theory.

latest study of immigrants and crimes was made 2005 (BRÅ) and showed that many out-of-west immigrants (Middle East and Africa, mainly) was overrepresentated in these crime categories.

We have since then been taken in huge amount from these areas (Syria (mainly), Afghanistan, Eritrea , etc)
Syria and Afghanistan, worldbank and FN (with different types of measuring) has shown that these
countries are in the bottom when it comes to equality.

It is then (in my Point of view) not very wrong to assume that this can have an inpact in the view of women and also can be a factor that contribute to sexual crimes.
Tho it is important to Point out that this is a VERY Little minority of the people that comes here.
And also u cannot Point the full increase of sexualcrime and blame ALL on immigration, because there are no evidence to support that fingerpointing. There are many other factors that can increase sexualcrimes.

But is it fair to say that it plays a part? I would say so.

2. The issue of increased murders, carfires and riots, crimes etc.

I would say that this mostly is a Product of BAD integration. Sweden as a society has not shown very great results in integrating many Groups and its caused a broad marginalization and people living outside of society.
We have the biggest gap in employment percentage if (according to OECD) when u look at immigrants vs people born here.
This ofc fuels gangactivity, riots and such.

So there is that, which do explain alot. The so called social-economic explanation.

Tho, u cannot explain it all with that theory, BRÅ claims. They made a calculation where they removed socialeconomic factors, and this showed that there is still a general overrepresentation in crimes.
might be due to the fact that out of west societies are not that similar to ours (and in majority cases war-zones), making it harder to addapt (thus, creating Culture-Clash)

--

Ami Horowitz Paints up a very dark Picture (but fails to give a wider Picture, and only Points in a certain direction. Which imo is wrong when u are dealing with very complex problems.)
He for example Points to the Islamic-terror attack we had.
fortunately no-one died in that one. The biggest terror threat tho, is not from islamistic fundamentals - it has rather shown that it is
NeoNazist-terrorism that is the biggest consern here as the majority of terror attacks here have had racist motives and background (Trollhättan, Peter Magns , and if u look to Norway, Breijvik)
Also Many neonazi Groups are on the uprise, a government study shows and have planned attacks on numerous refugee-homes. Which was fortunately stopped by police.