I'm still extremely interested in calculations and builds. I don't know why njaguar doesn't release the math formulas behind the game.

I've been thinking about stopping dex around 100-110 and putting the rest into strength and focusing highly on obtaining gear that feeds high lifesteal + critical strike

Hopefully the gear can also supply some kind of attribute like str or dex, but thus far, I'm trying to experiment outside of all dex or 120 dex.

Thats countered by massive crit overkills IMO. At one point I was keeping stats on chains using different amounts of dex (and thus str), and my counter got steadily higher the less dex I used (started at 120, and decreased by 5 every climb). But I never got passed the point of using less dex than str (the next climb would have been that point...but thats right when the ls nerf hit...so I stopped

I've always agreed with what your saying...all weapons have the same average damage, thus the same amount of dex and str should be used for every weapon, anything outside of this is purely preference. Hell, some people are just lucky mofos (Hi Ed ) and might just want to use more dex

This post was edited by Meeker on Feb 18 2009 05:06am

Isnt that just like saying a 400 meter runner is just as efficent as a marathon runner in a marathon?

You also have to take into consideration when dealing with weapon types the time your willing to spend testing..e.g. if your a slasher who likes to slash in short quick bursts of levels (2-3 games as apposed to 9 and 10 games) and your sword keeps hitting low hits while the guy with the axe is hitting consistently high your falling behind and if enough hits are over kill hits before the end of the level the sword may not have enough time to catch up to the damage of the axe which has always been hitting.

Again this time i'm blatently comparing weapons..but thats because he said its pure preference outside of same dex / str should be used.

In other words..lets say in a cata game we have two people with exact same builds and gear (stat / ee wise) one with a sword one with a axe we instruct them both to only click @ 1 second intervals and we know they are geared well enough to complete an entire level your sure within about a 5% margin of error that their damage at the end of each ones level (if one were to level before the other they would just simply stop clicking until other levels) their damage is going to be within a 5% margin of each other..or at least very similar to that percentage?

Doing this 3 times just to be sure it wasn't a fluke of course.

I would think luck would factor a lot into the sword build that could eithier give them a nice percentage above or below in most cases the axe user who doesn't have to factor luck into his build? Because with swords you must depend on luck for two things..one for the high crits as apposed to low hits..and two luck that your high hits when you do recieve them don't come when the monster is nearly dead and hence..it is overkill that doesn't get calculated.

I will always believe overall axes in a best out of 3 test like this will be the victor.

*In efficency...Swords have the advantage of being able to be used directly from feeder / sammy / pally and again on ninja. I can see why some people might prefer them for that reason..but in a sheer test of efficency..axes > swords Imho until i'm conclusively proven wrong..and it may be the exact opposite for other people..I'm just saying thats my opinion.

Which I know is not the point of this thread..just the point of my post versus his statement about preference being the only reason people choose certain weapons.

This post was edited by TheNextBestThing on Feb 18 2009 06:34am

long bump because I've been away
but as a reply to the last post

overkill will be made up for with underkill

suppose you have a 10-100 sword, 50-60 axe
for any number of health the monster could have, theyre going to even out
example: monster has 56 life left
you're going to kill it half the time with the sword, half the time with the axe
now we'll take 80
2 hits with axe
sword: 20% one shot, most likely 2 shot, x% 3+ shot
then take 30 health monster
1 hit axe
80% 1hit sword, somewhat likely 2hit, less likely 3+hit

so in one case you have 20% chance of being up a shot with sword, while in the other case you have a 20%chance of being down a hit with a sword

it evens out

and my numbers are shitty and not exact because I'm lazy
nn to point out that 30 isn't the right health for 20%, it's close enough and I'm tired, either way, there is a monster health that matches up to that and I win

This post was edited by jbpellerin on Apr 13 2009 10:01pm

I dont really understand why people say more dex for swords and less dex for axes. They both have same average damage, right?

Then why should sword build use more dex than axe build? You do hit crits with axe build too. With swords you can hit high crits, yes, but can't you also hit low crits? The average damage would be ~same then.

I just cant see why you would use different amounts of dex with different weapons when they still have the same average damage.
Using different build for different weapons just makes no sence to me since the average damage is same

This post was edited by tudey on Apr 14 2009 05:53am

very nice, took some time