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Jun 11 2012 04:14pm
Quote
someone clrearly didn't read this thread.

armor reduces ALL damage taken.
then there is physical resist which reduces melee attacks.


I'm not talking about armor you choch. I'm talking about % melee reduction in general on string of ears. I've been a contributor in this thread since it started. If we can verify it works the same as armor then great.

I am asking so I can add it to my theorycrafting spreadsheet (that I've been sharing with the community for some time now) so it works correctly in a verified manner:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Ak0hueccAWkpdFAtTFlSM29MUHktOS1JTzBCLVZFc0E#gid=4

This post was edited by fft_progressive on Jun 11 2012 04:17pm
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Jun 11 2012 04:24pm
Quote (fft_progressive @ Jun 11 2012 02:14pm)
I'm not talking about armor you choch.  I'm talking about % melee reduction in general on string of ears.  I've been a contributor in this thread since it started.  If we can verify it works the same as armor then great.

I am asking so I can add it to my theorycrafting spreadsheet (that I've been sharing with the community for some time now) so it works correctly in a verified manner:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Ak0hueccAWkpdFAtTFlSM29MUHktOS1JTzBCLVZFc0E#gid=4


As far as I know, damage reduce is another factor that's calculated for damage taken.

For example, Damage * (1 - % reduced from armor) * (1 - % reduced from resistance vs lvl) * (1- % melee/range reduction) = Damage Taken

Then Damage Taken - Damage Absorbed from blocking if block occurs = What we see on screen

edit: read it somewhere but can't find the article...

This post was edited by kddk0823 on Jun 11 2012 04:25pm
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Jun 11 2012 04:27pm
Is a good stormshield bis?
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Jun 11 2012 04:45pm
good lord all this is so much, i have so many different monk set ups to try.thanks for the info guys now i can live when i play in inferno.
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Jun 11 2012 04:47pm
Quote (Boiller @ Jun 11 2012 02:35pm)
% melee reduction is huge. On my current gear, 1% of melee/ranged reduction is the equivalent of 120 resists/1200 armor/120 vita


that's got to be an exaggeration, or some very, very fail math. how much resists/armor do you have?

----------------

Some maths on Melee Damage Reduction vs Armor --
tl;dr version: At a generous 7k armor and 900 resists, 1% melee damage reduction is equivalent to 97.23 Armor. (and by corollary -- ~9.7 resists) It's worth even less if your armor and resists are lower than that.

Maths below:

assuming attacker level is 63

DR = Armor / ( 50 * 63 + Armor)
DR = Armor / (3150 + Armor)

7k Armor

7000 / 10150 --> 68.96% DR

900 resists

RR = Resist / (5 * (attacker level) + Resist)
RR = 900 / (315 + 900)
RR = 74 --> 74 DR --> 74.07% DR

Total DR from Armor and Resists:
.3104 * .2593 = 0.0804 damage taken (~92% DR from resists and armor)

If you have 1% melee reduction thrown on top of this, you get:
.99*0.0804 --> 0.0797 damage taken (~92.1% DR from resists, armor, and melee reduction)

How much +Armor to get the same damage reduction? (not adding resists here because obviously you want to add armor in this scenario for maximum effect)

Working backwards

0.0797 = .2593*x
you want armor's reduction to be 1 - 0.3074 = 0.6926

.6926 = Armor / (3150 + Armor)
.6926 (Armor + 3150) = Armor
0.3074 Armor = 2181.69
--> 7097.23 Armor and 900 resists gives you 92.1% DR
--> 7000 Armor and 900 resists and 1% MRR gives you 92.1% DR

so at this gear level:
1% melee reduction = 97.23 Armor

This post was edited by irimi on Jun 11 2012 05:16pm
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Jun 11 2012 07:25pm
I have a question about life on hit: Does it proc (is that the right term?) multiple times if an attack hits more than one enemy?

ie.
Fist of Thunder - Thunderclap (or any 3rd hit of FoT for that matter)
Crippling Wave (specifically Tsunami for the 17 yards)
Deadly Reach

What about abilities? Like Exploding Palm? Lashing Tail Kick? Tempest Rush? Sweeping Wind? 7SS? Cyclone?
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Jun 11 2012 07:26pm
Quote (MrDictatoHead @ Jun 11 2012 09:25pm)
I have a question about life on hit:  Does it proc (is that the right term?) multiple times if an attack hits more than one enemy?

ie. 
Fist of Thunder - Thunderclap (or any 3rd hit of FoT for that matter)
Crippling Wave (specifically Tsunami for the 17 yards)
Deadly Reach

What about abilities?  Like Exploding Palm? Lashing Tail Kick? Tempest Rush? Sweeping Wind? 7SS? Cyclone?



yes

for every enemy hit you gain the life. hit 5 guys with 1k life on hit, you heal 5k
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Jun 11 2012 07:45pm
Quote (irimi @ Jun 11 2012 06:47pm)
that's got to be an exaggeration, or some very, very fail math.  how much resists/armor do you have?

----------------

Some maths on Melee Damage Reduction vs Armor --
tl;dr version:  At a generous 7k armor and 900 resists, 1% melee damage reduction is equivalent to 97.23 Armor. (and by corollary --  ~9.7 resists)  It's worth even less if your armor and resists are lower than that.

Maths below:

assuming attacker level is 63

DR = Armor / ( 50 * 63 + Armor)
DR = Armor / (3150 + Armor)

7k Armor

7000 / 10150 --> 68.96% DR

900 resists

RR = Resist / (5 * (attacker level) + Resist)
RR = 900 / (315 + 900)
RR = 74 --> 74 DR  --> 74.07% DR

Total DR from Armor and Resists:
.3104 * .2593 = 0.0804 damage taken  (~92% DR from resists and armor)

If you have 1% melee reduction thrown on top of this, you get:
.99*0.0804 --> 0.0797 damage taken (~92.1% DR from resists, armor, and melee reduction)

How much +Armor to get the same damage reduction?  (not adding resists here because obviously you want to add armor in this scenario for maximum effect)

Working backwards

0.0797 = .2593*x
you want armor's reduction to be 1 - 0.3074 = 0.6926

.6926 = Armor / (3150 + Armor)
.6926 (Armor + 3150) = Armor
0.3074 Armor = 2181.69
--> 7097.23 Armor and 900 resists gives you 92.1% DR
--> 7000 Armor and 900 resists and 1% MRR gives you 92.1% DR

so at this gear level:
1% melee reduction = 97.23 Armor



Thank you for this post.

Now a little off topic regarding this aspect of defense... Is reduction from melee "universal"? Meaning does it apply to elites and bosses? I know the reduction is applied after resists/armor and whatnot from reading the thread, but is there any confirmation that the melee reduction bonus provides def versus melee mobs.
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Jun 11 2012 08:03pm
Quote (irimi @ Jun 12 2012 06:47am)
that's got to be an exaggeration, or some very, very fail math.  how much resists/armor do you have?

----------------

Some maths on Melee Damage Reduction vs Armor --
tl;dr version:  At a generous 7k armor and 900 resists, 1% melee damage reduction is equivalent to 97.23 Armor. (and by corollary --  ~9.7 resists)  It's worth even less if your armor and resists are lower than that.

Maths below:

assuming attacker level is 63

DR = Armor / ( 50 * 63 + Armor)
DR = Armor / (3150 + Armor)

7k Armor

7000 / 10150 --> 68.96% DR

900 resists

RR = Resist / (5 * (attacker level) + Resist)
RR = 900 / (315 + 900)
RR = 74 --> 74 DR  --> 74.07% DR

Total DR from Armor and Resists:
.3104 * .2593 = 0.0804 damage taken  (~92% DR from resists and armor)

If you have 1% melee reduction thrown on top of this, you get:
.99*0.0804 --> 0.0797 damage taken (~92.1% DR from resists, armor, and melee reduction)

How much +Armor to get the same damage reduction?  (not adding resists here because obviously you want to add armor in this scenario for maximum effect)

Working backwards

0.0797 = .2593*x
you want armor's reduction to be 1 - 0.3074 = 0.6926

.6926 = Armor / (3150 + Armor)
.6926 (Armor + 3150) = Armor
0.3074 Armor = 2181.69
--> 7097.23 Armor and 900 resists gives you 92.1% DR
--> 7000 Armor and 900 resists and 1% MRR gives you 92.1% DR

so at this gear level:
1% melee reduction = 97.23 Armor


So in short. Having 16% Melee Damage Reduction or having more Armor + resist is better? Currently have 906 resist and 7.3k armor without buff. Was thinking if i shld switch my String of Ears out for more armor n resist.
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Jun 11 2012 09:01pm
Quote (lousysniper @ Jun 11 2012 10:03pm)
So in short. Having 16% Melee Damage Reduction or having more Armor + resist is better? Currently have 906 resist and 7.3k armor without buff. Was thinking if i shld switch my String of Ears out for more armor n resist.



You have to really think, is it the MELEE white mobs that is stopping you. Or mostly stupid elite mob affixes like molten, plague, lasers, desecration etc?
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