I find it a bit weird that in all this debate of Calamity vs Crossbow no one has mentioned breakpoints. And also the post I quoted was the only one with the right approach to it: Maths, look at the numbers.
Someone with both weapon types should see what Attacks per second they get with each setup and then improve Sonicgundam's post by including these breakpoints

Sentry Tick Rate.............APS
-------------------------------------------------------------
54.................................0.98182~1.10204
48.................................1.10205~1.25581
42.................................1.25582~1.45945
36.................................1.45946~1.74193
30.................................1.74194~2.16
24.................................2.16001~2.84210
18.................................2.84211~4.15385
12.................................4.15386~
--------------------------------------------------------------

Breakpoints are taken from
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/12674158852

I might do it later myself, just not right now

Edit: I believe in D3: 60 fps = 1 second
Edit2: On second thought I have to admit that the Sentries' internal cooldowns make the breakpoints less important. So probably crossbows are in favor

This post was edited by lamer30 on Jun 21 2014 02:59am

because i am drunk and dislike math as much as i dislike thai ladymen, could you please tell me what weapon choice you would go with for an ideal fire build?

remember guys breakpoint is fine but there is stil a internal cooldown on ca/ms

also 2h raw dmg is way higher.
2.2-2.3-2.5-2.6 isnt that hard to get

I've yet to see a fire dh clear faster than a physical.

okay whatever since I'm here i'm gonna do some shitty rough elementary math that probably wont mean anything just so we can play around with numbers

I'm of the belief that physical has better aoe than fire while fire is superior in single/ few targets

we're gonna pretend nothing fired out is wasted and there are three targets which are spaced near each other
also did a little testing and saw that rockets from the same ability cant all hit the same target
I'm also going to ignore sentry bolts since fire and physical are probably similar enough with rockets VS pierce
-----------

these are the numbers I'll be using since this is the breakpoint I'm at with an arcane barb

Multishot
Sentry APS...Sentry FPA...Delay in Seconds.....Delay in Frames
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1.42857........42.................1.4.............................84
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Cluster Arrow
Sentry APS...Sentry FPA...Delay in Seconds.......Delay in Frames
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1.42857........42...................2.8................................168
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


since everything feasible is generally buttfucked by myself in under 20 seconds, I'll use that timeline to compare weapon % damages that will happen
also I won't bother comparing magefists/cindercoat since phys doesnt really have something comparable
just pretend i'm using hexing pants or something neutral

20/2.8 = 7.14 clusters
20/1.4 = 14.28 multishots

assuming we're using ballistics for both specs
----
Fire
Multishot
( 360% x3 ( initial ) + 320% x 3 ( rockets ) ) = 2.040% x 14.27 = 29.131% ~

Cluster arrow
(770% + (220% x 4) ) x 7.14 = 11.781% x 3 =35.353%


physical
Multishot
(460% x 3) x 14.27 = 19.692%
Cluster arrow
(550% + 800% ) x 7.14 x 3 = 28.917%


from this we see that fire is superior to physical when vs 3 targets
physical cluster arrow is also inferior to fire
or is it?
the missiles from physical CA are almost never wasted because that shit homes while fire's can miss entirely if the mob isnt slow as shit , but thats not really what we're looking at right now since we were assuming nothing is wasted


lets see that again when we're taking down a room of shit
lets say 30 targets in 20 seconds again
Ca aoe isnt that huge, so lets say it just hits the same 3 targets each time again ( sentries arent the smartest)

fire
Multishot
( 360% x30 ( initial )) x 14.27 + (320% x 3 x14.27) = 154.116+13.699 = 167.815%

physical
multishot
(460% x 30) x 14.27 = 196.926%


here we see that physical starts to dump all over fire when the mob numbers fly up
from these rough numbers, we can assume that physical really will clear faster than fire when playing solo since aoe is pretty much all that matters since even the RG falls in just a couple dozen seconds at most

when in a party though, fire will probably be better since only the blues/elites will last any sort of time and their damage is superior with lesser numbers


/tommy post

feedback telling me where I fucked up in math or assumptions are expected and encouraged

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Kuya-1628/hero/49500129
my fire DH ( which i rolled for CA instead of MS like my phys one )


-- edit

I just noticed i was using 14.27 instead of 14.28 for everything lmao

well I'm too lazy to change it and I fucked up that number for both fire and phys so it shouldnt matter too much


tl;dr

physical > fire for aoe

and yes I do realize I'm in like the worst possible attack speed breakpoint

This post was edited by KennyBrando on Jun 21 2014 06:18am

Not factoring in cindercoat or magefists in your calculation. Is unfair. They're a huge reason that fire is better than physical.

I've played both. Always cleared faster as fire.

You spend most of rifts on single target or up to 3 targets.

Physical clears trash mobs better but fire has faster clear times still

I have cindercoat magefists and hexing pants


theyre pretty close to each other which is why I said pretend im using hexing pants for something neutral

its just too big of a pain in the ass to actually use imo

All this math.

Gross.

I've played fire and phys, and it isn't close.
Fire crushes it.

You have yo factor in with cinder that you can cast a ton of lfb outside of your sentries. The added dps from that is insane.
Maybe my play style is different, but I get a good deal of damage from that.

The only time phys outperforms is if you are in a wide open area with a shit ton of trash mobs and you can do nothing but run around and dodge

what are your skill damage rolls at?
I used to actually cast my own shit and carry punishment to CA spam, but its kinda wasted now that my sentries totally outclass my own damage

Around 25% for.both sentry and CA.
Missing sentry on cindercoat

Yes, majority of damage is sentries, but I can spam straight lfb 5-6 times easy, so my sentries really don't get going unless I'm at champ packs or just a bunch of mobs. I use para points to max hatred to allow more shots.

This post was edited by shsheik on Jun 21 2014 08:33am