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Jan 15 2013 02:25am
4000 main stat won't beat a crit build of 2500 mainstat on any class in dps output. When you have 50 + cc and 500 crit damage +, the difference between 4k no crit and 2.5k with crit is huge.
Say the 4k mainstat hits for 100 k white damage and the 2.5 k hits for 70k white damage. You have to factor in 50 % chance to hit 5 times harder ( 70k x 5 = 350k in this case) totally wrecks the high mainstat build

Any half decent player can get 50 + cc and 300 cd pretty easily ( yes I play hc and have 55 cc with a soj on)

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Jan 15 2013 02:43am
Not every class has CC or CD passives tho. monk/wizard/wd for example got none.

It actually requires quite an effort to get that on any classes that are not barbarians or DH's. And, do not get me wrong, i'm running around 50%ish crit on 2 (monk/wiz) characters with 300%+ CD but i think you are not correct when it comes easily. It will cost a lot.

Also, the critdamage is calculated into your sheet dps. Your dps output doesen't change on the long run, and both, crit and no crit are equally good if you have around the same amounts of dps, its really up to your personal preference. (ie. If you reach the same dps without CC/CD, you will have a lot lower average damage.) Of course i prefer crit as i play classes that benefit extra from crit, but that is a another story completely

This post was edited by Nukemi on Jan 15 2013 02:48am
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Jan 15 2013 05:11pm
Not taking sides here, but I think both motions have their points.

I think OP was inspired by that character's high dex and thought that that would be a great path to go hence mimicking the gearset. Granted yeah, the ehp is great, dodge is high, excellent for HC. However, due to low/no crit, the dps will be capped at some point and does not scale as furiously as crit chance and dmg. It's not viable at higher MPs where monsters have gazillion HPs , your NVs would run out before you kill a set of ubers.
Dodge unfortunately is a CHANCE. and the risk of Dodge chance failure has more serious consequences than a crit chance failure.

Even at about 40% crit, it's as good as almost every hit is scoring a crit dmg which is usually double the white dmg.
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Jan 16 2013 02:43am
High dex vs crit means, you'll have consistent damage as people mentioned and agreed upon. Here is the thing though, consistent damage is only good if you are on the verge of one shotting things and your resource means something for you.

Hypothetical example; lets take two monks doing 100k dps, one with 1 aps and other with two, meaning the first one will hit for 100k and the 2nd for 50k each.

Currently mank monks use FoT as main attack and not a spender (due change next patch possibly). Meaning second monk will gain twice the resources while doing the same dps as first one. This does not even include cyclone. Even if you have only your aura for a spender, that should mean something.

Will/can the high avg damage will be beneficial? Look at tempest rush monks, I bet your ass if you go for 4k dex and get a skorn and then you can skip attack speed crit/ cd, you'll do great if your passive regen is good enough because you'll be one shotting stuff while running due high average damage and not look back in lower mps. Also with the next patch, spending your spirit with an actual finishing move might be worth it, then you can argue that spiritspent/damage ratio means something. Still though, subject though and would take a lot of examples and builds to discuss this issue. I'm at work so I can't really go into details, but I hope I could make a point or two :)



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Jan 16 2013 03:35am
There's no sport in gearing for surviving mp0/1 farming and doing it efficiently. Any 10-year old can achieve that.

The hardest and most challenging mode in this game is Mp10 and imho handling that is the ultimate goal, and frankly stacking only the mainstat won't even take him past Mp4.

Factoring out DC's and things not relevant to the game, Lifesteal paired with balanced ehp and massive damage with crit / cd and cyclone build is the only way to handle the most dangerous and challenging parts of this game
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Jan 16 2013 09:11am
Quote (Slynfant @ Jan 16 2013 11:35am)
There's no sport in gearing for surviving mp0/1 farming and doing it efficiently. Any 10-year old can achieve that.

The hardest and most challenging mode in this game is Mp10 and imho handling that is the ultimate goal, and frankly stacking only the mainstat won't even take him past Mp4.

Factoring out DC's and things not relevant to the game, Lifesteal paired with balanced ehp and massive damage with crit / cd and cyclone build is the only way to handle the most dangerous and challenging parts of this game


The goal of people playing hardcore sure as hell aint to farm the game on mp10.
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Jan 16 2013 09:44am
Quote (foxthefeared @ Jan 16 2013 04:11pm)
The goal of people playing hardcore sure as hell aint to farm the game on mp10.


Why not it's not exactly difficult to survive Mp1

Grinding Mp1 nonstop ain't that funny, what's the point in having high-end gear if you already survive and one-shot everything with half as good gear?
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Jan 16 2013 12:13pm
Quote (Slynfant @ Jan 16 2013 05:44pm)
Why not it's not exactly difficult to survive Mp1

Grinding Mp1 nonstop ain't that funny, what's the point in having high-end gear if you already survive and one-shot everything with half as good gear?


I can farm mp10 on my barb that is one of the best geared hc chars, but its not effective. Its not even effective for sick geared softcore chars.
Diablo hc is basicly about risk vs reward, and there is alot of risk in running monk on mp10, but there is no better reward then running it on mp0-4 :P
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Jan 16 2013 01:12pm
Heh, your all pretty silly and very abstent to seeing the reason this build is what it is and the extent of how his stat priorities plays out.
It's hardcore. If you DC you die. Everyone I know, has seen a DC death and if they told me otherwise I wouldn't beleive them. But if you DC, in HC, as you could probably, hopefully, maybe not, imagine that it leaves you in-game. DUN. DUN. DUN! Now quite often, that 10 seconds that
Blizz stated your character had to last, magically turns into 30-45 seconds. As you may imagine critical hit would do shit all for you...
Life on hit? Sweeping Wind lasts maybe 5 seconds so thats out.
Life steal?. blah.
Life per second? actually wouldn't hurt, god knows i love it!
Armor? Ofc its a CONSTANT DAMAGE REDUCER
Resistance? You didn't just skipp this one?
Strength, sure for a barb.
Int eh res gives way more res.
Vitality* Every other defensive stat works to make this single stat better, while at the same time giving diminishing returns. Vitality doesn't do that, it is you single most valuble stat IMHO
Now Dex* The only stat that gives dodge chance. A monks main stat giving that extra damage... AND Dodge... A monks main defensive stat will always be dodge... It evades all damage... His is at 59.27% chance...

Its a defensive build, he obviously enjoys playing the safe game, or he wouldn't have accumulated all this gear and 83 paragon levels. Sure maybe most of you are alright with losing a character you played 500-1000+ hours on, if so your likely kids and definitely have or hold no value over your time, and can't put that into prespective. Its really not that hard to understead.
Lots of people gear like this, he has just hit a level where all you CC fanboys are actually fired-up enoguh about this to come comment and argue about it.

This post was edited by Veracruz on Jan 16 2013 01:13pm
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Jan 17 2013 08:41am
4000 dex = 2000 armor also with sieze the initiative
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