fixed it smarter then you think

Yeah, I know, there are dozens of definitions of "vampire." (you know, one of the most annoying things about occultists is that we all have different meanings for the same words. UGH!) But I'm talking about energy vampirism mostly, and people who actually want to drink blood, and the people who want to actually BECOME vampires.

Vampires are elitist. They're better. Faster. Smarter. Definately cooler. And also *trumpets, please* more SELF AWARE than you. They know what's going on in the world. They know how to rise above and control the world. They live in the shadows, using people without anyone's knowledge. They work alone, on the fringes of society.

Now let's rejoin reality. What, are you cruising around on the edges of society, but being careful to be in bed by 11pm so you can get up for work in the morning? Probably, yeah! So get real and stop pretending that life is a friggin music video.

Also, some of us here in the real world have encountered those who really do need to steal energy from other people. And there's nothing spectacular or supernatural about it, either. A vampire is the obnoxious, sallow, whiny little drama queen who looks malnourished and can't pass you in the hallway without making you listen to a sad, sad, boring, sad story. A vampire is the needy, clingy dude you just can't get rid of, because he wants to be your friend and he needs someone to listen to how he's got it all figured out- and everything sucks. He's going to do you a favor and tell you why everything sucks.

We all know how vampires make us feel when we've been attacked and leeched off of. We feel gross. Irritated. Drained. There's a good reason why whiny people make you tired. They're sucking up your energy!

Vampires are not glamorous! Most of all, they are not cool, strong, independant people! They are clingy and whiny and dumb as a stone post!

The end.

You are mixing depressive pathetic morons with the goth scene.
Seriously, there are bes and wannabes. both are pathetic.

Now before any vamps or previous get offended, I've heard of a lot of psivamps suddenly becoming normal through internal change alone.

It is not natural, I cannot even conceive of a psi vamping baby or toddler.

It isn't something that happened since birth somewhere along the line you developed the habit. Undevelop it.

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Hmm...

Though I don't consider myself a vampire by any definition of the word, I've had countless others say that I am simply because I feast off emotions. Personally, I've always counted a vampire as one who harbors the need to feast due to their own inability to produce enough energy for themselves naturally.

I, on the other hand, feast simply because I enjoy doing so...I function quite well without feeding upon the essence of others and have no reason to do so other then the enjoyment of the act. I feast, typically, through sexual means...seduction and manipulation, mind games, teasing, and then sexual interaction...feasting upon the pain, pleasure, insanity, and sorrow of my prey. I don't hide the fact that I do so either, I'm quite open with the concept that I do this with my prey...infact, I find it all the more satisfying knowing that they are aware that I'm literally drinking their soul and they still want every last moment of it.

Regardless, I don't believe that I'm more aware of what's going on...I have my speculations and theories...and I am indeed quite arrogant, but that's more so because I believe myself not to be human but instead taking up residence within this husk for a reason that I'm unaware of for the time being...along with several others who also share the same exact belief system as I and believe themselves to be what I do. The feasting off emotions is simply a game to us, a means of amusement, a way to make individuals writhe... Though, despite our beliefs, all of my kin hold an agnostic moral to heart:

"Only those who've died know what lies beyond death...everyone else are simply speculating."

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Before I was born the mother cake failed. My mother was in a hospital for a month and when I was born is was so skinny they could not use diapers on me, I could not scream I sounded like a little bird.

Now I am fat. I am often way to hungry, I can just eat and eat. Pepole feel drained around me. Am I a psychic vampire? I do not know, but I know there is something wrong with my Energy system and I believe it comes from the fact that I was born hungry. I have always been this way, even yes, when I was a toddler.

I have however experienced that some, not all, but some of those that call themself vampires are extremely arrogant, winy and melodramatic. I have asked a few about my problem and usually I get the we are the lords of the night line and seldom get any real help, but some are very nice and helpful pepole.

As for goths, goths do not pretend to be vampires, not are most goths elitist. A goth is simply somone that like darker esthetics and music. And that like to dream of a world where things are not just what science tells us but where there are more meaning and excitement. We might dream of a romantic stroll with Dracula, but that do not mean that we think that we are vampires.

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this obnoxious emo-like people could be psychic vampires. it would certainly explain why they act like that. also beggars would fit into vampires, although more of physical bent .
but, and this is big but, this could also be excuse for culling the weak (this idea is ever popular in some satanist circles). some people are just weak. emotionally, mentally, physically. maybe people just want to say "fuck you you weakling, stop clinging to me" but because of social conditioning or mercy or empathy they suppress this desire, and put up with this people.
saying "they're vamps and all they want is my energy waaaahhhh!!11" you have excuse to fry those weaker then you that you dislike.

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Well you do get alot of sociapaths and psychcotics who are into the "psy vampire" thing.

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Perhaps, but most psi vampires are "normal" sensible, moral pepole, very careful on how they feed on and how much and make sure they do not harm anyone.
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For those who are interested to investigate more.

There is some interesting info by Michelle Bellanger's Vampire Codex. (I'm not 100% certain this is the original one)
http://www.sacred-texts.com/goth/vc/index.htm

This site mentions some of the modifications made from the original Vampire Codex to the second edition.
http://www.sanguinarius.org/articles...x-review.shtml

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Vampirism has little to do with most of what was posted here, it is a condition of the soul. Bellanger is not entirely correct with everything she states, but her work is a good starting point if you know little about vampirism.
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We have a fairly popular page on "That Space", and I meet all sorts of people, interesting, intriguing, and intelligent.
...Then there are the vampires!
If I have to deal with one more melanin-deprived teenager, who gets beat-up for his milk-money, coming to me,
begging me to ask them about "The Truth About Real Vampires", I'm gonna' spit blood! (Ironic, ain't it?)

I am "This Close" to "Going Van Helsing" on the next pasty-faced butter-ball that flashes a pair of fangs at me!
(DAMN! That felt good to say!!!)

Seriously, though: It's only the Bella Lugosi freaks (And that includes you Anne Rice panderers) that ever thought that it was cool. Bram Stoker writes a book about an East European warlord in fancy dress, and suddenly all the horrors since time-immemorial are wiped away?! It's like wrapping Charles Manson in a tux with tails, and he suddenly gets out on parole!!!
If this is just a thread about "The New Peter Pan Complex", that's one thing. If we're talking about vampires, REAL vampires, that's another.
The sub-culture that arose around a literary porn author who concocted a character named Lestat; it's sad, to tell the truth. It's just so many lost kids, looking for some sense of control in their lives, seeking some power in their out-of-control existence, and some reason why they are ostracized from the rest of the high school cliques. Suddenly there pops up a few books, a handful of movies, and they discover that $200 Bucks at Hot Topic and another $20 in a costume shop, and they're put on a pedestal! How can you fight that kind of momentum?

You can't.
At least, I can't. It wears me out, trying to reach these kids, so I stopped trying.
Either it will burn it's self out like The Shakers, or it will get so ingrained in our culture as to be unrecognizable, like Andy Warhol's "Poseur Movement" (with everyone acting like they're a model in front of a camera). I'm hoping they open their collective eyes before too long. The saddest thing I've ever seen is a 40 year old, two-hundred-pound goth chick.


Then again, they say the same thing about us!
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I agree about the Vampire Codex. I however think that with this topic as with every occult topic, there is not one true way, or one true answer and vampire can mean many things.

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vampires? Quite a few. Feeding off of drama, discontentment, disappointment, betrayal. Mindgames and emotional rollercoasters. They thrive on it, seem unable to survive without them, and that's about the closest thing to a human parasite that I've ever seen.

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I don't deem myself a Vampire despite "them" claiming otherwise...I have no condition that weakens my essence and gives me the need to feed off others to supplement it, I simply do so for enjoyment.

Personally, I think many different types of beings feed off energy...Vampires are just one of the few who are required to do so due to an infliction as opposed to enjoyment.

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"I can quit any time I want", Said The Crack-Whore!

You don't get to have it both ways. You either are or you aren't. Decide what you are and stick with it. If you choose to be a maladjusted chicka with delusions of grandeur about some sociopathic desire to be loved by the people you hurt, then don't be surprised when you get worse come your way.
You are one damaged piece of work, little girl.

I'm done with this one.
Who has something real talk about?

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the word of sin is restriction
i think everyone in this thread has different idea what vampire is...

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I've gone over a year between feeding, and do so on very random occasions...so, the "Crack Whore" metaphor doesn't quite apply here now does it? A "casual drinker" comparison, on the other hand, is quite appropriate...but who am I other than some "chicka with delusions of grandeur about some sociopathic desire to be loved by the people I hurt"?

Oh...by the way, I'm male...you may have figured that out had you been a bit more observant. I do so hope that the "plethora of knowledge" you seemingly have isn't as limited as your observation skills.

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Until I see someone physically capable of doing all that fantastical crap you see in horror movies and comic books (growing fangs, strength of 10 people, flying, bursting into flames in sunlight, etc.) I'm going to believe "vampires" are symbolic.

And of all the people I've met claiming or hinting at having these powers, none of them could show me anything substantial. If they were so powerful and grand with their vampire skillz they'd have no problem taking me down, and furthermore they'd lose no sleep over it. So what gives? I could leave an open invitation and the worst that would happen is I'd get bitten by a mosquito.

Anyone who's wasting their time on an internet forum and truly does have these powers, PM me - I'll give you my latitudinal/longitudinal location and you can fly over tonight and prove you're what you claim to be.
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the ones who claim to be a Vampire by the mythological terminology...they never make any attempt to prove their case though. Just kids with too much time on their hands...fun to play with though.

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Hey draining Energy from pepole are no more addictive than doing it from the cosmos, from stones or anywhere else. Nor do I see what the big problem is if one do not try to take so much Energy that one harm somone.

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how many occultists/magickians claim that they can do pyrokinesis or levitate? so is being occultist symbolic?

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Wow.
you sure showed me.
After running on no sleep, I was incapable of telling you were male, as you hide behind one of the most feminine pictures I've ever seen.
That must mean I'm wrong.
I guess that makes you right about everything, doesn't it?
Does this make you the one of us that is more in touch with reality?

If so, I weep for the species.

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Not replenishing your prana for a year is really not an option for true vampires.
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Yeah, because sleep deprivation is one hell of an excuse for looking at a photo and being foolish enough to believe that a woman would sport a bare chest on a random Occult forum. I bet you believe half those online lesbians looking for sex are really women too! Not to mention it says male there...but what am I thinking, you were too sleepy...you poor wittle thing you.

As for my being right, I've only got my own personal experiences to pull my information from, and simply because I don't need to feed and have gone over a year between feeding without any complications...that goes to show me that your "facts", at least in regards to myself, are meaningless.

Now, as I've said before...I don't consider myself a Vampire nor have I ever done so...other's have deemed me such. I agree with you in the concept that Vampires need to feast in order to sustain themselves, that's why I don't consider myself one, but you commented directly in regards to my feasting of emotions... You then tossed some childish little post presenting your arrogant opinion that you know exactly whom and what I am...that I'm simply delusional and you know better.

Just because you're physically older than I doesn't make you wiser...especially on who and what I am in particular. So, grow up and learn to post with content that better reflects your age, otherwise I'll make you look like you're "sleepy" after every post you make.

Not all of us go bal....I mean choose to shave our head, nor to all of us have some desire to portray a masculine frame. My sincerest apologies for my long hair and lithe frame, I had no intention of drawling your eye to my exposed nipples and flat chest. It's ok though, you don't have any need to question your sexuality.

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I believe that a myriad of beings feed off energy... It's said by some that spirits drawl energy in order to manifest themselves or interact with the physical world. If you think about it, the Christian God demands unwavering loyalty, devotion, and love without question...perhaps, if such a being does exist, it does the same...feeding off that love and devotion for whatever the reason. The Succubus and Incubus are demons who feast off sexual energies...but rarely does it ever say they need to do so in order to exist, simply that they enjoy it...

It's only Vampires, in the mythological and metaphoric definition, that are stated...by most...to require to feed in order to sustain themselves. Why would that mean that other beings lack the ability to do so for the enjoyment of the act?

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Not replenishing your prana for a year is really not an option for true vampires.
I personally hate the word true. True vampire, true magician, true submissive, true woman, true patriot. True is a word pepole use to belittle what others believe or are. As only the twue sayer and his group are twue. The case is however it belittle themself, not the other person.

There are allot of different things that can be meant by vampire. It can mean walking corpse, hungry ghost, psychic vampire, somone that drain energy just for the hell of it, vampire lifestylers, bankers, politicians and so on. The word do not have one, pardon me, true meaning.

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I'm not interested in semantics or what you believe I meant when I used the words 'true vampires' . . . there is much that separates most energy users from TRUE vampires, it is the condition of the soul.
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I do not know enough about your views to answer yes or no about this. But I have not seen much to object to from you in this tread. Good to know I'm not being objected heh...

Though, if you agree with what you've read of me, then you pretty much agree with EtuMalku...if I understand their view on Vampires correctly.

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I think there are several things that can be called vampireism and what Etu refer to is one of them. I however do not believe the word have only one meaning or that one meaning is more true than another.
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Why would you think I use the word 'true' in order to belittle others? I don't.
Nor do I feel belittled by using the word 'true'
True vampires are not 'walking corpses', 'hungry ghosts' or 'lifestylers'.
What they do for a living has nothing to do with what they are either.

TRUE: means Genuine - Legitimate.
And a true vampire does not have a human soul.

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Reading Topic: "I am Tired of Vampires"

Hmmnnn.... I think I was pretty well 'on topic'.

...and now who is showing how little they know on a topic.

No matter how you choose the measure of a man: I win

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I would agree with you, but you have to understand that there are individuals who believe differently and take offense to being called a false Vampire simply because they don't fit into "our" definition of the term.

Not that I care about anyone who does, simply saying that you'll get hostile responses if you place such a "fact" stamp upon your definition instead of "I believe" in order to present it as your personal opinion.

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typically a person use it to try to make their group, faith, lifestyle and so on seam more real than other pepole group, faith, lifestyle an so on. And no I would not expect you to feel belittled by it, but you do belittle yourself non the less.

- Again if this make you feel special. And you do not have the confidence to accept that your kind of vampirism is just one of many, then my all means believe what you want, but it makes you seam vain and foolish.

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True vampirism is a condition of the soul
The soul is no longer a human it is a vampiric soul and it is no longer connected to the Universal Energy Source as a human soul is.

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That is an interesting way to look at it. I do believe there are pepole like that, however, there are many other types of vampirism than that, also how would a vampire the way you see a vampire be an occultist and work magick without being connected to the Energy of the universe whatever one want to call it? At least Energy model magick would then be hard to do. As no matter how much one draw from a donor Human Energy can never match that of universal Energy, or whatever one want to call it.
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I am not sure but I think it has to do with that non-vamps cannot store prana, though they can learn to utilize it, on the other hand a vampire can store this energy and build it up to colossal strengths and higher vibrations..
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Everyone can store Prana, however without the center nadis to gather Universal Energy the organism would not be able to gather enough Prana to store, even taking from others one would be hard pressed to get enough Energy just to keep the organism alive.
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But they do have energy channels
From what I understand the meridians are globally aligned with the physical body's sanguine system, working in a way that resembles the blood vessels.
A vampires subtle body has in its internal structure a few complex systems that work in part like energy organs, controlling and balancing the flux of Ka (energy) through the whole system.
The primary energy centers are aligned with the major endocrine glands and the central backbone of the skeleton, correlating to major nerve ganglia branching forth from the spinal column.
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They do not always follow blood veins, often they follow nerves, but their function is similar, bringing Energy around the body like the veins bring blood.

One question, have you had anyone that can read the Energy body confirm these organs? It would be interesting to see if somone that was not into your type of vampirism would be able to confirm that they are there.

And no I do not try to discredit what you say. I find what you say very interesting. The only disagreement we have is that I do not think what you talk about is the only true version of vampirism.

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http://www.yogamag.net/archives/1980...pranshak.shtml

Lastly, I will for arguments sake agree with you and the rest that the term 'vampire' can be used for many things. My definition as you already know, is one with a vampiric soul, which is different than all the others that manipulate energry for they still have a human soul.

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I can agree with you on this. I do believe some pepole can have a non human soul of various types. And it is an interesting area of the occult. What more can you tell me about it?

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Alarm bells:

The author is quick to accept kirlian photography and, seeing this is a yoga magazine, there is a significant chance he will accept interpretations of studies that conform to his belief leaving out important details regarding method and protocol. Don't believe anything at face value.

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I do not take things that face value but what do whatever or not one believe in kirlian photography have to do with anything? I think kirlian photography is an interesting topic, and I do think that one can be able to capture the aura on a picture.
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That is an emotional conviction, which isn't really "wrong.". Facts are a different category.
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There are very few scientifically proven facts in the occult. I fail to see believing one can take a picture of someone's aura to be any more an emotional conviction that anything else.
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that wasn't an alarm bell you heard, that was a wake up alarm!

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Is there any cross cultural literature references for this? I have heard of vampire myths around the world but not in regards of it being a condition of the soul (as in psy vamps).
I would be interested in more research of this if I can find enough material to write something about it.
(This concept can be found in the Asetian Bible, Theosophy books, Hermetic Qabalah and Egyptian texts, not to mention M.W. Ford's books.)(
Coffin texts, Papyrus of Ani, Funeral texts
Most important the Book Nun)

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This reeks of otherkinism.

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Cross cultural literature isn't the real issue. Ontologically speaking, get him to define exactly what he means by the "soul." Additionally: where is it? How does it exist? How can we know if it exists? Why should it exist? Next, what does it mean when a soul has a condition? How is this measured? How can we produce certainty regarding these issues separating them from self-delusion?

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I have not seen this concept in any ancient texts, not legends. The closest is the legends of dampiri, the offspring of vampires that often was said to have a non human soul, as well as to some extent the legends of changelings. Fay replacing human children, the changeling child looking human but having a fairy soul. Other then that the only place I have heard abut something similar is among otherkin, not that th otherkin movement is a bad thing.
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I have read the Coffin Texts but not found a reference to what you speak of, could you clarify how you interpret the text to get the dogma you adhere to?
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Well perhaps for you it isnt. No direspect intended. I can respect your view on this though.
For me it has enough significance in my opinion that shouldnt be totally ignore. (I'm trying to write an essay about it).

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Its the first time I have heard of the term otherkin (as mention by fraterfc93)
It sorta reminds of people claiming to only look like humans but believe they are aliens.
Of course its a little different than "walk ins" who are higher beings who walk in into another person and replaces their soul for a higher purpose.

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I do not think I would like to have my soul replaced. I like the one I got. Walk ins by the way are not only higher beings, but can be any sort of Spirit, including an animal soul replacing or sharing a body with a human soul.
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perhaps its not really being a vampire perhaps u have the traits of it in which is actually consider to be vampireism some of the symptoms are:

insomnia

energy thirst

life force thirst (which is a bad thing XD)

sensitivity to light

affinity to darkness

some negative emotions

and the list goes on and on i meen im no expert but logicaly u can say theres a thing like demonism,lycanism,etc,etc in which they differ from 1 thing to another its just who u are


now on the flip side the soul/spirit,etc,etc u make up what u are as u find connections from the spiritual side like your PLS (past life spirit/spirits) there u can find out who and what that make you up as 1 being some times its difficult and u need to find out things on your own most of the times it a ask and be told deal but regardless u make up who and what u will eventually become

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The list of symptoms of vampirism do vary allot from group to group and from person to person that mention them. There is very little all practitioners can communally agree on.
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well if u think about it psychologically that's what some of the symptoms are that's if u cross reference it and such i meen yea there's no solid evidence on such things but honestly u could call it those on the physical side but it could also be something more dominant on the other u know what i meen
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I have also heard this information it is held as fact among very many pepole practicing vampirism. Where it come from I do not know, but I do know it is rather commonly held ideas. (from "vampire codex". not such bad book, but it had some rather melodramatic parts )
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you maybe not found this term literally , but is it necessary ?
when you say vampire this 'name' is asociated too much with sucking blood, energy in people's mind, so let me ask you another 'name '
how is a fairy soul ? is it human ?

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Which term are you refering too "psy vamp" or "vampire"?

The word "vampire" is commonly used in the English language and is found in many English dictionaries.


The rest of the question I'm not sure what you are asking. Can you clarify.

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i was speaking about the condition of the soul you said you didn't find literally in vampire myths
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It had its melodramatic parts. But it is not from that book that I am not finished reading I have the information, but from the community of vampirism practitioners. But they can have gotten it from that book for all I know.

Hellen the problem is not whatever or not there is such a thing as a vampire soul, there may be. But when Etu make the claim that that is the only true form of vampirism many, me included would like to know why he feel entitled to call his type among better more true than what other pepole do and he mentioned some old texts and it would be nice to know where in those texts the validation for his system is as I have not found it yet.

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but , you know , no old texts or new texts can really validate the truth

what i see is many different truths claiming for the same 'name'

this name of vampire is exhausted today

if you understand and know what you are it doesnt matter how you are called , in ancient texts the name is not vampire anyway , so..is useless and childish
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Are their mythologies that are similar to our Western definition of a "psy vampire"?

First of all I cannot say fairies has a soul or even if faries exist as I have not witness any personally. If fairies soul is human or not I wouldnt know either.

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The term vampire was coined in the 1800 or was it 1700. I can not remember so the name is not old, but the concept and the legends are. The case is this. I guess I could call myself a psychic vampire. I am not so sure I like the term but I could. But Etu then say what I practice is not true compared to what he practice, and that is a claim I say I will not believe until he back it up. He say he have backing in old texts, so I say show us where. We are not talking about the name, we are talking about the concept.

As for faeries, in most legends they do not have a soul. It is very well described in the faerie tale The Little Mermaid, no not the Disney version, but the original story. Where more than wanting the prince the mermaid wanted a human soul, she she had none. That human beings lived only a short time but when they died their souls went to an afterlife, while mermaids when they died only turned into foam on the ocean. This reflect most faerie legends, beautiful, powerful creatures, but not created whole, as they lack a soul.
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i love movies about vampires, and drink a bit blood also
but there is more than a hype around the fact of vampires!
i hate it.
do you know the series "Moonlight"?
after it has begun every stupid child called hisself in the chats like these maincharakter "Mick Saint-John"
i hate it!
*babbel*

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Asetian Bible, Theosophy books, Hermetic Qabalah and Egyptian texts, not to mention M.W. Ford's books.

Vampire as condition of the soul is obviously found in the Asetian Bible,
The Egyptian Book of Nun (found in the Asetian Bible) describes the genesis of Aset and the first born primordial vampires.

Where as there exists nothing that I know in the Pyramid, Coffin Texts or Book of the Dead that comes out straightforward and says that vampirism is a condition of the soul, there are many sections that explain what is going on here.

I am the redness that came forth from Aset
I am the blood that issued from Nebt-Het
I am firmly bound up at the waist, and there is nothing which the Gods can do for me.
For I am the representative of Ra, and I will not die
- Pyramid Texts

I have been given eternity without limit
Behold, I am the heir of Eternity
to whom have been given everlastingness
- Egyptian Book of the Dead

These two examples are talking about the children of Aset, Horus and his two siblings, the first vampires created. They describe a soul that is immortal and that depends on the Ka (life-force) found in blood

Most Theosophy books will touch on the subject of a soul that is vampiric and quite different than a human soul.
The Qabalah & Judaic Kabbalah also talks in depth of Qliphothic souls of the vampire that are disconnected from the Universal energy Source and dependent upon Life-force

Michael Ford had devoted entire books to this vampiric soul and its nature

I am not saying that what I call True Vampires are any better or worse than other 'vampiric' beings. I am saying that there are people who practice vampirism and still others that can manipulate energy easily, but I do not consider them True Vampires, for they still have human souls and they still replenish their own life-force.

I hope this helps and I am sure it had raised even more questions

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I can not say I interpret this text as having anything to do with vampires. It seam to me to be a standard old Egyptian paragraph about eternal life, there is allot of them. But immortality do not mean vampirism.

- Again, eternal life, and vampirism is not the same thing. The old Egyptians was heavy into studies about the afterlife and also eternal physical life. And that is what I see in these texts, the soul being eternal, well part of the soul as to the old Egyptians the soul was like a jigsaw puzzle, but yes the dead Pharaoh, that was seen as an earthly representation of Horus taking his place among the Gods.

I do not think of Horus as a Vampire, he is a God, the child of promise born to restore balance when Seth dethrones Osiris. He is the Egyptian child of promise just like Jesus is the child of promise for the Christian faith. What documents actually written by those that followed ancient Egyptian religion give any proof that Horus is a vampire like being?

Ka means Spiritual force, it can be seen as to mean life force, but more often it is seen as a part of the Soul. It would be about like the crown Chakra, the part of the of the Soul responsible for communicating with the Divine.

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Ka is the vital energy that the Ba uses.
I am aware of how many perceive Egyptian Spirituality, I am speaking directly as an Asetianist.
Horus being a child of Goddess Aset, had an immortal soul, human souls are not immortal.
In order to be manifest on this Physical Plane the highly developed energy metabolism of Horus demanded a higher level of energy to maintain its internal balance while incarnated and to fuel his energy abilities and powers.
This is what is meant by True Vampire, there system cannot be kept stable and sane under the regular universal energy cycle alone.
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insisting on feeding comes to a concept with lack of consistency
the same as the legends see only the deeds and just guess what the beings are
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Actually Ka is part of the soul. The human Soul is made up of five parts in the old Egyptian religion.

Ib or the heart. The old Egyptians believed this was the key to the afterlife. As they believed the heart and not the bran held emotions and memories of deeds.

Sheut the Shadow, the dark aspect of every person.

Ba the individual personality, the part of the Soul that lived on in the afterlife.

Ren a person's name, believed to be a part of life. As long as the name was remembered this part of the soul would live.

Akh a contested one, some believe it was seen as we might see a ghost. And after image lingering after the Ba had gone on to the afterlife, some believe that Ba and Ka became Akh in the afterlife and that is is what lived on. No on really can agree.

Ka the spark of life. It is life force yes, but it is also so much more. It is more like what we would call Spirit in most Western religions. Or to put it that way, it is a part of the Soul and not just an Energy like for example Chi is. To not have a Ka would mean not not have a soul at all.

I have all possible respect for your tradition, but it is not Ancient Egyptian religion, it is a religion created based on Ancient Egyptian mythology. To say that Asetianist philosophy is practicing Ancient Egyptian religion is the same as to say Wiccans practice Ancient Roman religion. I know you guys claim many thousands of years of linage, so do the Wiccans and neither can substantiate the claim.
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The text within the Book of Nun is part of the Asetian Sacred theology and refers to ts currently accepted cosmogony.
Even though this text is mainly Kemetic in its nature, it does not reflect all the aspects and synchronism's of the Ancient Egyptian religion, that besides its complexity, symbolic nature and profound philosophical dogma, was a religion of the common people, that was eventually changed over the millennium by man, resulting in the modernly accepted Egyptian mythology, that although highly connected and entwined with the Asetian tradition, does not preserve its purity in essence and content.

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The problem is that I can not see proof to substantiate what you say in the two texts you have shown me. And if a modern book like the Asetian Bible claim so old an heritage, that do not substantiate anything as it is common for new occult groups to claim roots or even an unbroken line back to some ancient tradition quite often ancient Egypt and few can show any historical proof of the claim. You have to give me proof outside of the Asetian Bible or that can be backed up by other sources for me to accept the age of your tradition or their opinion on vampirism. __________________
Learn magic, for it is the only truth of this reality. Become magic, and you will become the essence of that truth.--Ars Magica.

I am from Norway, there are bound to be some spelling errors in my posts. I am sorry about this, but please either ignore my posts, or ignore the spelling and grammar errors, I am not on this forum to learn better English. Discuss the occult whit me, or leave me alone. Thank you.

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As you are aware of I'm sure, the deciphering of any Egyptian hieroglyph has something to do with the translator. The texts you find comfort in have been translated by E.A. Wallis Budge I believe and therefore represent his translations?
The Asetian Bible represents translations from actual walls and ceilings of Kemetic temples in Thebes, Luxor & Karnak, the Horus Temple in Edfu and remarkable Deir-el-Bahari, not too mention the King's Chamber in Khufu and Khafre pyramids.
Also, I might point out that the Asetian Bible is only a part of the secret texts that the Aset Ka have and has been made public.

I do respect your stance on this and I am in no way trying to convince you of the authenticity behind the Asetians.

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I am more a fan of Karl Richard Lepsius and Raymond Faulkner, Budge can be a bit to Christian in his translations. I try to see the texts translated by several pepole to get a more balanced view, instead of adhering to one translator alone.

- I am not questioning that your tradition is an authentic one, nor it's value. I only question the claim as to it's age. I have been a Wiccan for example, and it is a good religion but I do question the claim of it being millennial old. But I am not trying to insult your religion or say that it is not meaningful, not in any way. And I respect that you believe what you do.

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No problem, it is a pleasure discussing this with you.
I guess until something is shown to verify the age, I am just going with the concept of them being Spiritual Bloodlines to Aset and Aset being one of Goddess' from the Sep Tepy, that would make them certainly old.
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There are other ways to get energy from people, trust me I know.

For example you could develop the habit of saying alot of intelligent things on webboards and "feed" on the energy people give when they read your posts.

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Aset or Isis is the granddaughter of the two originally created Gods in Egyptian mythology if I do not remember the family three of the Egyptian Gods wrong. First one had the Creator God and there are some variation in who that is. Then he created a son and a daughter, they gave birth to the Sky and the Earth and they in turn became Mother and Father to several of the more well known Gods, including Isis.

The primordial entity, born from the waters of Nun which resided in the Duat, is Amon. Amon would split in two forming the masculine and feminine principles / yin - yang.
Male energy is Shu, the female Tefnut
From them were born Nut, the sky & Geb, the earth
From them were born Aset, Osiris, Nephthys & Seth.

Horus and his two siblings would be the first 'demigods' sort of speak. Although divine in essence and bearers of an immortal soul, Her children were connected to the cycles of reincarnation.
Having a different soul and essence from all the other incarnated beings . . . an undeniable need of vital force empowerment, to sustain their high-demanding divine energy systems while incarnated in a physical shell and to fuel their developed magickal abilities and powers . . . this was the creation of the Primordial Vampires.
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Kheper is also one of the Creator Gods in Egyptian mythology, as are Aten, remember the Egyptian religion changed over several thousand years and was not always just the same.

Most creation myths from Egypt have the Creator God rising from the waters of nothingness and then creating the male and female principle. But exactly how this happens vary, and I have never before heard a legend that say the Creator God split, only that It created male and female offspring in some way.

Also why would Horus be a Demigod. Both his parents are full fledged Gods. In most mythologies a Demigod is the offspring of a human and a God, like Hercules or even Jesus. Children of two Gods tend to be Gods themself.
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ummm this is a lil off topic

but ummm how did everyone go from talking about vamps to belief structures and there higher beings lol

XD

just thought id ask lol

XD
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The Gods before Horus did not incarnate into physical beings, Horus and his siblings did and in order to remain Physically Incarnated required more life-force than usual, thus the deficiency and thus the need to feed.
Other vampiric entities were later created through out time, but for me this is the primordial creation of the earth's vampire.

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There is a lot in the old texts, papyri, legends and so on, you just have to research. It may take years, but at least it is interesting research :>. Of course the term otherkin wasn't ever used until more recently...

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I am not saying there is not any of this in the old texts, hey it would be infinity cool if it was, but what I just wonder is that other than those that believe in this religion, why have no other Egyptologist or translator found it?

I believe strongly that when one follow a religion one should not just accept what a book tell you, nor what the leader of the religion or front figures claim, but actually investigate the evidence for the claims for one self.
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Aside from my previous explanation of Horus' incarnating as primordial vampire, the story of Sekhmet is also vampiric and there are still others.
There are Egyptologists who concur with these findings
I find it interesting that you would take one book's source and information over another's? All are merely translations and I tend to trust those with Higher Spiritual abilities than those with academics.

- Which religions are there where the majority of it is not based on faith & spirituality?
Do you believe that I have blindly succumbed to Asetianism without looking into it and asking questions?

Further info to check out

In ancient Egypt we can trace certain parallels to the Assyrian beliefs, for the ancient Egyptians held that every man had his ka, his double, which when he died lived in the tomb with the body and was there visited by the khu, the spiritual body or soul which at death departed from the body, and although it might visit the body, could only be brought back from its habitation in heaven by the ceremonial performance of certain mystic rites. Yet from one point of view the soul was sufficiently material to partake of the funeral offerings which were brought to the tomb for the refreshment of the ka. One of the chief objects of these sepulchral oblations was to maintain the double in the tomb so that it should not be compelled to wander abroad in search of food. But, as in Assyria, unless the ka were bountifully supplied with food it would issue forth from the tomb and be driven to eat any offal or drink any brackish water it might find. The ka occupied a special part of the tomb, "the house of the ka," and a priest called "the priest of the ka" was appointed specially to minister to it therein. The ka snuffed up the sweet smell of incense which was very agreeable to it when this was burned on certain days each year with the offerings of flowers, herbs, meat and drink in all of which it took great delight. The ka also viewed with pleasure the various scenes which were sculptured or richly painted on the walls of the tomb. In fact it was not merely capable, but desirous of material consolations. It would appear even that in later times the khu was identified with the ka.

Setem-Ansi (from The Egyptian Book of the Dead . . I think?)

He had been given to the temple at a very young age, and he was training to be a priest. Now, the temple he was pledged to was a temple of wisdom. The priests dedicated their lives to collecting knowledge, expanding upon it, and storing it for future generations. Part of the wisdom this temple safe-guarded was the magick of healing - not medicine only of the body, but subtle techniques and secrets of the soul.

The priesthood of this temple believed in reincarnation. However, in their view, the soul, although it retained a core identity, was made to leave behind all details and knowledge of its previous life before it took up another. The boy-priest Setem-Ansi heard this lesson and rebelled against it. If the temple's goal was the collection and preservation of wisdom, why were its priests robbed of their hard-earned knowledge life after life?

So he set about changing things. In the understanding of that long-ago temple, there were several parts to a person's soul. When a man died, it was believed that a part of the soul flew forth to return to its creator. In the arms of the creator, the soul would rest, replenish itself, and forget its previous self. Once it had thus been cleansed and renewed, it was free to fly forth to take up a new incarnation.

By the teachings of the temple, this part of the soul was tied to a physical and metaphysical part of the body. It rested in the energy center just beneath the navel, for it functioned as a kind of umbilical. Using the knowledge the temple had acquired of the subtle body and various techniques for working with and healing this, Setem-Ansi found a way to sever this umbilical, thus freeing his spirit from the cycle of forgetting.

There were several complications. While it is true that Setem-Ansi's alteration made his spirit independent and self-aware even when it disincarnated, the alteration also severed the tie his spirit had enjoyed to the replenishing energy of the universal source. And thus was he made vampiric, needing to replenish himself from the energy of others, for this was already attuned to the human form that he wore. Furthermore, it altered all his sensitivities to energy to the point where these nearly incapacitated him until he was able to understand and adjust.

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Funny thing about ancient mythology is that you can interpret the stories and meanings any way you wish.

An example would be Reinhold Merkelbach's assumption that the classical novels of the second centuries were literarly elaborations of rituals for mystery cults, including that of Isis.

- That is what you are doing, as I am seeing it. Especially a modern book with a religious agenda that shies away from academic institutions and sets itself up as unfalsifiable.

- An important question for your consideration: what constituties "Higher Spiritual abilities," and how do you know this with utter certainty? Could they be pulling your leg? Or, could they be completely convinced of the authenticity of their beliefs and authority yet really be self-delusional? What separates authentic knowledge from belief, faith, or delusion in your epistemology?

- I am completely convinced you have seriously looked into it, asked questions, and never blindly succumbed to Asetianism. And most people have done the same regarding any religion, including Christianity. However, I do not think your efforts were free of bias to steer you, consciously or unconsciously, to the answers you deeply wish to find and not notice other options and possibilities. Sort of like a self-fulfulling prophecy.

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though it is being based on what you know about a person on an internet forum, do you know what I do for a living? Where I have been, what my studies are? Anything really at all? . . . talk about prophetic

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True, perhaps the hieroglyphs speak differently to everyone that reads them?

That would invalidate the interpretation you follow, and make any interpretation whatever meaningless if it is so subject to personal whim and subjective hunches.

How does it shy away from academic institutions?

If it is making the claim that one of its books is dated to a past time period (instead of being just a claim of the most genuine interpretation from a modern author, and even then), I have yet to run across "The Asetian Bible, The Egyptian Book of Nun" reviewed in any archaeological or academic journal. Maybe I am not looking hard enough, though.

One knows for certain when one has experienced it first hand.

How can you experience first hand someone else's spiritual development?

You are entitled to your opinion.

Learning a bit of critical thinking and having a discerning eye beats having opinions any day.
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This is about your words, not who you are.

Are you still convinced the Asetian Bible is objectively accurate in terms of literal history and literal "truth" or are you starting to see that it is only subjectively meaningful and true to its adherents instead? This skips the weird assumptions and unverifiable claims and makes it more clear to look at. That does not invalidate its practicality to yourself, if it does produce the results you desire. When we can not verify a claim, it makes no sense to see it as true and valid because it has not been invalidated or the reverse, seeing it as invalid because it has not been validated. It is essentially up in the air. Throw away your conviction in any which side, then. You will be standing in the middle, and it is more calmer and peaceful there.

Also, this is only about the history claims we are taking. I haven't had time to look at the metaphysical claims regarding vampires, souls, energy, reincarnation, humans, and the whole gamut. That's a different story.

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are we having a little TOV vs AK tiff, you & I?
I am convinced that the Aset Ka know what is the truth and are what they say they are.
But, I think it beneficial for both of us to discuss our paths intelligently and maybe gain some gnosis from one another.

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It is about having a neutral mind outside any strong emotional opinion regardless of the topic or subject.

Again, you remain convinced. Tell me why you feel the way you do?
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Centrix, that is hard to put into perspective.
I am 47, a good amount of that time I have been involved in the Occult & studied comparative religions. I am also a, now retired, musician and only compose. When I began my relationship with the Aset Ka I began to realize that what they had to say made so more sense than everything else I knew. Metaphysics became clear and confusions between religious dogma was tidied up.
The members that I am in touch with have an incredible wealth of knowledge and logic that seems to be without end.
They are calm, intelligent, composed, focused almost to a fault, they are most godlyke. The Aset Ka's members are many and they keep very quiet (despite the Book . . lol).
I am honored to be composing music for this Order and have found them to be the most altruistic belief system I have known.

I know this is probably not what you asked for, but it is what I am feeling at the moment.
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Very good. But does this validate the claims made? I am sure there is a Scientologist (or a few more) out there that fit the description you gave. Would that mean Hubbard was right? Try Scientology. It will probably give you the same feeling of sense and certainty. What you explained is an emotional reaction and feeling. So, are emotional reactions valid sources of objective knowledge to your mind? __________________


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Doesn't the 'ka' feel pain?
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I do not know much about you so I have no way of knowing if you have or no. But up until now, the proof you have presented is the Asetian Bible say so. For all I know you have done years and years of research, I am not saying that, I am saying you have not presented much other sources of information in this tread. Again I do not mean to insult.

This is a common theme in many old burial customs, to give food to the corpse so it would not rise or become angry. Viking Chieftains was buried in their ships with much treasure, including animals, slaves, gold and so on. It was believed that the soul needed such things to travel safely to the afterlife. Shinto families have shrines where they offer food an innocence to the Spirits of their dead. Believing these Spirits remain on Earth to guide them. Most cultures have or have had a tradition of offering material things to the honored dead to sustain or comfort them, this is not unique to Egypt. I also fail to see what this have to do with the type of vampirism you speak of.

If we where talking about legendary vampirism yes. The beings the term vampire was coined for, the Spirit of a dead person rising from it's grave to feed of the Energy of the living, then yes I could understand this line of debate but as what we are discussing is real life, living vampires I fail to see the point.

I have heard of some Egyptian magician trying to find immortality by keeping their soul in one piece through reincarnation. I have studied that as for a transhumanist it is a nice last resort, but it have nothing to do with vampirism, but have to do with keeping the mind and the Soul in one piece.

I more trust those with an academic ability to translate and then I can make my own Spiritual interpretation when I read it. But I prefer a work to be translated with as little religions dogma involved as possible.

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I really don't have all the answers to your questions (and they are good questions). Unfortunately, I am not an Asetian nor belong to the Aset Ka, so I really don't have those answers.

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Vampire occultism is very close to being tapped out. Next they'll have to move onto other mythological creatures. Zombie occultism sounds interesting.... as does werewolf. There's probably already something like that done, huh? We're very concerned with names and titles here, qualifiers. Some dude said "success is thy proof", and that's not bad advice. We'd probably get a lot more accomplished if we all stopped bitching and posturing and whatnot.
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Yea, occult werewolves. It's called, generally, lycanthropy. And zombies? Helloooooo, Haitian zombie Voudoo?

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If some lout goth kid told me he were a vampire, I'd laugh as I have done so many times in the past.

If someone who were skilled in say, energy work, told me they were a vampire, I'd get them far away from me.

If someone told me they utilize the human life force of the world to gain power, wealth and status, I would say "kudos" to them, I would gain their trust, and then kill them and steal their power and wealth when they least expected it. Treachery and greed begets treachery and greed.
I could never stand the greedy power hungry types.
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There are many goth kids out there that claim to be vampires just to feel special, there is also many serious practitioners. Perhaps the word vampire is to associated with Hollywood. Perhaps another word should be used, but the fact remain that there are pepole that from need or greed suck life force from others, some do it straight out, some use blood, some use Energy.

As for goth kids are is any worse to imitate being a vampire than being a movie star? Pepole want to feel special, to feel they belong. Many kids dress just like some star do, go to American Idol competitions even if they can not sing at all. Is trying to live the vampire lifestyle any worse?

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To the intentional vampires:

"So you realize that a world of magick, psychic powers, self discovery and metaphysical gold await you, everything you have been taught about reality is a lie, by using your mind alone you can manipulate reality...

...and use this newfound realization to give auntie em a headache?"

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Of course. But this perspective discussed here involves becoming, not simply accepting their alleged existence somewhere. Becoming werewolf, becoming zombie. Everyone seems to want to be a mythological creature. As if being human isn't complicated enough. You may have missed the sarcasm of my previous post. Hard to convey that in written word.

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And why is this? Why is it worse to pretend to be a vampire than to pretend to be a pop star?

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it's easier to be popular if you pretend to be a pop star then a vampire XD

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For some, for others it is the same reason why pepole make a food of themself on reality TV, to be able to gain a little bit of fame and by that feel special.

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well, normally as a vampire, you *should* be able to drain. But you should also be strong, and not get sick/skinny when you stop draining. Also live fine without desperately draining

Other than that, when anyone gets sick/skinny due to *merely not draining*, that is just the church damaging your chakras.

Thelema exercizes help rebuild your chakras as energy bursts in.
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Ah I see that must be why I that am not baptized and come from a non Christian family have these Energy problems, the Church is to blame. Oh praise you, all my problems are solved, if we could only stop the evil Church damaging people's Chakras then all will be fine. Bad Pope take that Solar Plexus Chakra out of your mouth right now! Honestly do you not think that is a little bit paranoid?

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this is not a need. if you have social or family problems or are a misfit and dont understand the psychological implications of, and solution to these problems, you may develope tendancies to in some way, leech off of other healthier people... i went through that for a while and got over it... i did heroin, and became a liar, and often did things to make me look good so i could get in close with people i needed to feel were my friends... thank god i never became a goth, or delluded myself into thinking i was a vapire by ANY deffinition.

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you should never ever ever ever ever ever ever ever pretend to be something you arent... it's even worse when you pretend to be something you can never be. like a vampire. i am not saying popularity and fame and vanity and all that shit matters... dress how you want. talk how you want. don't insist you are something you are not.

when you are living your life as a vampire, or something equally lame, than you are doing so most likely because of something that happened, or something you can't quite come to terms with in your life, that makes you feel inadequate as you are normally, or unsuccessful, etc. as a human around your peers, and so you have to believe that it must be because you are in fact... a vampire! ...or a dragon! ...or an elf! or something equally bizzare and further alienating from the rest of us.

yeah yeah, do what you will.... but that isn't a "just because" thing. it has more to do with the fact that you should do whatever you feel brings you closer to a full expression of yourself, because there is nothing that will happen to you, that isn't supposed to happen, to teach you in exactly the way that is right for you, who you really are and what your life should be about. (IMO)

so if you feel like it's your will to live out this ellaborate fantasy, than deal with the disillusion that may occur when you realise that it's not cool to be playing it out into your 60's... even if you find yourself a suitable vampire mate, i'm sure your kids wont like it much when all their schoolyard chums find out that he's the weird kid with the even weirder parents.

you are born a human. no matter how disillusioned you get with our species, or bitter against the things that have occured in your life or whatever, you cannot experience something here that will change that and so it makes it alot easier if you just accept it and be comfortable about it. whatever promise of power, or ability is a bogus reason to say that being human isn't good enough. you are already born with an eternal soul, and i'd much rather have that than physical immortality. you have just as much capacity and ability for power as any other person born human, and whether you want to call yourself a magickian, or a vampire, or a kung fu master, it really doesnt matter.

as far as it goes for Etu, all i have to say is that to the manson family it sure seemed like he had all the answers.

if i fed you a ton of acid or something, i could tell you anything in the right way you might hand your will over to me on a gold platter... if i find the right way to reach you, and really touch a nerve i might not even need the drugs.

this aset stuff sounds like a fuckin cult... and a real lame one at that. probably composed of people like i already described who are just thrilled that they can look into the past and interpret it in whatever way they want, to fit their little fantasy and not have to embrace the greatest part of any of that religious stuff...

the human experience.

the idea that you should be able to maintain your identity throughout your new incarnation is a vain one. if you incarnate again, why should you still be "you"? if you have faith that you are, than just be comfortable in knowing that you are still learning and may reach nirvana after. part of that is realising that this identity is an illusion. granted to you, by the infinate grace and generosity of whatever god to serve a specific purpose.

talk about blasphemy.

to the OP... i too am VERY TIRED OF "VAMPIRES".

you want to know what it's like to have to feed off of someone or something, and experience the hell that you go through without, and to know what it's like to live your life for the sole purpose of this sustanance, knowing nothing but lonliness and hunger, all i have to say is go start shooting up heroin... anything even slightly resembling the concept of vampirism might just have it's novelty thrown away after that.

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It's more like dr. ski wampas is talking out dr. ski wampas' ass!
So, how did you arrive at your simpleton conclusions about all of this?
I can't believe I'm wasting my time on you . . here's your infantile explanation correctly stated: .
Psychological Perspectives on Vampirism
A psychological structure grounded in the collective unconscious
Vampire stories reflect the unconscious world of polymorphous perverse infantile sexuality
Oedipus Complex
Conscious awareness of these feelings and associated wishes raises the anxiety level of the child to unacceptable levels, ego defenses come into playto prevent the conscious mind from becoming aware of these dangerous impulses.
It is the function of dreams to disguise these wishes into more acceptable forms.
Vampire image is a fantasy image related to these wishes.
Jung believed these universally reflected experiences to be understood as an expression of what he termed the "shadow," aspects of the self that the conscious ego was unable to recognize.
This shadow contained repressed wishes, anti-social impulses, morally questionable motives, childish fantasies of grandiose nature, and other traits felt to be shameful.
The vampire image serves as a scapegoat as it allows us to disown the negative aspects of our personalities.
Auto-erotic, or otherwise narcissistic personality traits can result in a personality that is in fact predatory, anti-social, and parasitic on life energy of others. This is called "narcissistic personality disorder"
"Mirror-hungry" personalities thirst for self objects whose confirming and admiring responses will nourish their famished self. Often manifesting into arrogant superiority called "a grandiose retreat".
When a child cannot experience adequate mirroring, its infantile grandiosity cannot be transformed into a mature psychological structure identified by its more realistic sense of self esteem.
Narcissistic wounds often lead the individual to seek narcissistic nourishment through sexual activity.
Narcissistic rage seeks the utter destruction of the independant personhood of the other - either through death or ruthless enslavement and exploitation.. Thus the vampire within projects its image onto the other - thereby justifying its own predatory intentions.

From one of Konstantinos' fine books on Occult matters:
VAMPIRES: I have been asked by many skeptical people, "How could vampires really exist?" or even, "Are you serious?" Most went on to add that the bloodsuckers of fiction seem a bit hard to believe in; after all, if they really feed on humans like they are portrayed in the movies as doing, wouldn't there be an enormous number of victims found in alleys, or perhaps found in graveyards, on any given morning? There obviously haven't been any such victims, though, because their blood-drained bodies and the familiar punctured neck wounds would have attracted enough media attention to make belief in vampires commonplace by now.

Vampires are not these folk lore mythological monsters that are recorded in almost every culture and time period. They are not the delusional people that inhabit some of the Goth community, going as far as to have fangs surgically created, blood rituals and other role playing endeavors. They are not what famed psychologist termed Narcissistic Personality Disorder: Originating as a child who's infantile sexual urges become raised to unacceptable levels, their ego defenses would regularly come into play and prevent the unconscious mind from becoming aware of these dangerous impulses.
When the child cannot experience adequate mirroring (the seeking of self objects that confirm and admire the child thus nourishing their famished self) its infantile grandiosity cannot be transformed into a mature psychological structure identified by its more realistic sense of self esteem.
These Narcissistic wounds lead to repressed wishes, anti-social impulses, morally questionable motives and fantasies of grandiose nature. The vampire image serves as a scapegoat as it allows us to disown the negative aspects of our personalities. This in turn becomes Narcissistic rage and one seeks the utter destruction of others.
The vampire within ourselves projects its image onto others thereby justifying its own predatory intentions.

Vampires are found in almost every religion, none better than the Kabbalah of Judaism, being detailed within the studies of the Qliphoth and the Tree of Death.

Finally, I would appreciate you not referring to my beliefs and my religion as a fucking lame fantasy cult.

What belief system do you follow?
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i'm pretty familiar with jung.

i'm pretty familiar with the idea and function of the shadow. i'm pretty comfortable in embracing this aspect of myself when i feel it will bring the rest of myself into ballance. i might have in the past not been able to recognize this so much, and it caused alot of anxiety for me in my earlier teen years, resulting in my doing much to try and gain the acceptance of my peers.... you know what? i never really did, and instead of going all to pieces about it, or pretending i was something i was not, i became comfortable with who i was... sexual urges and all.

how many more people does this describe, that for whatever reason or another drive a real big truck and act like violent douche bags? or dress all emo, and try to be part of that sub culture? i think your description of this "disorder" fits most people from my generation... everyone is striving to fit into one group or another, and if they dont find the cool one they join the one with all the other people who all are uncool, and make that into their source of coolness... it's a problem common to pretty much anyone who hasn't sepperated themselves from the stupid illusions associated with being a part of our world today... that is a subject matter for many other threads.

who would you be to say i have no matured psychological structure? not a damn anyone... and i really couldn't care, because i know the way i feel about me... and it's pretty good right now. devoid of needing to pretend i'm something fantastical and magical when infact i'm pretty aware of my own limitations.

so, i guess we better find a better word for them... because vampire already carries so many implications.

other than that, a metaphorical vampire even so called, based on our understanding of the mythical creature, doesnt sound very appealing... i like being self sufficient and not needing to "feed" off of someone perfectly healthy, psychologically or otherwise.

so if they aren't a gothic subculture, blood sucking mythological creatures, or narcisistic youth... what are they? if you want to say they dont have a human soul, that is not nothing you can demonstrate or prove... whoever you'd be talking about, i'm pretty sure they all breathe oxygen, eat food and came from a vagina... sounds pretty human.

not one of these religions uses the word vampire... you do. why? it's not a very credible way to get the concept across, because of the stigma already associated with the phrase obviously... and even so, whether or not any one of those religions is reffering to what your paradigm is set up around is entirely up to your interpretation of the concept, which others have already noted.

also, that your interpretation of it is... well, not wrong... but not very widely accepted or credited or documented or even given any stock, except for those who practice it.

ok, so i re-read the quote and your asset-ist, or whatever... thats cool and i'm not gonna bag on someones religion... you kept mentioning horus in his incarnation. you mean, you literally beleive horus was incarnated at some point?

i dont personally believe so... i know their are lots of christians who think christ really really lived too. i dont believe that either.

i dunno... i never meant to be hostile or anything either. i have time to kill before work and so i'm just kinda drunk and posting my mind around the forum. all the stuff you posted about narcissism gives me enough reason to think the way i do about people interested in the vampire subculture... but really, it goes for anyone i guess.

and about what i believe... i can't say i subscribe to anything specific. i only know what i know... and i really dont know a damn thing, at that. of all the religions out there, i try to percieve what they have in common, and take the good over the bad rather than say any one of them is more right that the other. i have my experiences, but even they are an illusion. my idea of an identity wont last, and i'm not going to fight for cry about it in when i have to give it up.

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You are entitled to your own opinion off course. But there are quite a few pepole that actually have a need for the life force of others. It is not just them being maladjusted, it is a actual need.

As for goths. Goth is a lifestyle based on music and aesthetics. It have nothing to do with vampires. But why the hell is it so wrong to want to dress a little different than the majority of pepole. Why am I a worse person for preferring a black dress with skulls on it than a blue dress with flowers?

For many vampire is a concept, an archetype I do not see anything wrong with trying to emulate it. And yes pepole that claim they are something they are not is silly, but it is just as silly claiming to be a model or a movie star as claiming to be a vampire.

Yes becouse if one is not cookie cutter normal then it must be something wrong with you. If you live an alternative lifestyle or dress differently or have any other things in your life than work, kids and Big Brother then you are emotionally challenged an do it just becouse you can not function in society. I am sorry, but that is complete bull.

This is my life, my mind, my soul, my body and my identity. I do not give a rat's ass about what some possible Higher Power meant by creating me. I am me, and I will do with me whatever the hell I want.

Or becouse the word Vampire is a rather new word so it would be strange if it showed up in thousands of year old texts. Now I do not agree with Etu that there are vampires in Cabala, but I know that the lack of the name vampire do not discredit it. Call it life force feeders or ompa lumpas for all I care, the concept is the same.

Well the old Egyptians did believe that. they believed that Horus was incarnated in every Pharaoh.

Now I do not mean you any kind of offense, but I get irked when pepole believe anyone not A4 is different becouse we are incapable of living a normal life. Pepole that say oh no pepole that are into the BDSM lifestyle are just looking for a way to punish themself for something they have done, or all Goths are depressed and so on. The case is, many pepole want to live life a little different, for no other reason than that that is what give joy and meaning to life for us. It is nothing wrong with being different.

actually, word vampire draws root from word "vampir" common in slavic languages, that is quite old.

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And also Romanian, which counts as a Romance language, not a Slavic one. However, the only Latin-based root I can think of having even the slightest to do with vampires is "revenire" or to come/arise again, "revenant" being the English-based word. So, it is most likely a Slavic root, but one can never be too sure.

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And the Romanian name probably comes from another word and so on. My point was just that the concept is older than the word. In Norway, that have very few vampire myths, they are called sucking demons, if I do not remember all wrong, among other things. There is allot of different names for the same concept.
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ok vampires .... not many people belive they exhist but im part vampire as i was bitten by one ..... i luckily am a day walker becuase i am also part witch part demon and part human mainly from my mums side of the family she is a high priestess ........ so saying that what they do is wrong .... is ...well ... wrong because thats like saying its wrong to be black or its wrong to be gay or its wrong to perform cpr. we need blood to survive sometimes but not alot .... and its only from someone who is volunteering and in grave emergencies and no we do not rise from the dead lol ..... so yes in other words shut up ... you bias discriminative fool ...... that is all
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i suppose you could call 'vampires' night walkers? well the pure blood ones ..... im just an all arounder lol ...... but yes i liek vampire as a term because its well known although most stories create false prejudice and really most vampires can walk outside during the day .... just not for more than few hours wen its hot its just liek sun burn lol except faster
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Okay, I love the night. I walk it almost every night. I prefer to do rituals under the moon/stars, in the nights rain, etc. I am VERY fascinated with the vampire mythology. I fucking LOVE vampire films, as does my girlfriend and we regularly enjoy bringing the vampire role-playing into the bedroom... I WISH I WAS A FUCKING VAMPIRE!

But, I don't feel the need to drain people of their energy... and my iron levels are fine, so there is no blood craving.

In reality, I can't fucking stand these so called "vampires". You are really nothing more than a fucking energy leach. You are a parasite of the lowest form....YOU CHOOSE TO BE A PARASITE.

And because parasitic energy leach isn't a very becoming title and because vampire is "kewl", you attatch yourself to the term, completely pervert the meaning and myth behind the vampire to meet your needs. Then there are the ones who take it a step further... unable to convince themselves of the fact that they are a vampire simply because they prey on the emotions of other people, they convince themselves that they need fucking blood to survive (or mistake an extreme iron deficiency with the vampiric fantasy they learned about at their local 18 and under goth club). I use blood in my rituals at times, though generally symbolic and to focus my mind... Hell I have even been known to take part in some bloodletting for the euphoric experience, but seriously....? You need to drink blood?

I mean, god damn... I don't even know what to fucking say to argue against it, as it is so idiotic that there seems to be no logical argument to the absolutely illogical fantasy.

I am chaos.... I am of the 'belief is a tool to be applied at will' mentality... but lets be serious here...be that as it may, if I believe I am a fucking ogre with green skin and a talking donkey, as much as my subjective perception creates that in my mind... Im not a fucking ogre. You aren't a fucking vampire. You are a useless human being with fantasies.

Apply your vampire fantasies into a ritual setting, designed to focus your mind, where the vampire idea plays a key role in the ritual, gaining some inner wisdom, taking in the energies as a vampire takes in blood... whatever it may be, and yes, I believe you will be a vampire for the time being, but that doesn't carry over beyond the ritual. You don't walk around as a vampire. As with anything, it is a focus tool in that situation and can be made true for the ritual, beyond that, it is simply another subjective and relative truth, true only to you, in your mind.

Im done. I love anyone on here who stands against the parasites that call themselves vampires. We get it, it adds a certain darkness and mystique to you. You are so intense and elite as you have victims whom you prey on. You are a god amongst mortals, able to control anyone you wish. Well.... I will gladly chew your fucking throat out.

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I do not know. Parasitic Energy Leach, it do have a certain ring to it, and it is in fact a more true definition than vampire really.
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As always, our concern with names and titles is overshadowing the actual practice itself, which is the essential aspect of vampirism... of all occultism, in fact. Yes, everyone here is a human being, get over it. If you don't like that someone is saying otherwise, however retarded that may be, just accept their ignorance and try to address more important aspects of this subject. In my opinion, and this is disregarding what anyone else says, a vampire is just someone who performs acts of vampirism (I admit that this is a terribly general definition, but it saves us from debating the issue of us actually being humans, which cannot be denied). Just as a Thelemite or a Wiccan is not some other creature, but a human adhering to those philosophies, practices, paradigms and whatever else is involved. This is so simplistic as to hardly warrant comment, but I occasionally see people focusing more on the name than anything else, which gets us nowhere.

End of pointless comment. As an aside, a thread I started about the techniques of vampirism was a way for me to put all of those practices out in the open for others and to move beyond it myself. I too am tired of vampires and vampirism. The subject gets so needlessly complicated and convoluted by its practitioners that it just becomes ridiculous. Sure, it's a fascinating little practice, but some of its followers have tried to make it into something it's not, some immensely important religion that is the ONE AND ONLY TRUTH. Newsflash: this has already been done with Judaism, Catholicism, Islam, etc. And you're just lowering yourself tho their ego-maniacal level.
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Pointless Comment aside . . . I would have to disagree with a couple of things you said (discussion is always welcome). The vampirism you talk about is one that is 'practiced'. There is a difference from actual True vampires and others that are vampiric or practice vampiric techniques.

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You do not mind me putting it in my tag line do you? I guess I should have asked you first, sorry.

I agree with Haire that we get to involved in names. I however think one can have perts of one self, the soul, or the Spirit or so that are not human. I however think that 90 percent of those that claim to have vampire, faerie or some other fantastical soul is just looking for a way to feel special, but a some are what they claim to be.

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All my comments were general and not specific to any one individual. I've really got no grudge with anyone here, I'm just sort of nonchalant and laid back like that. I disagree with the term "true vampires" you used, since it insinuates superiority of one school of thought over another, whereas I consider their truthfulness to be relative.

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I too can accept this, at least in theory. But we still have to consider that we're in human vehicles and subject, to some extent, to human limitations, regardless of our spiritual identity. That spiritual identity may endow us with specific traits or talents... I think you're correct in that respect. But they must still be expressed in a humanly fashion.

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Then accept my apology, I may have overreached, sorry.
Insinuating that there are 'True' vampires should not come across as a form of elitism, it is rather along the same lines as saying someone has truly broken their arm instead of 'I think I broke my arm' . . . it's not elitist, it is the pure form of being vampiric.
Those that practice vampirism, or other psychic energy manipulation, that still enjoy a human soul are not what I refer to as 'True vampires' . . . nothing to get disgruntled about.

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Don't worry, you can't so easily disrupt my gruntle. But on a serious note, I think considering oneself a vampire involves "doing" rather than "being." We talk of "being" a vampire, but what we usually mean is that we're "doing" certain things that warrant this title. And I think that's where you and I disagree. You say that the qualifier is not any sort of action, but a state of being. But isn't "being" really just a form of "doing?" In any case, this gives rise to many valid questions about the soul, which cannot be easily explained since the soul apparently can't be measured or identified in any way that's going to satisfy everyone asking the questions. We're getting into territory here that is vague and nebulous. I try to focus on the "doing" or the actions involved to avoid such vagueness, in order to simplify matters a bit.

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What you say is just fine. Yes, my point would include a huge discussion concerning the soul, and we both know where that would end up, LOL!
Qabalah's Qliphothic vampirism and the type of vampirism that Michael Ford & Thomas Karlsson refer to are very good examples of what 'you' are getting at.
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I can not agree more with this. For me I do not disagree with Etu's concept but with his separation of his type of vampirism as true. I understand that it is not means as elitist, but that is how it come across, it also come across as dismissing towards those that are vampires of different beliefs, practice and kind.

As a Transhumanist I aspire to break those human limitations. But yes I agree with you. There are for example pepole that have vivid memories of having been animals in former lives. Some of them can be said to have an animal soul, but their body is still human and have human needs. The same one can say to have a vampire soul, but one still have to live in this world with a human body.

You know every time only of my friends complain that their mother nag them to come visit I feel a pang of jealously. My mother and I have a great relationship but she can not really spend more than a few days with me visiting before she start to feel drained. I try to smile, say it is okey. That I want to go home, play on my play station, see my pet can and my fiancee, but in reality I am very sad becouse I want to visit longer. And my man, he get drained to, it is a huge weight on the relationship. That is a real problem for me, and I must admit I get a little bit irked when you compare it to thinking one broke one's arm compared to braking ones arm, it is marginalize a very real problem I have and that many other have to and that is hurtful.

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My intention is not to 'irk' you or anyone else for that matter.
Let me explain it more like this . . . if someone were to be King and of royalty, it is quite different than someone that acts kingly!
The Asetians are descendants of Aset and are the Primordial vampires from which all true vampiric beings can be traced.
When the human soul has been replaced with the vampiric soul you are then a 'True' vampire. Otherwise, you are of human soul practicing vampirism or practicing energy manipulation.

it is obvious we both have different views and descriptions of what vampires are.
Can't we just realize this and call it a day? I'd rather not have to argue my viewpoint with you every time I comment on this forum.

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I understand the point you're making, but here again we're focusing on titles only. The reality of it is that royalty is no different than the common man. Stripped of all that we have, we're all essentially the same. A king is not any different type of being than a citizen, they're both humans. Only titles separate them. Again, I say it's one's actions that define them. But we're repeating ourselves now.

This is basically my sentiment also. I see no room for authority in occultism, so I'm fine with agreeing to disagree. Those who can't just do this tend to become belligerent, which I cannot respect.

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And remember most kings and royal lines was once commoners. Often they can be traced back to a commander or somone rich enough to support the nation through difficult times. As for acting knightly that have little to do with royalty. I live in a nation that have a royal family, and they are like everyone else save that their job is to represent Norway in various functions, and the Crown Princess she is a former model and party girl from a small town, a single mother that the Crown Prince just happened to fall in love with. The Queen was a rich merchant's daughter that married the future King, and one of the Princesses, well she runs an occult school and is an occultist, and none of them bleed any different color than any of the rest of us. Royalty is a place in society, not an inborn quality.

I will aways post my opinions when I see you talk about "true" vampires to those that ask about vampirism on this forum. I do not like elitism in the occult, nor do I like elitist ideas to be presented as the only, unchallenged fact

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Vampires are mythological or folkloric revenants who subsist by feeding on the blood of the living. In folkloric tales, the undead vampires often visited loved ones and caused mischief or deaths in the neighbourhoods they inhabited when they were alive. They wore shrouds and were often described as bloated and of ruddy or dark countenance, markedly different from today's gaunt, pale vampire which dates from the early Nineteenth Century. Although vampiric entities have been recorded in most cultures, the term vampire was not popularised until the early 18th century, after an influx of vampire superstition into Western Europe from areas where vampire legends were frequent, such as the Balkans and Eastern Europe,[1] although local variants were also known by different names, such as vrykolakas in Greece and strigoi in Romania. This increased level of vampire superstition in Europe led to what can only be called mass hysteria and in some cases resulted in corpses actually being staked and people being accused of vampirism.
In modern times, however, the vampire is generally held to be a fictitious entity, although belief in similar vampiric creatures such as the chupacabra still persists in some cultures. Early folkloric belief in vampires has been ascribed to the ignorance of the body's process of decomposition after death and how people in pre-industrial societies tried to rationalise this, creating the figure of the vampire to explain the mysteries of death. Porphyria was also linked with legends of vampirism in 1985 and received much media exposure, but has since been largely discredited.
The charismatic and sophisticated vampire of modern fiction was born in 1819 with the publication of The Vampyre by John Polidori; the story was highly successful and arguably the most influential vampire work of the early 19th century.[2] However, it is Bram Stoker's 1897 novel Dracula which is remembered as the quintessential vampire novel and provided the basis of the modern vampire legend. The success of this book spawned a distinctive vampire genre, still popular in the 21st century, with books, films, and television shows. The vampire has since become a dominant figure in the horror genre.

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Etymology

The Oxford English Dictionary dates the first appearance of the word vampire in English from 1734, in a travelogue titled Travels of Three English Gentlemen published in the Harleian Miscellany in 1745.[3][4] Vampires had already been discussed in German literature.[5] After Austria gained control of northern Serbia and Oltenia in 1718, officials noted the local practice of exhuming bodies and "killing vampires".[5] These reports, prepared between 1725 and 1732, received widespread publicity.[5]
The English term was derived (possibly via French vampyre) from the German Vampir, in turn thought to be derived in the early 18th century from the Serbian вампир/vampir.[6][7][8][9][10] The Serbian form has parallels in virtually all Slavic languages: Bulgarian вампир (vampir), Czech and Slovak upír, Polish wąpierz, and (perhaps East Slavic-influenced) upiór, Russian упырь (upyr'), Belarusian упыр (upyr), Ukrainian упирь (upir'), from Old Russian упирь (upir'). (Note that many of these languages have also borrowed forms such as "vampir/wampir" subsequently from the West; these are distinct from the original local words for the creature.) The exact etymology is unclear.[11] Among the proposed proto-Slavic forms are *ǫpyrь and *ǫpirь.[12] Like its possible cognate that means "bat" (Czech netopýr, Slovak netopier, Polish nietoperz, Russian нетопырь / netopyr' - a species of bat), the Slavic word might contain a Proto-Indo-European root for "to fly".[12] An older theory is that the Slavic languages have borrowed the word from a Turkic term for "witch" (e.g., Tatar ubyr).[12][13]
The first recorded use of the Old Russian form Упирь (Upir') is commonly believed to be in a document dated 6555 (1047 AD).[14] It is a colophon in a manuscript of the Book of Psalms written by a priest who transcribed the book from Glagolitic into Cyrillic for the Novgorodian Prince Vladimir Yaroslavovich.[15] The priest writes that his name is "Upir' Likhyi " (Упирь Лихый), which means something like "Wicked Vampire" or "Foul Vampire".[16] This apparently strange name has been cited as an example both of surviving paganism and of the use of nicknames as personal names.[17]
Another early use of the Old Russian word is in the anti-pagan treatise "Word of Saint Grigoriy", dated variously to the 11th-13th centuries, where pagan worship of upyri is reported.[18][19]
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Folk beliefs

The notion of vampirism has existed for millennia; cultures such as the Mesopotamians, Hebrews, Ancient Greeks, and Romans had tales of demons and spirits which are considered precursors to modern vampires. However, despite the occurrence of vampire-like creatures in these ancient civilizations, the folklore for the entity we know today as the vampire originates almost exclusively from early 18th century Southeastern Europe,[1] when verbal traditions of many ethnic groups of the region were recorded and published. In most cases, vampires are revenants of evil beings, suicide victims, or witches, but they can also be created by a malevolent spirit possessing a corpse or by being bitten by a vampire. Belief in such legends became so pervasive that in some areas it caused mass hysteria and even public executions of people believed to be vampires.[20]
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Ancient Beliefes

Tales of supernatural beings consuming the blood or flesh of the living have been found in nearly every culture around the world for many centuries.[53] Today we would associate these entities with vampires, but in ancient times, the term vampire did not exist; blood drinking and similar activities were attributed to demons or spirits who would eat flesh and drink blood; even the devil was considered synonymous with the vampire.[54] Almost every nation has associated blood drinking with some kind of revenant or demon, or in some cases a deity. In India, for example, tales of vetalas, ghoul-like beings that inhabit corpses, have been compiled in the Baital Pachisi; a prominent story in the Kathasaritsagara tells of King Vikramāditya and his nightly quests to capture an elusive one.[55] Pishacha, the returned spirits of evil-doers or those who died insane, also bear vampiric attributes.[56] The Ancient Indian goddess Kali, with fangs and a garland of corpses or skulls, was also intimately linked with the drinking of blood.[57] In Egypt, the goddess Sekhmet drank blood.
The Persians were one of the first civilizations to have tales of blood-drinking demons: creatures attempting to drink blood from men were depicted on excavated pottery shards.[58] Ancient Babylonia had tales of the mythical Lilitu,[59] synonymous with and giving rise to Lilith (Hebrew לילית) and her daughters the Lilu from Hebrew demonology. Lilitu was considered a demon and was often depicted as subsisting on the blood of babies. However, the Jewish counterparts were said to feast on both men and women, as well as newborns.[59]
Ancient Greek mythology described the Empusa,[60] Lamia,[61] and striges (the strix of Ancient Roman mythology). Over time the first two terms became general words to describe witches and demons respectively. Empusa was the daughter of the goddess Hecate and was described as a demonic, bronze-footed creature. She feasted on blood by transforming into a young woman and seduced men as they slept before drinking their blood.[60] Lamia preyed on young children in their beds at night, sucking their blood.[61] Like Lamia, the striges, feasted on children, but also preyed on young men. They were described as having the bodies of crows or birds in general, and were later incorporated into Roman mythology as strix, a kind of nocturnal bird that fed on human flesh and blood.[62]

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Medieval and later European folklore

Le Vampire,
lithograph by R. de Moraine
Les Tribunaux secrets (1864)


Many of the myths surrounding vampires originated during the medieval period. The 12th century English historians and chroniclers Walter Map and William of Newburgh recorded accounts of revenants,[20][63] though records in English legends of vampiric beings after this date are scant.[64] These tales are similar to the later folklore widely reported from Eastern Europe in the 18th century and were the basis of the vampire legend that later entered Germany and England, where they were subsequently embellished and popularised.
During the 18th century, there was a frenzy of vampire sightings in Eastern Europe, with frequent stakings and grave diggings to identify and kill the potential revenants; even government officials engaged in the hunting and staking of vampires.[65] Despite being called the Age of Enlightenment, during which most folkloric legends were quelled, the belief in vampires increased dramatically, resulting in a mass hysteria throughout most of Europe.[20] The panic began with an outbreak of alleged vampire attacks in East Prussia in 1721 and in the Habsburg Monarchy from 1725 to 1734, which spread to other localities. Two famous vampire cases, the first to be officially recorded, involved the corpses of Peter Plogojowitz and Arnold Paole from Serbia. Plogojowitz was reported to have died at the age of 62, but allegedly returned after his death asking his son for food. When the son refused, he was found dead the following day. Plogojowitz supposedly returned and attacked some neighbours who died from loss of blood.[65] In the second case, Paole, an ex-soldier turned farmer who allegedly was attacked by a vampire years before, died while haying. After his death, people began to die in the surrounding area and it was widely believed that Paole had returned to prey on the neighbours.[66]
The two incidents were well-documented: government officials examined the bodies, wrote case reports, and published books throughout Europe.[66] The hysteria, commonly referred to as the "18th-Century Vampire Controversy", raged for a generation. The problem was exacerbated by rural epidemics of so-claimed vampire attacks, undoubtedly caused by the higher amount of superstition that was present in village communities, with locals digging up bodies and in some cases, staking them. Although many scholars reported during this period that vampires did not exist, and attributed reports to premature burial or rabies, superstitious belief increased. Dom Augustine Calmet, a well-respected French theologian and scholar, put together a comprehensive treatise in 1746, which was ambiguous concerning the existence of vampires. Calmet amassed reports of vampire incidents; numerous readers, including both a critical Voltaire and supportive demonologists, interpreted the treatise as claiming that vampires existed.[67] In his Philosophical Dictionary, Voltaire wrote:[68]
These vampires were corpses, who went out of their graves at night to suck the blood of the living, either at their throats or stomachs, after which they returned to their cemeteries. The persons so sucked waned, grew pale, and fell into consumption; while the sucking corpses grew fat, got rosy, and enjoyed an excellent appetite. It was in Poland, Hungary, Silesia, Moravia, Austria, and Lorraine, that the dead made this good cheer.

The controversy only ceased when Empress Maria Theresa of Austria sent her personal physician, Gerhard van Swieten, to investigate the claims of vampiric entities. He concluded that vampires did not exist and the Empress passed laws prohibiting the opening of graves and desecration of bodies, sounding the end of the vampire epidemics. Despite this condemnation, the vampire lived on in artistic works and in local superstition.[67]

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Non-European beliefs


Africa

Various regions of Africa have folkloric tales of beings with vampiric abilities: in West Africa the Ashanti people tell of the iron-toothed and tree-dwelling asanbosam,[69] and the Ewe people of the adze, which can take the form of a firefly and hunts children.[70] The eastern Cape region has the impundulu, which can take the form of a large taloned bird and can summon thunder and lightning, and the Betsileo people of Madagascar tell of the ramanga, an outlaw or living vampire who drinks the blood and eats the nail clippings of nobles.[71]

The Americas

The Loogaroo is an example of how a vampire belief can result from a combination of beliefs, here a mixture of French and African Vodu or voodoo. The term Loogaroo possibly comes from the French loup-garou (meaning 'werewolf') and is common in the culture of Mauritius. However, the stories of the Loogaroo are widespread through the Caribbean Islands and Louisiana in the United States.[72] Similar female monsters are the Soucouyant of Trinidad, and the Tunda and Patasola of Colombian folklore, while the Mapuche of southern Chile have the bloodsucking snake known as the Peuchen.[73] Aloe vera hung backwards behind or near a door was thought to ward off vampiric beings in South American superstition.[30] Aztec mythology described tales of the Cihuateteo, skeletal-faced spirits of those who died in childbirth who stole children and entered into sexual liaisons with the living, driving them mad.[24]
During the late 18th and 19th centuries the belief in vampires was widespread in parts of New England, particularly in Rhode Island and Eastern Connecticut. There are many documented cases of families disinterring loved ones and removing their hearts in the belief that the deceased was a vampire who was responsible for sickness and death in the family, although the term "vampire" was never actually used to describe the deceased. The deadly disease tuberculosis, or "consumption" as it was known at the time, was believed to be caused by nightly visitations on the part of a dead family member who had died of consumption themselves.[74] The most famous, and most recently recorded, case of suspected vampirism is that of nineteen-year-old Mercy Brown, who died in Exeter, Rhode Island in 1892. Her father, assisted by the family physician, removed her from her tomb two months after her death and her heart was cut out and burnt to ashes.[75]

Asia

Rooted in older folklore, the modern belief in vampires spread throughout Asia with tales of ghoulish entities from the mainland, to vampiric beings from the islands of Southeast Asia. India also developed other vampiric legends. The Bhūta or Prét is the soul of a man who died an untimely death. It wanders around animating dead bodies at night, attacking the living much like a ghoul.[76] In northern India, there is the BrahmarākŞhasa, a vampire-like creature with a head encircled by intestines and a skull from which it drank blood. Although vampires have appeared in Japanese Cinema since the late 1950s, the folklore behind it was western in origin.[77] However, the Nukekubi is a being whose head and neck detach from its body to fly about seeking human prey at night.[78]
Legends of female vampire-like beings who can detach parts of their upper body also occur in the Philippines, Malaysia and Indonesia. There are two main vampire-like creatures in the Philippines: the Tagalog mandurugo ("blood-sucker") and the Visayan manananggal ("self-segmenter"). The mandurugo is a variety of the aswang that takes the form of an attractive girl by day, and develops wings and a long, hollow, thread-like tongue by night. The tongue is used to suck up blood from a sleeping victim. The manananggal is described as being an older, beautiful woman capable of severing its upper torso in order to fly into the night with huge bat-like wings and prey on unsuspecting, sleeping pregnant women in their homes. They use an elongated proboscis-like tongue to suck fetuses off these pregnant women. They also prefer to eat entrails (specifically the heart and the liver) and the phlegm of sick people.[79]
The Malaysian Penanggalan may be either a beautiful old or young woman who obtained her beauty through the active use of black magic or other unnatural means, and is most commonly described in local folklores to be dark or demonic in nature. She is able to detach her fanged head which flies around in the night looking for blood, typically from pregnant women.[80] Malaysians would hang jeruju (thistles) around the doors and windows of houses, hoping the Penanggalan would not enter for fear of catching its intestines on the thorns.[81] The Leyak is a similar being from Balinese folklore.[82] A Kuntilanak or Matianak in Indonesia,[83] or Pontianak or Langsuir in Malaysia,[84] is a woman who died during childbirth and became undead, seeking revenge and terrorizing villages. She appeared as an attractive woman with long black hair that covered a hole in the back of her neck, which she sucked the blood of children with. Filling the hole with her hair would drive her off. Corpses had their mouths filled with glass beads, eggs under each armpit, and needles in their palms to prevent them from becoming langsuir.[85]
Jiang Shi (traditional Chinese: 僵屍 or 殭屍; simplified Chinese: 僵尸; pinyin: jiāngshī; literally "stiff corpse"), sometimes called "Chinese vampires" by Westerners, are reanimated corpses that hop around, killing living creatures to absorb life essence (qì) from their victims. They are said to be created when a person's soul (魄 pò) fails to leave the deceased's body.[86] One unusual feature of this vampire is its greenish-white furry skin, perhaps derived from fungus or mould growing on corpses.[87]
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Modern beliefs

In modern fiction, the vampire tends to be depicted as a suave, charismatic villain.[22] Despite the general disbelief in vampiric entities, occasional sightings of vampires are reported. Indeed, vampire hunting societies still exist, although they are largely formed for social reasons.[20] Allegations of vampire attacks swept through the African country of Malawi during late 2002 and early 2003, with mobs stoning one individual to death and attacking at least four others, including Governor Eric Chiwaya, based on the belief that the government was colluding with vampires.[88]
In early 1970 local press spread rumors that a vampire haunted Highgate Cemetery in London. Amateur vampire hunters flocked in large numbers to the cemetery. Several books have been written about the case, notably by Sean Manchester, a local man who was among the first to suggest the existence of the "Highgate Vampire" and who later claimed to have exorcised and destroyed a whole nest of vampires in the area.[89] In January 2005, rumours circulated that an attacker had bitten a number of people in Birmingham, England, fuelling concerns about a vampire roaming the streets. However, local police stated that no such crime had been reported and that the case appears to be an urban legend.[90]
In one of the more notable cases of vampiric entities in the modern age, the chupacabra ("goat-sucker") of Puerto Rico and Mexico is said to be a creature that feeds upon the flesh or drinks the blood of domesticated animals, leading some to consider it a kind of vampire. The "chupacabra hysteria" was frequently associated with deep economic and political crises, particularly during the mid-1990s.[91]
In Europe, where much of the vampire folklore originates, the vampire is considered a fictitious being, although many communities have embraced the revenant for economic purposes. In some cases, especially in small localities, vampire superstition is still rampant and sightings or claims of vampire attacks occur frequently. In Romania during February 2004, several relatives of Toma Petre feared that he had become a vampire. They dug up his corpse, tore out his heart, burned it, and mixed the ashes with water in order to drink it.[92]
Vampirism also represents a relevant part of modern day's occultist movements. The mythos of the vampire, his magickal qualities, allure, and predatory archetype express a strong symbolism that can be used in ritual, energy work, and magick, and can even be adopted as a spiritual system. The vampire has been part of the occult society in Europe for centuries and has spread into the American sub-culture as well for more than a decade, being strongly influenced by and mixed with the neo gothic aesthetics.[93]

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Origins of vampire beliefs

Main article: Origins of vampire beliefs‎

Pathology

Belief in vampires has been described as the result of people of pre-industrial societies attempting to explain the process of death and decomposition.[94]
People sometimes suspected vampirism when a cadaver did not look as they thought a normal corpse should when disinterred. However, rates of decomposition vary depending on temperature and soil composition, and many of the signs are little known. This has led vampire hunters to mistakenly conclude that a dead body had not decomposed at all, or, ironically, to interpret signs of decomposition as signs of continued life.[95][96] Corpses swell as gases from decomposition accumulate in the torso and the increased pressure forces blood to ooze from the nose and mouth. This causes the body to look "plump", "well-fed", and "ruddy" - changes that are all the more striking if the person was pale or thin in life.[97] The exuding blood gave the impression that the corpse had recently been engaging in vampiric activity.[34] Darkening of the skin is also caused by decomposition.[98] The staking of a swollen, decomposing body could cause the body to bleed and force the accumulated gases to escape the body. This could produce a groan-like sound when the gases moved past the vocal cords, or a sound reminiscent of flatulence when they passed through the anus.[99]
After death, the skin and gums lose fluids and contract, exposing the roots of the hair, nails, and teeth, even teeth that were concealed in the jaw. This can produce the illusion that the hair, nails, and teeth have grown. At a certain stage, the nails fall off and the skin peels away, as reported in the Plogojowitz case-the dermis and nail beds emerging underneath were interpreted as "new skin" and "new nails".[99]
In some cases in which people reported sounds emanating from a specific coffin, it was later dug up and fingernail marks were discovered on the inside from the victim trying to escape. In other cases the person would hit their heads, noses or faces and it would appear that they had been "feeding".[100] A problem with this theory is the question of how people presumably buried alive managed to stay alive for any extended period without food, water or fresh air. An alternate explanation for noise is the bubbling of escaping gases from natural decomposition of bodies.[101] Another likely cause of disordered tombs is grave robbing.[102]

Disease

Folkloric vampirism has been associated with a series of deaths due to unidentifiable or mysterious illnesses, usually within the same family or the same small community.[74] Tuberculosis and the pneumonic form of bubonic plague were associated with breakdown of lung tissue which would cause blood to appear at the lips.[103] Dr Juan Gómez-Alonso, a neurologist at Xeral Hospital in Vigo, Spain, examined the possibility of a link with rabies in the journal Neurology. The susceptibility to garlic and light could be due to rabies-induced hypersensitivity. The disease can also affect portions of the brain that could lead to disturbance of normal sleep patterns (thus becoming nocturnal) and hypersexuality. Legend once said a man was not rabid if he could look at his own reflection (an allusion to the legend that vampires have no reflection). Wolves and bats, which are often associated with vampires, can be carriers of rabies. The disease can also lead to a drive to bite others and to a bloody frothing at the mouth.[104][105]

Porphyria

In 1985 biochemist David Dolphin proposed a link between the rare blood disorder porphyria and vampire folklore. Noting that the condition is treated by intravenous haem, he suggested that the consumption of large amounts of blood may result in haem being transported somehow across the stomach wall and into the bloodstream. Thus vampires were merely sufferers of porphyria seeking to replace haem and alleviate their symptoms.[106] The theory has been rebuffed medically, as suggestions that sufferers crave the haem in human blood or that the consumption of blood might ease the symptoms are based on a misunderstanding of the disease. Furthermore, Dolphin was noted to have confused fictional bloodsucking vampires with those of folklore, many of whom were not noted to drink blood.[107] Similarly, a parallel is made between sensitivity to sunlight by sufferers, yet this was associated with fictional and not folkloric vampires. Dolphin did not publish his work more widely.[108] Despite being dismissed by experts, the theory gained media attention.[109] and entered popular modern folklore.[110]

Psychopathology

See also: Clinical vampirism A number of murderers have performed seemingly vampiric rituals upon their victims. Serial killers Peter Kurten and Richard Trenton Chase were both called "vampires" in the tabloids after they were discovered drinking the blood of the people they murdered. Similarly, in 1932, an unsolved murder case in Stockholm, Sweden was nicknamed the "Vampire murder", due to the circumstances of the victim's death.[111] The late 16th-century Hungarian countess and mass murderer Elizabeth Báthory became particularly infamous in later centuries' works, which depicted her bathing in her victims' blood in order to retain beauty or youth.[112]
Vampire lifestyle is a term for a contemporary subculture of people, largely within the Goth subculture, who consume the blood of others as a pastime; drawing from the rich recent history of popular culture related to cult symbolism, horror films, the fiction of Anne Rice, and the styles of Victorian England.[113] Active vampirism within the vampire subculture includes both blood-related vampirism, commonly referred to as Sanguine Vampirism, and Psychic Vampirism, or 'feeding' from pranic energy. Practitioners may take on a variety of 'roles', including both "vampires" and their sources of blood or pranic energy.[114]


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vampire

unfortunately all that Montague Summer's influenced information has been beaten into the grave (pun intended). How about pasting some relevant theories from Carl Jung, Konstantinos, Blavatsky, Steiner (any Theosophical group), the Qliphothic Qabalah, the Dragon Rouge, Michael W. Ford, Michelle Belanger or of course my favorite The Asetian Bible from Luis Marques?

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The real spokesperson for The Asetian Bible huh???

And may haps many who are involved in this pseudo-arcane movement should base their religious history upon accurate information! Maybe starting with ancient Sumarian texts for starters???? Just a thought mind you ..... "but what do I know!"

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can respect the fact that you are representing a faction of the vampire belief system .... thats acceptable. But like any other organized *religion* or *cult* on this planet .... its just another form of trying to understand the great UNKNOWABLE .... and basically thats what every religion/spiritual organization/cult/sect is .... an attempt to understand something far superior to themselves. Nothing special about any of them really! "But whatever floats the boat as they say!"

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am not a spokesperson for the Aset Ka
Egypt / Kemet is older than Mesopotamia
'pseudo-arcane? Can you back that up with any evidence?
What's with all this hostility?
You spelled 'Sumerian' & 'pseudo' wrong by the way
Lestat is another fictional being (Ann Rice)
Obviously you excel at fiction

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Hey! No need for the nastiness! If you believe in your path .... thats what counts .... far be it of me to interfere! (And thank you for catching my spelling errors.) "It happens when I type a little to fast!" Once again thank you! Interesting ... somewhere older than the cradle of western civilization??? Interesting indeed! I guess I'll throw out all those scholarly history books ..... they were all wrong!

A hint my friend .... you can usually guess the viability of a religion by how fierce its believers defend it!

A true religion stands the test of TIME ..... history has proven this time and time again.

But history has also shown that religions also die ..... just like everything else in life.

Anyway ..... good luck with your belief system and its convoluted paradigms!

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What history books are you reading? Yeah, throw them out.
You used the wrong 'to' should have been 'too'
Sumerians have the oldest documented writings / language.
I don't need hints, but thanks anyway.
The Egyptian religion lasted longer than any religion thus far . . . definitely throw those books out.
Nothing really dies in life . . . energy cannot be destroyed, it merely changes.
More books are in your future.
'convoluted paradigms' ? . . . could you elaborate on that?
May I ask what belief system you follow?

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I guess I should also throw out my college education too! (Did I get that right this time around!). And what's with all this less than subtle abrasive attitude being thrown about??? You seem to be the one who is hostile here ... not I. And why the hard-core defense for the Asetian Bible ..... its just a damn book! Geez!


What system do I follow ..... mmmmm .... I guess I could qualify myself as a misguided American Taoist who also practices sorcery. Nothing special.

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I'm 47, I don't even remember college at this point
The attitude comes from dozens of people on this forum that seem to have a problem with Asetians and my understandings of vampirism.
I am not being hostile
YOU began by declaring your Wiki knowledge of vampirism to be the 'end all' of this discussion which insinuates the rest of us should just shut up.
i defend my beliefs, they did not come over night, I am an Asetianist and it is not some . . 'DAMN BOOK'
I find your words to be aggressive, degrading, ostracizing and not the words that Lao Tzu would be supportive of.

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Good ... I am 45 EtuMalku. And a book is just a book .... nothing more .... nothing less. At no time have I meant to insult your personal beliefs; and if I have I'm at least man enough to apologize! SORRY! .... OK. Your beliefs are your's and your's alone! Have I poked fun at the term *book* .... damn right I have! I state again .... a book is just a damn f*cking book! Its the belief invested that counts .... not the friggin' written word!

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Recent discoveries in the Valley of Kings places the written language of the Egyptians before that of the Sumerians. I posted about it awhile back. I've read people argue that hieroglyphs aren't a written language, etc., but I find that argument unconvincing and petty. The fact is that most people have accepted that Sumerian culture is older, so the new discoveries aren't very well received or acknowledged, but that doesn't change what has been learned.

Besides...Egypt and Sumeria were so close as to make it a moot point in my opinion.

Anyway......I don't know, lol, I was just stopping in to pass some time. This thread is getting very large. You all are obsessed with vampires, lol.

You two make me feel young, lol. All that talk about 45, 47. It could be the nitric oxide I'm ingesting, though. That stuff is so good for the veins....you all should try it, hehe.

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