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May 24 2016 10:30pm
I saw some other posts on this forum that made me think some poor info is out there. Mainly mention of balancing issues and lack of tanks?

At this point the balance is pretty solid. It is rock/paper/scissors type balancing, where no single pick is OP, and there is at least one other pick that has a large advantage on that pick. The only character that was OP was probably Genji for the first couple weeks after his release, when he could shuriken snipe across the map for headshot kills on anyone not moving, i.e. snipers, and he could jump Torb's turrets faster than they could track him, so he could shred them close range without getting hit, and he could swift strike through Bastions shield to near instant kill him from behind. Basically meaning he was a hard counter for every defensive pick. Now his shuriken damage was nerfed, Torb's turret tracks faster, and Bastion no longer has a shield that is easily bypassed. Still a great anti-Widowmaker pick, because nothing beats deflecting a snipe from across the map back into Widowmaker for a headshot kill.

Other than Genji's previous OPness, the game has been pretty balanced. Some maps favor certain picks, and sometimes certain picks are better for a particular section of the map, and some picks are strong counters for others. Also there is a skill level difference that makes a change to how a character can be played. Lucio is a simple line of sight aoe healer, with fairly weak attacks. But he has a strong knockback special and can wall ride. New players will play him on ground level as a healer, focusing on ulting their team. Experienced players will be playing him by running him on the walls as much as possible, and be focused more on kills than healing, because mid range he does about as much DPS as anyone else, and he can self heal while having the highest mobility in the game, supposing you wall ride like a pro, and use his speed boost.

As for tanks, there are 5 of them last I counted. Winston who can drop a bubble shield that protect everyone in it, but the bubble is now much weaker than it was in closed beta when a popular strat was multiple Winstons laying overlapping shields to form an impenetrable area for ranged teammates to safely shoot from. There is Zarya who can apply shields to teammates and herself to increase her own energy output which increases her weapon damage. Roadhog, is a self healing tank, who can heal quickly and frequently, making him really good for hit and run engagements, where he can duck back and heal, then re-engage. DVA is a good pick for protecting a team while attacking as she can put up a projectile shield that blocks all projectiles aimed at her and those next to her until it expires, and arguably has the best point clear ult in the game. Last but not least, Reinhardt is a true beast, but I actually find his tank role to be simple and boring. he can provide a shield for his team that has no expiration timer, but only faces one way, and can be broken by characters like reaper pretty quickly, and bypassed completely by energy weapons like Symetra's charged shot. that being said, he is absolutely devastating if you play him as a close range flanker. Learn the map, then use him to ambush out of tunnels at close range, and you can literally smash your way through an entire opposing team.

This is all my opinion of course, and you are welcome to disagree. Also I should mention I primarily played Widowmaker, and can tell you that her grappling hook is less than ideal. Long cooldown, and a tendency to grab things you are not aiming at because they were "closer" and in the same general direction. Not to mention you have to learn all the maps to know what surfaces you simply can't grapple too. Also, not well known, but she has a max range, her bullets just disappear at a certain distance, although I don't think there are any spots left where that is an actual issue.
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May 24 2016 11:00pm
I think Reinhardt is a little strong
Would like to see 500 HP less on his shield even if that means buffing his main HP a bit

This post was edited by FroggyG on May 24 2016 11:00pm
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May 25 2016 01:56am
Reinhardt shield is easy to break if you team focuses on it or you pick bastion you can destroy it yourself in seconds
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May 25 2016 07:35pm
Quote (Sithrael @ May 25 2016 01:56am)
Reinhardt shield is easy to break if you team focuses on it or you pick bastion you can destroy it yourself in seconds


Sorry but I think you're just wrong
If you put 2000 damage into his shield your entire team is probably already dead unless you have your own Reinhardt
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May 26 2016 02:29am
Honestly, Reinhardt's shield is his worse skill imo. If he is shielding he is not doing anything else, and anyone with decent mobility can get behind him and waste him. Not to mention symetra can take him out in like 3 hits right through the shield. It really works only if the part of the map allows it, i.e narrow corridors, and even then its not ideal. I never really found his shield to be an effective deterrent. Like I said above, I mained Widowmaker, and I would just grapple to somewhere on his flank or behind him, then get a headshot or two in, and down he would go. Breaking it is also an option, depending on team comp, if you have torb, bastion, and junkrat, yeah, that shield is going to last seconds at best. Probably the best counter pick is pharah, Reinhardt has one skill that can hit a flying target and it moves so slow it is incredibly easy to dodge. Also, rockets can easily eat through the shield, but mostly you just fly over him and kill him from above.

This post was edited by BadIdeas on May 26 2016 02:29am
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May 26 2016 02:33am
Quote (BadIdeas @ May 26 2016 02:29am)
Honestly, Reinhardt's shield is his worse skill imo. If he is shielding he is not doing anything else, and anyone with decent mobility can get behind him and waste him. Not to mention symetra can take him out in like 3 hits right through the shield. It really works only if the part of the map allows it, i.e narrow corridors, and even then its not ideal. I never really found his shield to be an effective deterrent. Like I said above, I mained Widowmaker, and I would just grapple to somewhere on his flank or behind him, then get a headshot or two in, and down he would go. Breaking it is also an option, depending on team comp, if you have torb, bastion, and junkrat, yeah, that shield is going to last seconds at best. Probably the best counter pick is pharah, Reinhardt has one skill that can hit a flying target and it moves so slow it is incredibly easy to dodge. Also, rockets can easily eat through the shield, but mostly you just fly over him and kill him from above.


We must not be playing the same game..
There are other people behind his shield blasting you through it

It's not like you're 1v1ing him...
Nothing you said had anything to do with the team vs team aspect of the game (the whole game)

This post was edited by FroggyG on May 26 2016 02:35am
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May 26 2016 02:36am
I feel like the hook was designed to help deter the old "sit and snipe" or "camp" mentality that was created from halo and cod. I don't think widowmaker is supposed to be like spiderman, swinging all over the place, but rather sniping a few shots, then re-positioning periodically and/or as needed. If you are getting lots of head shots, then you know how strong she is without a constant hook.

As for grabbing things that you do not intend, I think something like the reaper teleport visual could help...show a faint glow where it will land. That way you know if anything is interfering.

This post was edited by Commm on May 26 2016 02:37am
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May 26 2016 02:47am
Quote (Commm @ May 26 2016 02:36am)
I feel like the hook was designed to help deter the old "sit and snipe" or "camp" mentality that was created from halo and cod. I don't think widowmaker is supposed to be like spiderman, swinging all over the place, but rather sniping a few shots, then re-positioning periodically and/or as needed. If you are getting lots of head shots, then you know how strong she is without a constant hook.

As for grabbing things that you do not intend, I think something like the reaper teleport visual could help...show a faint glow where it will land. That way you know if anything is interfering.


Her grappling hook is incredibly powerful.
I don't agree with most of what OP is saying to be honest.

A good Widowmaker is absolutely devastating due to her amazing ability to reposition and just keep headshotting people.
Bad ones normally sit in a corner and snipe and maybe get a couple kills but are overall garbage.

This post was edited by FroggyG on May 26 2016 02:51am
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May 29 2016 12:35pm
*sigh*
Quote (FroggyG @ May 26 2016 01:33am)
We must not be playing the same game..
There are other people behind his shield blasting you through it

It's not like you're 1v1ing him...
Nothing you said had anything to do with the team vs team aspect of the game (the whole game)


Obviously you are not going to charge straight in at a team behind a Reinhardt shield and try to launch over it with Pharah to kill Reinhardt. I thought that was so blatantly obvious it would not need to be mentioned, but obviously it does. Don't do that. If they are clustering in behind Reinhardt, then it is incredibly easy to wipe the lot of them. About half the ults in the game are perfect to wipe an entire team that groups too tightly. If you are having problems with people hiding behind his shield consistently, then just flank, ult, or use junkrat to bounce grenades off the walls so they land behind the shield. I told you how to deal with him 1v1 because you mentioned specifically him being hard to deal with, not him making it hard to deal with the rest of his team. Which if anything it makes his team easy to deal with. Reinhardt moves incredibly slowly while shielding so you have plenty of time to line up shots or flank. Also, symetra, symetra, symetra. Her alt fire passes through the shield, and players alike. Just charge it behind cover, duck out, fire it out Reinhardt, duck back under cover, and repeat. Not to mention her turrets are ideal for traps in chokepoints so that when Reinhardy leaves a tunnel, or moves past an entrance, you can have all 6 turrets around it so they cook him, or he has to drop shield and run.

As for Widowmaker and her hook....it has a 13 second cooldown. Winston on the other hand has half that cooldown on his leap, which can take him to about 2/3 the locations Widowmaker's hook can. meaning there are picks that are far more mobile than Widowmaker, and can effectively shut her down in most situations if played correctly. Also, I am not saying her hook is bad per say, just not great. Long Cd's and very gimmicky depending on maps and location. There are tons of surfaces that look like you can hook to them, but you can't, and I can't count the number of times I aimed at a point 20-30ft away, and it hooks to something 5 ft away, sometimes not even in my field of vision.
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