Don't discuss any flat changes to abilities here, just discuss about the current state!

Hey guys,

so after that post of Paul in the other thread, I thought about testing it out.



I think that there are 3 ways to use any casting ability that charges with weapons and this topic should only focus on these.

• Using regular EE weapon + stat armor + stat charm + acc casting ee charm, putting zero points into int
  
• Using regular EE weapon + stat armor + stat charm + acc casting ee charm, get all points into int
  
• Going some weird hybrid build with putting points into int and other stats and cast + click with weapon

I only went for the first option, because for me that is the one that make the most sense.


So for the next 3 climb I was messing around with Xcast of monk (since I am a monk lol).

The first climb was actually pretty horrendous, I had to drive and use 3 abilities where one was using an attack charm instead of melee weapom, ugh!
So I just went for 2 abilities for the next 2 climbs. But I guess those abilities start to really shine if you are using at least 3 (if using only ones from your class)

Basic settings where:

ONLY WHISTLE CLIMB

• ee weapon
  
• dex robe
  
• dex +int charm
  
• casting charm
  
• all points into dex

The first climb I started at lvl 55 using the cast abilities and for the other 2 at lvl 20.

results(picture are big, that's why only a link)

1. climb: https://i.imgur.com/9J2zN3R.png
2. climb: https://i.imgur.com/tpOUQQa.png
3. climb: https://i.imgur.com/dJeJ861.png

I've yet to do a "standard" climb to compare, but from experiences in the past with samurai my avg damage was slightly higher by ~50avg
For the moment it looks like that using this ability is at least notworsethan using another one (granted my equipment wasn't that bad)

What i realized is that, you need to use this ability at least at 112% to do about the same damage like your regular attack and after that it does visually more damage, but always less than a higher as 80%+ charged crosstrike
For that reason I went for a higher ability percentage and I highly advise to pump your offcast ability higher than your melee abilities, so it charged to ~125% in the same time your melee hits ~80%

Now I'd like you (the community) to test it yourself, post your results (stats for 55-71 to compare) and check out the ones other classes have.

As Paul stated in his other topic he can buff them, but he won't change the casting style.
So that is our chance to make them used more often!

Forgot to say: I won't put any points into intelligence, because you don't need any of the mana it provides, since you only cast with the ability!

Since people are unable to read: Only change is using some skill points into a casting ability and an ee charm in acc slot. The build is full melee and used with the exact same gear otherwise!

This post was edited by Meridius on Jul 19 2018 05:19pm

Time frame on climb ?

normal speed these days around 1h

at last Tim dropped 69ish and we had to wait, thats why time is higher

This post was edited by Meridius on Jul 19 2018 04:48pm

Your whole topic is nulled due to that gear in my opinion. If we're changing the game for the better, we're not going to do it around the top 1% gear in the game. I respect that you chose to post this and add some hard collected data though.

If that climb was 6 hours, which is probably reasonable for a solo, a newer player attempting this, hell even myself with 9k FG to go attempt this, it would take me 15 hours to do a climb.

This post was edited by Joshie on Jul 19 2018 04:49pm

Paul stated that these abilities are viable, but he didn't say they should work in solo.

We can test this aswell, and you can go ahead doing it. You can test it with lower gear and compare it.

That is what I want you to do. We need everyone to test this, so we can give a valid feedback to Paul. He is basically right when he says that we judge without testing atm

There's just zero reason to do it. You know what would make these abilities useful? Including content that makes it useful. Why should I require 2 different damage types when monsters die in 2-3 hits. So I can melee the fire immune guy the odd time he spawns, the odd time he casts his immunity before I kill him?
Introduce monsters that are strong, and rewarding. That happens to change immunity over the course of the fight, and you're locked down there fighting it.


Where's your heal charm? How are you going to defeat strong monsters without a healing charm? Pay millions of fg in fish every time you run into an EP, and without EE on your armor? Fat chance.


So lets recape.

Impossible to put together.
Cannot tank without incredible tank armor with stats
Cannot heal without incredible heal charm with stats
Does less damage than any other damaging member of your party, since you're not asked to do the other rolls just go full damage


This post was edited by Joshie on Jul 19 2018 05:04pm

with the gear I have I would not be able to do a hybrid build. 1-71 solo takes me about a week to do

You are only showing that even with the best gear we can get, which only a small portion of the community could get, that going hybrid is bad and a waste of time.

Theres literally no reason to go for that kind of build if you can go full melee or cast, hell even offcasting is way better than this kinda of build

This post was edited by DOHtrader on Jul 19 2018 05:05pm

who says, that every ability must be useable for solo?

I do runs in a climb, I am not supposed to heal as a monk, paladin, ninja, samurai etc.
I obviously can, but I don't need to.

Why to use another damage type? It is not about the type it is about using more than 2 abilities. With doing this and some better managing of keys I can use 3 abilities as monk at high percentage and do more damage.



I did more damage than full melee and I were full melee. Only change is that I use one other ability lol

This post was edited by Meridius on Jul 19 2018 05:04pm

These abilities aren’t that great in solo which is the only reason I haven’t climbed with them more. However I have used some of the hybrid casting abilities, mainly for fun. Calculating amazing hybrid gear based on what I tested, it is definitely viable in a whistle climb but much more useful to be a hybrid damage char in a group-explore going toward high lvl.

The point of hybrid attack charge/ damage casting is not actually to do the most damage to the most monsters the fastest, which is probably the reason very few people ever try it. Rather the point is to be able to heal effectively on melee characters without absolutely obliterating any hope of dealing damage.

I like the 3 gear choices you’ve listed, but there are actually many ways to gear this type of character, and it will of course depend also on group composition, end-lvl goal, etc.

Paladin was the most effective at what I wanted to make a hybrid for using the following gear choices, stats, and skills:

EE / int weapon; EE / Int / HM armor; EE stat damage charm; EE heal.
Statting all points into Int
Holy cross first and foremost; either frontcast or castabove; then healback.

At low levels you don’t really need to heal the group so it seems almost like a waste of time, but around lvl 70+ it’s actually pretty effective, especially against larger waves of EPs without a caster. I do think that damage needs to be buffed, and I wish there was more of a knockdown-type “hits any row” ability to be more useful in solo play, but this kind of build still has its uses, even if it gets no love in whistlemode

This post was edited by BWConformity on Jul 19 2018 05:09pm