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Jun 8 2013 03:34am
Quote (brmv @ Jun 8 2013 02:32am)
some gmos do
at the expense of bio-diversity and soil quality
just take the 'round-up ready' versions
since the crop can take heaps of poisonous round-up and potential pests are eliminated there is by default higher yield
but who wants to eat that crap? no worries enough traces make it into the foodchain
and ~2/3 of processed food in the usa contain gmos
there are plenty new non-gm varieties developed though
creating higher yield and/or viable for poorer soil


No they do not increase yields.

http://boingboing.net/2013/03/29/do-gmos-yield-more-food-the-a.html

http://www.organicconsumers.org/articles/article_17250.cfm

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Jun 8 2013 03:45am
Quote (aliquis @ 8 Jun 2013 09:34)


from your link:

The UCS is correct that GMOs plants don't seem to produce higher intrinsic yields — that is, there aren't more kernels per cob. But the data that shows GMO plants can produce more than conventionally bred plants is also correct, because that's looking at a bigger picture of "yield" — one that takes into account the fact that it's easier to protect those plants against pests. Fewer pests = fewer lost plants = a higher bushel-per-acre yield. Even if the plants, themselves, aren't yielding more.

exactly what i was saying, only in different words B)
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Jun 8 2013 04:00am
Quote (brmv @ Jun 8 2013 03:45am)
from your link:

The UCS is correct that GMOs plants don't seem to produce higher intrinsic yields — that is, there aren't more kernels per cob. But the data that shows GMO plants can produce more than conventionally bred plants is also correct, because that's looking at a bigger picture of "yield" — one that takes into account the fact that it's easier to protect those plants against pests. Fewer pests = fewer lost plants = a higher bushel-per-acre yield. Even if the plants, themselves, aren't yielding more.

exactly what i was saying, only in different words B)


You are being rather selective there.

"a paper published this February in Nature Biotechnology which shows that GM corn sometimes out-produces conventionally bred corn and sometimes under-produces in comparison. The key is in the environmental context"

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Jun 8 2013 04:11am
"GM crops are often claimed to give higher yields than naturally bred varieties. But the data do not support this claim. At best, GM crops have performed no better than their non-GM counterparts, with GM soybeans giving consistently lower yields.3

Controlled field trials comparing GM and non-GM soy production suggested that 50% of the drop in yield is due to the disruption in genes caused by the GM transformation process.4 Similarly, field tests of Bt maize hybrids showed that they took longer to reach maturity and produced up to 12% lower yields than their non-GM counterparts.5

A US Department of Agriculture report confirmed the poor yield performance of GM crops, saying, “GE [genetically engineered] crops available for commercial use do not increase the yield potential of a variety. In fact, yield may even decrease.... Perhaps the biggest issue raised by these results is how to explain the rapid adoption of GE crops when farm financial impacts appear to be mixed or even negative.”

http://earthopensource.org/index.php/5-gm-crops-impacts-on-the-farm-and-environment/5-1-myth-gm-crops-increase-yield-potential
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Jun 8 2013 05:11am
Quote (aliquis @ 8 Jun 2013 10:00)
You are being rather selective there.
"a paper published this February in Nature Biotechnology which shows that GM corn sometimes out-produces conventionally bred corn and sometimes under-produces in comparison. The key is in the environmental context"


did you actually read what i wrote?

Quote (brmv @ 8 Jun 2013 08:32)
some gmos do
...
since the crop can take heaps of poisonous round-up and potential pests are eliminated there is by default higher yield
...


since agricultural yield is calculated as yield per unit of area and not 'intrisic yield' which is used rather for plant productivity
there are certainly SOME GMOS which do (as i said)
in case you haven't noticed: i am utterly against gmos (at least until there is genuine prove they are harmless, after that prove i will drop the 'utterly')
but if you want to discuss the issue objectively you should not make absolute claims you cannot back up
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Jun 8 2013 08:33am
Yo i have actually done alot of research on GMO food most of it being good but they will not necessialry solve the problem of shortage, usually just supplements and whatnot(think of the vitamin A golden rice for third world countries).

There are two arguments, think of like canola oil for a good one (canada pride)

another, an example being an article I read like 7 years ago about 30% larger fish via GMO, but bout three years later they realized they reproduced at a 40% slower rate so it did not help.
It is very hard to know wtf GMO food will do in the future as there has been NOOOOOOOOOO long term testing on the shit.


there are really three things I can think of that will help the problem and are relevant and going on worldwide today.
1) Plants being able to grow in shittier soil
2) People need to realize how abundant insects are on this plant and realize that they are a great source of protein (I honestly do not think I would be ok with this but it is so true)
3) http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-16972761 ----> these things are being cooked later this month, HELLA expensive right now but if it the process is refined who knows.
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Jun 8 2013 11:00am
Quote (brmv @ Jun 8 2013 05:11am)
but if you want to discuss the issue objectively you should not make absolute claims you cannot back up


1. You haven't backed up anything yourself.

2. Whether you're for them or against them has nothing to do with the issue.

3. You ignore all evidence that disagrees with you.

"GM crops are often claimed to give higher yields than naturally bred varieties. But the data do not support this claim. At best, GM crops have performed no better than their non-GM counterparts, with GM soybeans giving consistently lower yields.3

Controlled field trials comparing GM and non-GM soy production suggested that 50% of the drop in yield is due to the disruption in genes caused by the GM transformation process.4 Similarly, field tests of Bt maize hybrids showed that they took longer to reach maturity and produced up to 12% lower yields than their non-GM counterparts.5

A US Department of Agriculture report confirmed the poor yield performance of GM crops, saying, “GE [genetically engineered] crops available for commercial use do not increase the yield potential of a variety. In fact, yield may even decrease.... Perhaps the biggest issue raised by these results is how to explain the rapid adoption of GE crops when farm financial impacts appear to be mixed or even negative.”6


http://earthopensource.org/index.php/5-gm-crops-impacts-on-the-farm-and-environment/5-1-myth-gm-crops-increase-yield-potential

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Jun 8 2013 05:49pm
@
Quote (aliquis @ 8 Jun 2013 17:00)


don't you recognise that you are barking at the wrong tree? my user-name is not 'cialda'
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Jun 8 2013 05:55pm
Quote (brmv @ Jun 8 2013 05:49pm)
@

don't you recognise that you are barking at the wrong tree? my user-name is not 'cialda'


Then don't troll. Especially not about something like this. You either know the facts or you don't.
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Jun 8 2013 06:24pm
Quote (aliquis @ 8 Jun 2013 23:55)
Then don't troll. Especially not about something like this. You either know the facts or you don't.


not trolling but giving a reality check
you only want to see the facts you want to see, just like 'cialda' - don't you realise that?
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