Turtle pwns all, u dont have to use "SG" to make 2 water hit, u just gotta know what angle ( not high angle ) and power to use to make it hit even touch they dont connect in time

its quite ez, i prefer Turtle over Ice. Ice just sucks to me ._. if ur good at Ss + Thor with turtle = GG ._. Ice has -Def, but so what. S2 does like 130 on first shot. Every bot can take out Ice easily be4 he even gets the chance to do some critical dmg with -Def's.