Panda is a fucking boss, who the fuck are you kidding? Mad evasion on a high strength hero with multiple skills that make him near impossible to kill.

Who cares if you're impossible to kill. If you don't do anything in the process of becoming a tank, you're worthless. I clearly defined the tank role; he does not meet the qualifications.

Also, he is hardly one of the toughest heroes in the game. Many others can outlive the panda.

He puts our a ridiculous amount of damage and disable.

There is no such thing as 'tank' in DotA, you're not playing WoW, you don't hold agro. He can soak up damage and put out damage, in addition to a large quantity of disables and pseudo invincibility.

What?

Did you even read my previous posts?

I'll remind you again, I clearly defined what I meant by, "tank."

The only tank by the WoW definition would be akin to Axe.

He doesn't output that much damage. He has a single small burst nuke; that's pretty much it for damaging abilities. Crit on him is hardly any damage at all. Comparatively, your major DPSers will all far out do his damage with normal attacks. Where is this massive damage coming from? His Ulti doesn't do terrible damage, but it's hardly ridiculous.

The thing with initiators is, they blow their wads initiating. Then they get ignored. Panda is an even more extreme case of this. It's even harder to kill him, as most of your damage probably won't make it to his actual HPs. He will be ignored most of the time. I'm not saying don't get survivability items on him. Bracers and phaseboots are great for the panda.

If you're looking to panda for DPSer, you're looking at the wrong hero. He can do it, just as any other hero could, but he's just not very good at it. At best, he makes for a pseudo semi-carry. He is much more inclined to be a supportive hero than a carry.

This post was edited by deathbypepsi on Sep 4 2009 09:07pm

Axe puts out a ridiculous amount of damage, and all of his skills go through magic immunity.
Crit puts out a ton of dps with armlet, and you can once again soak up a ton of damage with the evasion and high hp.
If you seriously think Panda does nothing in team fights then you're obviously a pubstar rand who has no clue how DotA works. Support hero, lol, thank you for confirming that you're a complete moron.

sucky advice...
if you like to kill with the ulti of the panda get bloodstone, aghanim, hot, pt
+move speed, dam, and hp doesnt changes the stats of your little pandas

lol

panda build - phase, bottle/pers, dagger

done

It really depends on what other characters you have with you i liek to carry with panda because hes a damn damage dealer Shivas and necrobook are dumb as anything, early pers and bottle are good for panda but treads > phase based on the fact he has a crit ability so more speed is good with him

My build Order Bottle 2 Bracers Treads pers

Crit really doesn't put out that much DPS with armlet. Look at Leoric for a prime example of this. Neither the Panda or SK are exceptional carries; they're both severely outclassed by other heroes, in this meta at least.

The Panda doesn't put out anywhere near enough physical DPS in comparison to stronger physical damage heroes, like Sven, Naix, and DK (I chose them specifically because they all can function off of armlet as DPS heroes). All of them outclass him in terms of DPS, at all points in the game.

I never said he does nothing in team fights. I actually stated exactly what he is supposed to do during those circumstances.

Your weak attempts at straw-manning my argument are growing tiresome. You've offered no proof to back any of your claims. The entirety of your argument is basically, "str hero, crit, evasion=good carry," essentially ignoring all the facts that indicate he's mediocre at DPS and his abilities allow him to be stronger at other roles.

This post was edited by deathbypepsi on Sep 6 2009 11:50am

Just to be clear mate if u think armlet will help you i think ure wrong. Armelt is a nice item for barathrum...etc

so pls show me your whole build that uve have tested by yourself in "decent" i repeat "decent" games and not public or allstars channel.