Quote (BombPopBob2 @ Sun, Aug 2 2009, 04:17am)
But if you are playing competitve DotA in a non-EM game. It is going to be over 40 minutes before you hit mid-game. By that time; the guy that has farmed the most efficiently is the guy that is going to be most successful (if you level the playing field and assume that everyone's "skill" is equal). In this case, you will put 1 point into teleport, 1 into the tree lock, and then max the farming skills. In this case, you would need a significant amount of mana regen -- noting, of course, the low CD's on these farming skills.
When figuring out what builds to go with in DotA, your first hint should be to look at how the skills were set up. Furion has ZERO nukes, THREE skills that help him farm, and then one skill that is not even a "disable," but which holds an enemy in a spot for a significantly long period of time, at a distance from which only a ranged hero could destroy. In order to take advantage of this combination, one would use the skills to rake in gold to stack DPS, and then use that DPS to kill. If you want a flaming support hero pick one. This is CLEARLY not one.
Actually, that works for my argument just as well. Stacking DPS is the semi-carryish build I described with deso, not your bloodstone build. He does decent damage early on, with his long range and ability to pop out from nowhere. Sprout is an iffy ganking skill, especially against melee heroes. Teams will prepare for furion early game with tangos/quelling to start, but he will inevitably catch some unlucky bastard in it who doesn't have the counter.
If we're really going to analyze furion, lets do it properly. His treants are good at pushing, and they can be used to jungle successfully during downtime or fulltime. He has a teleport, which makes him an even better pusher/ganker. He isn't the best farmer in dota, and he isn't the best carry. You shouldn't be over farming the lanes if you can help it, as that is your true carry's job. He has the unique ability to both last hit in a lane AND jungle a bit with his summons, making him an excellent burst farmer. His early game is going to consist of farming and ganking.
When midgame actually occurs is debatable, but 40 minutes in you're stretching it a lot. Early game is basically laning. Midgame will happen after the laning phase is done, which is a lot faster than 40 minutes. In a push line up, you should be clearing second towers by mid 20ish and going for a rax by 30, if all went well. Furion is extremely item dependent, he won't do a whole hell of alot without damage or support gear (you would do well to mix them in a lot of games, but guinsoo should almost always be first). A bloodstone at around 20 minutes won't do much, but if you're serious about pushing, BoT might.
A guinsoos by midgame will be huge. It is more potent than DPS, by far. Guinsoo also has the added bonus of giving him plenty of mana and mana regen, decent damage, and health. Sprout+sheep is a fair amount of disable by midgame. With that disable, you can let your team, those actually suited to dps, do dps to the targets you disable.
Quote (BombPopBob2 @ Sun, Aug 2 2009, 04:17am)
Lastly, Bloodstone is NEVER purchased for the primary purpose of increasing a hero's maximum life. It is ALWAYS purchased for the primary purpose of increasing mana and life regen, the increased life and mana, etc. stats, are added bonuses. The regen is what makes furion a hero that can go an entire game, only returning to town several times.
No one would buy bloodstone if it just gave regen. They go hand in hand. They allow for intish carries, like krob/necro/dirge to spam and stay alive for a very long time. Those sort of heroes need every aspect of bloodstone, not just regen. It also gives unparalleled mana regen, which heroes like storm desperately need. Furion doesn't need this. His mana problems can be mostly solved by an early void stone. He isn't a tank and he has very little damage later on without items; he only has one semi-disable; he doesn't have a need for massive regen, not that regen like that wouldn't be nice for every hero, but he isn't in a position to use it.
Quote (BombPopBob2 @ Sun, Aug 2 2009, 04:17am)
No offense, but, most of those look like pubs. The third one looks to have decent picks. None of them went with your build. They all went deso pretty early on, furthering my suspicion of pubs.
Quote (MadSexyCool)
Your build just depend on your allies, and enemies.
you should know how to adjust in game and make your own decision.
figure out what your team needs to win. dota is a team game not solo.
I agree, but having the perfect items for your team comes with experience and planning. Team builds and gameplay can alter item builds drastically, but for beginners it's nice to have a fallback general build. What typically works and what synergies very well with certain heroes isn't very hard to figure out.
This post was edited by deathbypepsi on Aug 1 2009 11:06pm