To say English teams are becoming irrelevant is a bit of a stretch. 3 out of 4 made it out of groups after all. Our coefficient is being lowered by the donkey teams like West ham and Southampton getting into the Europa League and not giving a shit about it. Some of the teams they sent out were a disgrace. Because the rewards of the Europa League are nothing compared to what can be gained in the premier league.

I'm not saying they aren't lowering in quality. But it's hardly the end of the world.

i wouldnt compare klopps and peps future position at all
klopp has to deal with the bad management and overpriced crap players that were signed in the last years

meanwihle pep will go on a shopping spree with unlimited funds this summer (and probably the summer after that as well)

then he will be celebrated for a fancy possession style and stupid formation/position bullshit, while he is only profiting from the individual class of the players
i mean, he has coached an incredible barca squad and then took over the bayerns treble winner team

just imagine him at liverpool and make all those experiments he does with bayern
liverpool would play in the championship next year

I think you're really oversimplifying the role of Guardiola in Barcelona and in Munich.

If the team of Barcelona was really THAT good... why didn't they win a single national/international title the two years before Pep took over? Why didn't they play the overwhelming and sometimes even ridicouling (the opponents) style of football they did under Pep?
A lot of players were already part of Rijkaard' squad, yet Barca didn't manage to keep winning important games and they were far away from what they achieved under Pep.

Pep MADE Iniesta a key-player and better than he was before and he did the same with Xavi, Messi and others. Messi would have probably been a Ballon D'Or winner either way due his ridicoulos amount of talent, but it was Pep who put that much emphasis on Messi's specific skillset and taught him the important aspects of the game that eventually made him the player he is today.

I also think he did the same with most players in Munich. He made them better and more "football-intelligent" players overall (Lahm keeps pointing this out and even Kroos explained this, although he was already playing for Madrid and didn't have a reason to) and with his style and his ideas of football he maximized odds in favour of Bayern for EVERY single game they play. But then again, you have to realize that coaching, tactics etc. isn't everything. Regarding a single game or two, like UCL KO rounds and finals, there are far more things influencing the eventual outcome than any of us could ever imagine... just look at the aforementioned final game between Chelsea and Bayern. Chelsea would have probably lost that same game 9 out of 10 times, yet they miracolously managed to win UCL that year, simply because there are certain aspects and events where a coach and all the former talk and imagination simply doesn't have an effect.

Also, you should realize that possession is not even a part of Pep's original conept. It's simply a consequence of his ideas and the movements and the decision-making he teaches to players, in essence a consequence of his general idea...

oversimplifying is one thing, overinterpreting another
yeah, he turned barca into what it was and with himself living this barca mentality+having players from la masia doing the same it was a perfect match
the perfect conditions to use players according to their strengths

having these players in the first place and then finding them in the form of their lives is not his achievement however
he got rid of the foreign players rijkaard had and picked incredible players like busquets to step up

thats possibly the best about pep, he has a good eye for players and signings like costa for bayern

i have seen every single game in the last years and to be honest the only player who stepped up under pep is boateng
absolutely incredible his transformation
the rest not really....

what lahm calls making them more intelligent was basically messing around with positions
even before lahm was a very complete and versatile player and pep dragged him into midfield for the sake of doing it and because he likes guys like him
despite some good performances its not his strength and not his best position
lahm is probably grrateful to broaden his horizon, but thats pretty much it

peps tactial experiments with using players out of position, 3-4 man hybrid defences, centrally playing full backs, all that stuff had no impact, but pleasing fanboys and the media

as a matter of fact he had to reverse his shit so often to standard procedure, it almost hurts
example not too long ago, when bayern played hertha and pep got the credit for turning the game around when he put my boy javi in midfield and boateng as center back
so reversing a stupid experiment and letting 2 players play on their standard positions is something a coach should get credit for?
the latest fuck up was just saturday, leaving müller on the bench and using costa in the middle....seriously? of course the game turned when costa took the left flank

oh and by the way, lets not forget that luis enriques barcelona is breaking records and even better than under pep
straight forward, no fancy experiments, just football

Read 100% what you wrote and agree 100% to you!

Bump for Pozer.

3 wins in last 12.

But it's not his team

Even though he's been here in early October.

Not his team

To be fair Klopp's team is literally Coutinho and friends. Firiminho shows up 1/3 matches the rest are Sunday leaguers (bar Sturridge but hes hurt more than Jack Wheelchair err pardon me, Wilshere)

He had actual footballers at BVB and managed them very well