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Dec 11 2015 02:48pm
Quote (Madmartigan @ Dec 11 2015 03:47pm)
I said I would look at WAR a lot more in the future and explained why I didn't like it all that much right now.
Everything I type, I always point out why I feel that way and give some reasoning behind it.
I also post articles, videos, whatever I can to help state my point. But whatever. I won't waste my time anymore .


This is what we've been asking for
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Dec 11 2015 02:49pm
fucking cubs are gonna trade soler and/or baez for guys like cobb, smyly, or tyson ross



im actually for the cardinals staying put for the most part. make some cheap 1 to 2 year signings on the lesser FAs, but dont overpay for upton/davis/cespedes/gordon/kazmir/leake/cueto etc.


lets see where were at in june, and if were doing good, we have the money to spend to take big name players with multiple years left on contracts.

if its no good, when can shoot for a mini rebuild and pile up young talent.


since heyward has that year 3 opt out and some of their young talent will be getting expensive by then, their wide open window is only a couple years.

the fact of the matter is even if we signed heyward, i didnt like our chances of winning 90+games next season, and thats what it wouldve taken to be competitive with chicago and pittsburgh.

lets just do our best to cock block the cubs from winning a championship, and if we arent in great shape in june, play for 2 years down the road.


if we are good, there are plenty of players available we can spend the money on like cargo/freeman/puig etc.

This post was edited by Genetics on Dec 11 2015 02:50pm
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Dec 11 2015 02:50pm
I have lower blood pressure too when I stay away from here. Good luck then.
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Dec 11 2015 02:51pm
Quote (Genetics @ Dec 11 2015 02:49pm)
fucking cubs are gonna trade soler and/or baez for guys like cobb, smyly, or tyson ross



im actually for the cardinals staying put for the most part. make some cheap 1 to 2 year signings on the lesser FAs, but dont overpay for upton/davis/cespedes/gordon/kazmir/leake/cueto etc.


lets see where were at in june, and if were doing good, we have the money to spend to take on free agents with multiple years left on contracts.

if its no good, when can shoot for a mini rebuild and pile up young talent.


since heyward has that year 3 opt out and some of their young talent will be getting expensive by then, their wide open window is only a couple years.

the fact of the matter is even if we signed heyward, i didnt like our chances of winning 90+games next season, and thats what it wouldve taken to be competitive with chicago and pittsburgh.

lets just do our best to cock block the cubs from winning a championship, and if we arent in great shape in june, play for 2 years down the road.


if we are good, there are plenty of players available we can spend the money on like cargo/freeman/puig etc.


cubs have a t.v mega deal coming up too so the window isn't exactly small
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Dec 11 2015 02:55pm
Heyward
Zobrist
Rizzo
Bryant
Schwarber
Soler
Montero
Russell


All that needs to be addressed is the BP.. would still love a Baez+ trade for McGee/Cobb
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Dec 11 2015 03:02pm
Quote (cSwish @ Dec 11 2015 03:51pm)
cubs have a t.v mega deal coming up too so the window isn't exactly small


no but it shrinks in a couple years. still a great team, but it does shrink some.

Quote (Schwarber @ Dec 11 2015 03:55pm)
Heyward
Zobrist
Rizzo
Bryant
Schwarber
Soler
Montero
Russell


All that needs to be addressed is the BP.. would still love a Baez+ trade for McGee/Cobb


flip heyward and zobrist and the lineup is perfect


im jealous. bullpen can always be figured out throughout the season.

This post was edited by Genetics on Dec 11 2015 03:03pm
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Dec 11 2015 03:03pm
yeah but its gunna be an even year

so you know what that means
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Dec 11 2015 03:20pm
Heyward deal believed to be front loaded.
Two opt out. 3 years and 4 years depending on plate appearances
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Dec 11 2015 03:30pm
Ken Rosenthal ‏@Ken_Rosenthal 15m15 minutes ago

Sources: #Nationals bid $200M for Heyward. Another team, believed to be #STLCards, also was at $200M. Heyward took less to play for #Cubs.
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Dec 11 2015 03:42pm
It's not all so bad Genetics

Quote
I said in my free-agent writeup of Jason Heyward that "I'd be fine giving him seven years and over $150 million," and that's close enough to what the Cubs did here – I was thinking a $22-23 million average annual value (AAV), and Heyward will indeed get $23 million, just for eight years rather than seven. In a winter market that so far has seen some big escalations in top-end salaries, that's an extraordinary value for the Cubs, and all the more impressive because Heyward was the top free agent available.
Heyward is an elite defensive right fielder who can handle center, and he's already proven to be a solid offensive player, showing some power early in his career while more recently becoming a high-contact, above-average OBP hitter who puts the ball on the ground too often. Even as is, he's a 5-6 WAR player, more than enough to justify his salary, and if the Cubs can unlock some of the power that's largely been lost since he shortened his swing due to a shoulder injury, he could become a 7-8 WAR player. The contract values him for what he's been, but the Cubs will get his peak years and reap the surplus if he becomes the complete player he could be.

Heyward can also opt out at 29; while player opt-outs used to be universally terrible deals for clubs, I'm no longer so sure that's the case, as salaries have risen and contracts haven't gotten any shorter, there's a reasonable chance a player who opts out is simply sparing the signing club from paying for decline years. (There's always the chance the player disappoints from day one and doesn't opt out, of course.)

While early indications are that the Cubs plan to play Heyward in center and keep Jorge Soler, still a very high-upside talent despite a disappointing rookie season, I wonder if their long-term plans involve getting Heyward back to right field, where he's been among the most valuable defenders in all of baseball over the last few years. The Cubs don't have an immediate center-field option in the system, but could hope that one of Albert Almora or Arismendy Alcantara is ready in 2017 or that Ian Happ adapts to the position well enough to handle it by the end of that season. If nothing else, the contract gives the Cubs a ton of options with their impending outfield surplus, since left fielder Billy McKinney isn't far off and they just spent $3 million on 21-year-old Cuban center fielder Eddy Julio Martinez, who will make his pro debut in the spring.

The Cardinals appear to have been the bridesmaid twice this offseason, first on David Price and now on Heyward, but I don't see cause for alarm in St. Louis, as the returning club is still a 90-win team and they have the payroll and prospects (or young big leaguers) to improve. They do need a starter, and someone like Mike Leake or Scott Kazmir would be a good fit, backing up Adam Wainwright and providing some stability with both Carlos Martinez and Michael Wacha a bit uncertain for a full workload in 2016. If center field is their concern, without a true center fielder on the roster, they have the assets to trade for one or could see if Denard Span would consider a one-year, get-healthy deal and hope the Cards' coaches can help him the way they helped Heyward. Losing Heyward is more of a loss on defense than offense, and I don't think this offense needs a big bat, not with a full season of Stephen Piscotty in 2016 and Jedd Gyorko added to provide some right-handed pop to boost production at second base.


Via Keith Law

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