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Jun 16 2014 04:24pm
Things that annoy me with the show (haven't read the books, just GoT wiki) is the lack of background information, at least visualizing certain events instead of just saying a few words about them. I might have missed out as I paid very little attention in the first two seasons but...

One example is:

What makes Jaime Lannister such a great warrior? Throughout season 1 there was NOTHING but gloating from him claiming to be the greatest fighter/warrior/swordsman/dueler in all of Westeros. He still constantly reminds people he used to be the best there was. Yet, where's the proof of this?


If I'm not incorrect he became a knight / man of the king's guard at age 15, which is the youngest since A.L. and some Targaryan held the previous record at age 16 who was long considered one of the greatest warriors in history.


But other than that what we've seen is:

* Jaime not being able to defeat Eddard Stark until one of his men stick a spear through his legs, the fight could have ended either way.
* Jaime getting his ass handed to him against a woman; although Lady Brienne is an accomplished warrior and Jaime was most likely sleep deprived, hungry and dehydrated against a well-nourished in shape Brienne.
* Jaime becoming absolutely useless without his right hand. If he is so great, why can't he use his left hand? Roger Federer might be right handed, but I'm sure he'd knock out all but the best using his left hand...

This post was edited by MGS4BestGameEverMade on Jun 16 2014 04:25pm
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Jun 16 2014 04:50pm
The books address Jaime's combat abilities in more detail. IIRC the fight with Ned actually didn't happen the same way in the books so that' just TV show bullshit (book Ned would get pwned by Jaime). The fight with Brienne he was handcuffed. And he does tons of lefthand training but it takes time to learn. His training couldn't have had him ready by Tyrion's trial.

Quote (Hildegard @ Jun 16 2014 05:05pm)
He evolved into charizard, but khaleesi's trainer level is too low so he doesn't listen.


+1 very good post here

This post was edited by kayeto on Jun 16 2014 04:52pm
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Jun 16 2014 07:27pm
spoilers: hound survives
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Jun 16 2014 09:18pm
Quote (ii88 @ Jun 17 2014 01:27am)
spoilers: hound survives


Spoilers: tv show has changed many things so you have no fucking clue.

This post was edited by Hacintosh on Jun 16 2014 09:18pm
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Jun 16 2014 09:24pm
Quote (ii88 @ Jun 16 2014 06:27pm)
spoilers: hound survives


ROFL
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Jun 16 2014 11:40pm
Quote (MGS4BestGameEverMade @ 16 Jun 2014 18:24)
Things that annoy me with the show (haven't read the books, just GoT wiki) is the lack of background information, at least visualizing certain events instead of just saying a few words about them. I might have missed out as I paid very little attention in the first two seasons but...

One example is:

What makes Jaime Lannister such a great warrior? Throughout season 1 there was NOTHING but gloating from him claiming to be the greatest fighter/warrior/swordsman/dueler in all of Westeros. He still constantly reminds people he used to be the best there was. Yet, where's the proof of this?


If I'm not incorrect he became a knight / man of the king's guard at age 15, which is the youngest since A.L. and some Targaryan held the previous record at age 16 who was long considered one of the greatest warriors in history.


But other than that what we've seen is:

* Jaime not being able to defeat Eddard Stark until one of his men stick a spear through his legs, the fight could have ended either way.
* Jaime getting his ass handed to him against a woman; although Lady Brienne is an accomplished warrior and Jaime was most likely sleep deprived, hungry and dehydrated against a well-nourished in shape Brienne.
* Jaime becoming absolutely useless without his right hand. If he is so great, why can't he use his left hand? Roger Federer might be right handed, but I'm sure he'd knock out all but the best using his left hand...



Well, in the books he's recognized as ONE OF the most talented fighters ever, but the problem is outside of tournaments we've seen very little of it once he joined the kings guard, and the best rarely fight the best so we don't really know for sure where he ranks.

The thing about his fight with ned stark is that ned is definitely recognized as one of the finest fighters in the world, he's battle and war hardened, he's a general who leads from the front, as this retarded land tends to do, and weilds his 2 handed valyrian steel sword very very well. If anything, managing to put pressure and putting ned into the defensive is more impressive than any tournament victory, and he might very well have won anyway without that intervention.

As for the 2 handed thing though, it was far better explained in the novels. Aria's old sword dancing teacher put it best,m the westeros dance is a lumbering one where everyone tries to overpower each other with little finesse or technique. Since Jamie isn't that big, he's probably deadly because he's one of the few who use speed and dodging on top of being strong. None of these guys really are master swordsmaen, they never practice ambidextery, and they're so backward anyone who's severely injured is considered crippled for life and good for nothing. This fits into westeros as a fantasy medieval world set in the dark ages, such as was shown often by how superstitious they are, including toward dwarves, whom usually get killed at birth because they're bad luck. That chain tyrion looked like a genius for thinking of for the siege of blackwater bay? It's been standard defense of closed ports here since like the 1500's.

Another thing jamie said in the books was that just the fact of having to think of how to do a technique from his off hand is making him too slow to fight anyone but beginners, just from that like quarter of a second's delay. He's got to train everything so the reverse becomes muscle memory again. The same holds for top athletes, in hockey for example, defensemen playing their off side perform very bad, even the stars.

The problem with putting so much background information is the show would be very boring very fast. Things that take 4 lines in the books would require 10 minutes of elaborate talk on the show, which would slow the pace and make it even harder for the casual audience to remember who's who because of the information overload.

This post was edited by StephanePare on Jun 16 2014 11:42pm
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Jun 17 2014 01:04am
Quote (StephanePare @ Jun 16 2014 10:40pm)
Well, in the books he's recognized as ONE OF the most talented fighters ever, but the problem is outside of tournaments we've seen very little of it once he joined the kings guard, and the best rarely fight the best so we don't really know for sure where he ranks.

The thing about his fight with ned stark is that ned is definitely recognized as one of the finest fighters in the world, he's battle and war hardened, he's a general who leads from the front, as this retarded land tends to do, and weilds his 2 handed valyrian steel sword very very well.  If anything, managing to put pressure and putting ned into the defensive is more impressive than any tournament victory, and he might very well have won anyway without that intervention.

As for the 2 handed thing though, it was far better explained in the novels.  Aria's old sword dancing teacher put it best,m the westeros dance is a lumbering one where everyone tries to overpower each other with little finesse or technique.  Since Jamie isn't that big, he's probably deadly because he's one of the few who use speed and dodging on top of being strong.  None of these guys really are master swordsmaen, they never practice ambidextery, and they're so backward anyone who's severely injured is considered crippled for life and good for nothing.  This fits into westeros as a fantasy medieval world set in the dark ages, such as was shown often by how superstitious they are, including toward dwarves, whom usually get killed at birth because they're bad luck.  That chain tyrion looked like a genius for thinking of for the siege of blackwater bay? It's been standard defense of closed ports here since like the 1500's.

Another thing jamie said in the books was that just the fact of having to think of how to do a technique from his off hand is making him too slow to fight anyone but beginners, just from that like quarter of a second's delay.  He's got to train everything so the reverse becomes muscle memory again.  The same holds for top athletes, in hockey for example, defensemen playing their off side perform very bad, even the stars.

The problem with putting so much background information is the show would be very boring very fast.  Things that take 4 lines in the books would require 10 minutes of elaborate talk on the show, which would slow the pace and make it even harder for the casual audience to remember who's who because of the information overload.



Playing on your offhand is absolutely nothing like wielding a sword with your right hand for your life , then switch to your left.

It would be more like changing your grip to wear you're shooting left handed , opposed to right handed.
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Jun 17 2014 06:20am
Quote (MGS4BestGameEverMade @ Jun 16 2014 10:24pm)
Things that annoy me with the show (haven't read the books, just GoT wiki) is the lack of background information, at least visualizing certain events instead of just saying a few words about them. I might have missed out as I paid very little attention in the first two seasons but...

One example is:

What makes Jaime Lannister such a great warrior? Throughout season 1 there was NOTHING but gloating from him claiming to be the greatest fighter/warrior/swordsman/dueler in all of Westeros. He still constantly reminds people he used to be the best there was. Yet, where's the proof of this?


If I'm not incorrect he became a knight / man of the king's guard at age 15, which is the youngest since A.L. and some Targaryan held the previous record at age 16 who was long considered one of the greatest warriors in history.


But other than that what we've seen is:

* Jaime not being able to defeat Eddard Stark until one of his men stick a spear through his legs, the fight could have ended either way.
* Jaime getting his ass handed to him against a woman; although Lady Brienne is an accomplished warrior and Jaime was most likely sleep deprived, hungry and dehydrated against a well-nourished in shape Brienne.
* Jaime becoming absolutely useless without his right hand. If he is so great, why can't he use his left hand? Roger Federer might be right handed, but I'm sure he'd knock out all but the best using his left hand...


Jaime has already won several tourneys at that time, both jousting and melee. He was knighted by Arthur Dayne after the battle against the Kingswood Brotherhood. Jaime held his own against the Smiling Knight, who was "Half as big as the Mountain but twice as mad.". In the battle of the Whispering Wood, where Jaime is captured by Robb's army, he cut through ~5 of Robb's best bannermen to get to him. Jaime knew he was the best at the time. From his POV chapters you can gather that there were only three who he would consider a worthy opponent. Barristan Selmy and the Clegane brothers.

Ned isn't supposed to be able to go 1v1 with him. Ned isn't even in the same league as Jaime.
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Jun 17 2014 10:22am
What a boring discussion.

If you guys had a hot sister like Cersei would you sleep with her if she wanted it also?

I would :wub:
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