You guys are still fighting over this crap?

Holy crap go outside and move on

ok then..

so since Hilary Clinton is not my health care provider, then health care is not a political issue right? The nurse who is taking my blood pressure is probably not a political activist who knows everything about the obamacare debate, she's just doing her job.

Do you honestly not understand the differences between the two situations you are trying to compare.

I guess by your logic the only reason health care is a political issue is because your doctor has his own political beliefs.

no, health care is a political issue because politics impacts who gets to go see which doctors and the type of care they receive when they go there

just like Hollywood being politicized affects the content of the movies (the characters and plot)

This post was edited by Kayeto on May 28 2018 02:58pm

I don't know if I should find your level of mental incapability frustrating or fascinating.

I know why health care is a political issue. I said comparing healthcare to Hollywood makes no sense.

You say Hollywood is political because the people who make movies have political beliefs. If you turn compare Hollywood to healthcare then by that logic, your logic, healthcare is political because doctors have political beliefs.

Hollywood isn't political, the government plays no part in the making or distribution of movies.

And even if someone makes the most obviously politically charged movie ever, it still isn't political because you shouldn't take the actions or messages outside of the universe of film.

If a movie is 100% pro-life anti-abortion and spends the entire movie on that single subject, in term of its effect on our world...there is none because the values created for that works, that movie, don't matter outside of the movie.

This is the same reason violence in video games or movies doesn't actually matter. People who say violence in video games is creating killers are stupid. You literally have the same argument just on a different subject matter. So if you truly believe Hollywood is political you should be protesting violent video games, other you're just a giant hypocrite.

I think you're a bit out of touch with reality to honestly believe the perception of the USA is manipulated to an extent that matters one damn bit anymore by Hollywood. If Hollywood had any sway anymore into what people abroad thought, we wouldn't be seen as morbidly obese, and easily manipulated morons by the vast majority of the world. Earlier on Hollywood had a much wider influence on the world and how others felt about us, but with era of unlimited information, movies have become less and less important in the overall perception of the USA.

This "one group" happens to have an opinion that aligns with the vast majority of citizens in the country.... So why should their voice be marginalized when it represents the opinion of over 60% of the populace? Mel Gibson on the other hand is an anti-Semitic, womanizer who physically and mentally abuses people weaker than him, usually women.. Why do you think the views of a man like that deserve to hold as much weight as an opinion shared by the vast majority of people here in the states? If I go talk to a crazy person on the street and he tells me that the queers are destroying the soil by spilling the blood of their ass babies in it, should that absolutely bat-shit crazy opinion hold just as much weight as a heavily scrutinized organization of liberal elites? Hollywood has worked diligently to get to the position they have, people with opposite viewpoints could have worked their way in by going to arts schools or studying film or w/e, but it's a predominately liberal setting. One of the big reasons being that it's mostly people with advanced educations who obtain important positions there (and nepotism ofc plays a large role), and education/intelligence directly correlates to political standing, and political standing typically correlates to acceptance/disapproval of non-traditional sexual orientations.

Once again though, movies have almost no sway anymore into how we're viewed worldwide. No matter of how positive of a light we're shown in regards to physical beauty, tolerance, intelligence, freedom, and the overall wonder and splendor of the USA by Hollywood, people just think we're a bunch of fat fucking morons who can be manipulated into voting for someone even dumber than we are, and before that, people have hated us for years for acting like we're the "world police" and sticking our nose in everyone's fucking business, and always leaving places worse than when we came int, but somehow we leave with more resources. Hollywood doesn't matter anymore and how we're viewed regardless of what Hollywood does isn't going to change anytime fucking soon.


TLDR Version | If your point is just that the liberal agenda has a HUGE influence over movies/television etc.. then you're right, but it doesn't matter. They've had a huge influence over it for fucking ever and public opinion within the nation has never been drastically swayed by that. It's only been time and understanding that has lead to acceptance of non-standard sexual orientations. Foreign views of us are influenced hardly at all by our entertainment industry (these days), and even though liberals control Hollywood and all good television, this country still elected a compulsive liar who's also a racist, a womanizer, and an idiot lol. Public opinion sure as fuck isn't being swayed enough, because if it was, someone like this should have lost in a fucking landslide, and foreign opinion isn't being swayed because everyone wouldn't think we were morbidly obese, easily manipulated, intolerant morons if what Hollywood portrayed was having even a small impact on the way we're perceived.

Comical.




Just saw the movie. I enjoyed it, and very much enjoyed a revealed character at the end of the movie. The scene where Han meets chewy was golden.

It was casted well too.

This post was edited by stupidkid282 on May 28 2018 03:47pm

I'm surprised that we disagree on that basic point. I just assumed that it was obvious to everyone that media had an impact on culture. I suppose it's a difficult to debate that point in a forum since empirical evidence doesn't really exist. The argument would be reduced to copying and pasting the texts that have already been written about the subject, which is essentially no different than anyone reading it for themselves:

http://open.lib.umn.edu/mediaandculture/chapter/8-3-movies-and-culture/




Hollywood is politicized, but I am not going to protest their creations OR violent video games because both forms of media are protected as art under free speech. It's not hypocritical to say that they should both be allowed. I'm simply disappointed that different American subcultures aren't being represented equally by media.

Like I said, you can create movies about social issues but that doesn't mean the message has an impact outside of the actual world of the movie.

Yes 100 years ago things were different, but now it's not 100 years ago. Things have changed, people have changed. I want to be on your side, I want to say that a movie with a good well done political message... like anti-racism, could have an actual effect on people, but the truth is it doesn't, so getting angry over someone putting their own beliefs into a movie is just absurd at this point in time. Plus your entire argument is based on the idea that everyone in Hollywood pushes some political agenda in everything they do, which I think it's total bullshit.



I didn't say it is hypocritical to think they both should be allowed, I said it is hypocritical to say that political messages in movies (/video games) have an impact and then turn around and say that violence doesn't have an impact in the same mediums. You can't pick and choose what aspects of something is impactful, either it is, and all of it is, or it isn't, and none of it isn't.

edit: typos

This post was edited by Blah58 on May 28 2018 04:00pm

Just you watch. 10 years from, the new hot meme that foreigners will have for us in addition to 'fat americans' is going to be 'gay americans'. It's already in the progress of happening.



I don't disagree with your claim that the development of alternative media (youtube and other social medias that allows people to connected worldwide without a studio being involved) has lessened the effect. The fact that we can agree that the free flow of ideas reduces the effect supports my claim that ideas were being restricted by the corporate content creators in the first place.



I'm not saying the 60% should be marginalized. I'm saying I'd be less disappointed if they controlled only ~60% of the media that was released. Instead, their influence is greater. Sometimes the influence is direct (they buy up a big IP and inject their ideas directly into it). But often times it's more subtle, pressuring people who want to work in the industry to tow the line if they want to get picked for jobs.



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christianity_in_the_United_States : Christianity is the most adhered to religion in the United States, with 75% of polled American adults identifying themselves as Christian in 2015.

This is what happens when you try to make a christian movie: https://www.theguardian.com/film/2011/may/03/jim-caviezel-passion-of-the-christ

What you are saying about Gibson may be true, but does it apply also to Caviezel? I'm not saying that 75% of the movies have to have a Christian theme. Not by a long shot. But if someone has the budget and the means to produce the content, it deserves a fair shake on an open market. I'm disappointed that the liberal majority gets to discourage such productions because it conflicts with their ideas.



If you honestly think that media didn't impact American acceptance of alternate sexuality, then I don't know what to tell you. Movies spread ideas and spreading ideas is one way to help more people understand them better. It contributes. It's not a clearcut situation of art driving culture OR art reacting to culture. It goes both ways, they both affect each other a little as the prevalent philosophy shifts. I can personally attest that I watched the movie But I'm a Cheerleader when I was 18 and it impacted my ability to understand what homosexuals had been dealing with. Otherwise, I would have had a harder time with the concept since I was a straight guy with no gay friends/family that I was close enough to actually have real talks with.

This post was edited by Kayeto on May 28 2018 04:43pm