That's what I meant to say, but incase he googles and finds one link that he is going to go deem 100% true, and now say protestants believe it, I had to leave that 1% room. Maccabees is one of the (5ish?) books that the Catholics ADDED to the Bible.

The Catholics did not write it, they were verses of uncertain authenticity (just like every other story in the Bible) which some sects decided didn't make the cut into the Bible. However, many sects follow these verses, not just Catholics. One prime example being Protestants.



Well there's your problem right from the start, assuming the Bible has to make sense
You're not looking at the context of the quotes, obviously the Corinthians quote is in the context of other information, and doesn't make sense without it.
That passage is a reference to the purifying fires of Purgatory, which would eventually allow a person to escape. This reference cannot refer to Hell, because one cannot leave that place; it cannot refer to Heaven because there is no pain there; it must refer to some intermediate location. The key word in the original Greek is "zemiothesetai" which is translated as "suffer loss" in many versions of the Bible. But the original word also can refer to punishment; this alternative meaning is suppressed in most translations.
The Revelations quote states that no impure person will enter heaven. "But nothing unclean shall enter it..." Some reason that if a person dies with some minor sins still on their record, then they are obviously not pure; they must go to some place to be refined until they can attain heaven.

The list goes on...

No Christian can die with ANY sins on their record. They are 100% forgiven, no matter WHAT you do.

"Only as one escaping through the flames" Is obviously an analogy to whatever the context is. If you give me the context (The whole passage), then I will read it and prove you wrong, as I always do. But you don't know it obviously, as you are just copying and pasting all of your arguements

I'll respond to all 4 of your statements individually
Yes they are,
No they aren't,
I never said there weren't certain groups that didn't accept Maccabees,
Maybe you should read the Bible then?


Catholics never added books to the Bible. Quite the contrary, other sects removed books. If you're going to make outrageous claims, prove them? It's nothing but nonsense. Your religious denominations feel like they can pick and choose what parts of the Bible to follow, so they threw out some books.

Bro, open you're damn Bible and read, I'm not going to hold your hand the whole way. I've already explained what it's referring to.

The problem with the Bible mentioning purgatory is that it technically doesn't, so forsaken is right.

All the mentions from your website quoting bible passages infer the existance of purgatory using logic, there is never a direct reference in the bible to purgatory that i know of.

Does that mean it definately doesn't exist? no, which is frustrating cuase the logical process that website goes through about inferring some sort of intermediate place makes sense, so really its up for people to decide.

You prove them. I am sick of having to prove everything, I don't have to. You keep putting ME on the defensive, and YOU on the offensive. I'm sick of it. You shut your mouth with all this stupid stuff that makes no sense, and YOU PROVE TO ME that the Bible is not true. I dont have to prove to you that it is true, that is not even a question. Since you are questioning the TRUTH. You prove it.


Protestants ARE everyone except Catholics. If you don't believe that, I dont care. Everyone else in the entire world does, because that is HOW IT IS.
Protestants are NOT a prime example because Maccabees is NOT in the Bible. It is in the "Catholic" Bible, and that is THE ONLY ONE IT IS IN.
He has never heard of it because it ISN'T IN THE BIBLE.

Catholics DID ADD BOOKS TO THE BIBLE, and they WILL admit it.
Other sects did NOT remove books.

You prove me wrong in any of these things, because I do not have to prove them right.
Now let's see you try, I used my MIND and the BIBLE to answer your questions.
Now YOU go use GOOGLE to try and answer mine.

Edit: I'm going to go to bed, gnite all

This post was edited by x]FoRsaKeN[x on Jul 12 2009 11:54pm

There is a direct reference to a place that we would call purgatory today, yes. Purgatory is a man-made word, used to describe the place, I would be quite surprised if, through the translation and thousands of years, it would come out directly mentioning a place called "purgatory" You're argument is invalid. Let's assume the Bible mentioned a place you go when you die, if you live a good life and believe in Christ as your savior, but never mention it's called "Heaven". Would you then say Heaven does not exist because something as trivial as it not being labeled such? The Bible clearly describes a purgatory.

Protestants ARENT a prime example, lmao, I'm a protestant and I don't accept Maccabees because it's not in any bible i've ever seen.

So there we go.

Can you post a passage that directly mentions a place which would be purgatory? I'm interested to see such a passage. (And i'm not challenging you to find one and thinking your not gonna be able to)

I see what they are saying about logically inferring that one must exist, but I didn't see any that directly describe such a place.