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Jun 13 2024 07:27pm
I'm assuming you're scaling burning instinct?
example:

you have 1500 intelligence and 1500 critical strike damage (what the stat sheet says, without this ring)

you have 50% crit chance

burning instinct gains 1%x per 25 int and 10%x of your crit strike damage bonus (what it says on the stat sheet.. not what you actually have)
so your current multiplier is 210%x

so the 135 int will be 176 after you masterwork to rank 12 (without critting on it) and the 75 crit will be 97.5.

with this in mind, the int can scale the multiplier +7.04x, an increase of 3.3%. Your 176 int will also increase your int damage % from 150%x to 167.6%x, an increase of 11.73%, so the int gives you roughly 15.45% increased dps.

the crit will be +97.5% but your legendary node scales what it says on your stat sheet, which adds 50%, so you're actually adding 146.25 to your stat sheet's value, bringing you to 1646.25%.

This adds 14.63% to your multiplier. You also add 97.5% additive damage that is effective 50% of the time, so you've added 48.75% additive damage to your additive bucket. How much this will increase your damage will depend on how much additive damage you have, which for sorc is USUALLY quite a bit, but the difference here is less than 1% so unless you have 5000 additive damage it is better to add crit, in this specific scenario.

tl;dr

the answer is not straight forward and you should consult a blizzard mathemetician when doing anything on your character if you want to make the correct decision 100% of the time.

or.. just use a maxroll planner, map out the scenario, and see which one is better.. but you'll still have to do math.

The difference will be at most 5% total dps difference. Does that matter to you? If so, start crunching some numbers. I think I've shown that both of them are good to add to your build, though..
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Jun 13 2024 07:39pm
Quote (Vrael @ Jun 13 2024 09:27pm)
I'm assuming you're scaling burning instinct?
example:

you have 1500 intelligence and 1500 critical strike damage (what the stat sheet says, without this ring)

you have 50% crit chance

burning instinct gains 1%x per 25 int and 10%x of your crit strike damage bonus (what it says on the stat sheet.. not what you actually have)
so your current multiplier is 210%x

so the 135 int will be 176 after you masterwork to rank 12 (without critting on it) and the 75 crit will be 97.5.

with this in mind, the int can scale the multiplier +7.04x, an increase of 3.3%. Your 176 int will also increase your int damage % from 150%x to 167.6%x, an increase of 11.73%, so the int gives you roughly 15.45% increased dps.

the crit will be +97.5% but your legendary node scales what it says on your stat sheet, which adds 50%, so you're actually adding 146.25 to your stat sheet's value, bringing you to 1646.25%.

This adds 14.63% to your multiplier. You also add 97.5% additive damage that is effective 50% of the time, so you've added 48.75% additive damage to your additive bucket. How much this will increase your damage will depend on how much additive damage you have, which for sorc is USUALLY quite a bit, but the difference here is less than 1% so unless you have 5000 additive damage it is better to add crit, in this specific scenario.

tl;dr

the answer is not straight forward and you should consult a blizzard mathemetician when doing anything on your character if you want to make the correct decision 100% of the time.

or.. just use a maxroll planner, map out the scenario, and see which one is better.. but you'll still have to do math.

The difference will be at most 5% total dps difference. Does that matter to you? If so, start crunching some numbers. I think I've shown that both of them are good to add to your build, though..


Thanks you very much for that deeper explanation.
Im a Immortal Frozen Orb Sorc -
28,447 Attack Power
1889 Intelligence
79% Critical Strike Chance when I Evade
678% Critical Strike damage
200% Vulnerable damage
168% All damage

Trying to figure out which stats would profit me the most.

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Jun 13 2024 08:08pm
oh that's even easier
so attack power is completely useless, ignore that completely
crit damage doesn't scale anything for you except additive damage in this build (unless you're running fire bolt enchantment and using burning instinct.. i'm going to assume you're not though)
so adding 176 int will bring you from 1889 to 2065 (assuming you don't have int% on your amulet), a 9.3% increase
assuming you evade enough to keep your crit chance that high..
97.5% crit 79% of the time is an additive increase of 77.03% additive damage
you don't have any other additive damage? damage to chilled or frozen in your paragon, etc
either way just from what you're giving me for frozen orb you should have 100% uptime on vulnerable and your 678 crit will become 775.5*.79 = 612.645%, giving you 980.645% additive damage, up from 903.62%, an increase of 8.5%. If you have more additive damage, such as +damage to chilled/frozen/burning/close/distant, ETC, this number will be smaller.

So the int is better.
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Jun 13 2024 09:02pm
Quote (Vrael @ Jun 13 2024 10:08pm)
oh that's even easier
so attack power is completely useless, ignore that completely
crit damage doesn't scale anything for you except additive damage in this build (unless you're running fire bolt enchantment and using burning instinct.. i'm going to assume you're not though)
so adding 176 int will bring you from 1889 to 2065 (assuming you don't have int% on your amulet), a 9.3% increase
assuming you evade enough to keep your crit chance that high..
97.5% crit 79% of the time is an additive increase of 77.03% additive damage
you don't have any other additive damage? damage to chilled or frozen in your paragon, etc
either way just from what you're giving me for frozen orb you should have 100% uptime on vulnerable and your 678 crit will become 775.5*.79 = 612.645%, giving you 980.645% additive damage, up from 903.62%, an increase of 8.5%. If you have more additive damage, such as +damage to chilled/frozen/burning/close/distant, ETC, this number will be smaller.

So the int is better.


I don’t use fire bolt enchantment nor Burning instinct paragon node ( I do burn enemies through hydra and flame shield and use Devouring blaze and Esu’s ferocity Key passive for attack speed. )

Prolly Vulnerable damage would be better to upgrade over Critical damage, or Intelligence is really the way to go. Really appreciate your input. Thanks you.
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Jun 14 2024 03:45am
Quote (BenwaGaming @ Jun 14 2024 04:25am)
If you would have taken the time to read, you would have noticed that Im a sorc.


Tal Rasha’s ring and Ring of Starless Skies are probably way to go then.

You can get both from Torment Varshan, i did 3 run with my brother today and he got Tyrael and Ring of Starless Skies and few Tal Ring and Raiment armor.. Just from 3 Torment Varshan and i get some like 25 Ring of Red Furer :bonk: Fucking nice rng…

This post was edited by MultipleUser1 on Jun 14 2024 03:45am
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Jun 14 2024 07:02am
Quote (Vrael @ 14 Jun 2024 05:08)
oh that's even easier
so attack power is completely useless, ignore that completely
crit damage doesn't scale anything for you except additive damage in this build (unless you're running fire bolt enchantment and using burning instinct.. i'm going to assume you're not though)
so adding 176 int will bring you from 1889 to 2065 (assuming you don't have int% on your amulet), a 9.3% increase
assuming you evade enough to keep your crit chance that high..
97.5% crit 79% of the time is an additive increase of 77.03% additive damage
you don't have any other additive damage? damage to chilled or frozen in your paragon, etc
either way just from what you're giving me for frozen orb you should have 100% uptime on vulnerable and your 678 crit will become 775.5*.79 = 612.645%, giving you 980.645% additive damage, up from 903.62%, an increase of 8.5%. If you have more additive damage, such as +damage to chilled/frozen/burning/close/distant, ETC, this number will be smaller.

So the int is better.


I highly doubt.

Anyway, thanks diablo 4 for this wonderful math model and interface which shows exactly nothing.
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Jun 14 2024 04:51pm
Quote (Madmaxio @ 14 Jun 2024 08:02)
I highly doubt.

Anyway, thanks diablo 4 for this wonderful math model and interface which shows exactly nothing.


Not my fault that the explanation flew over your head. Math is hard, it's OK.

If you wanna go build the character from scratch level 1-100 and equip all of this gear and go to the target dummy and write down 1000 damage numbers into an excel sheet, put the other ring on, do another 1000 damage numbers, average them then compare be my guest. I'd rather just do the math.
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Jun 15 2024 01:54am
Quote (Vrael @ 15 Jun 2024 01:51)
Not my fault that the explanation flew over your head. Math is hard, it's OK.

If you wanna go build the character from scratch level 1-100 and equip all of this gear and go to the target dummy and write down 1000 damage numbers into an excel sheet, put the other ring on, do another 1000 damage numbers, average them then compare be my guest. I'd rather just do the math.


I thought crit is better in this example.

Well my point was about extremely retarded diablo 4 math model, and those ridiculous calculations it throws out on players.
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Jun 16 2024 06:33pm
Intelligence is better
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Jun 16 2024 06:51pm
Have a
GA: Int
GA: Crit chance
ring for trade if you are interested
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