why does it look like shes saying bring your toast?

Even if having more diversity and versatility is nice, this is not the main point of playing this.

See, a pure foh has aprox 3/4 the total AoE dps output of a pure hdin.
The reason behind this?
In most situations, a single foh cast will deal aprox 50% more dmg than a single hammer cast.
Casting only foh at 86fcr+ = 16 frames
Casting only hammers at 125fcr = 9 frames

So hammer only vs foh only means you have more average dps from 2 hammers per 18frames than 1foh per 16frames.

This is where the mage build really outperforms both!
You get to cast 1foh + 1hammer every 16frames, and it only requires 86fcr so you can get much more +skills from gear, using +6/10fcr scepter, hoz, 3pcomb/20fcr circ, 2x soj, arach, 16fcr amy, 20fcr gloves.
You get maximum +skills and maximum fcr for foh+hammer combo

With this build you don’t benefit from +skills other than pcomb, cuz all you use is foh, hammer, HS
Aura comes from merc with Void511’s build suggestion.

I personally prefer going the standard mage build, using conc myself (which means a bit less dmg cuz I can’t get all hammer’s synergies) but I have an insight merc with tripple heal auras and able to leech properly, so general QoL is better.
But pride merc option = highest damage output you can possibly achieve on any paladin build (not talking about single target ofc)

This post was edited by SinsOfTheSun on Mar 13 2024 08:41am

Conclusion

Pure foh is best at /p1 to /p3 chaos runs (or other areas with undead/demons only)

Pure hdin is best at general pvm /p1 to /p5

Mage (either standard or Void511’s suggestion) is the heavy artillery for /p7-8

On the subject about how to play Mage…
Use standard self-conc for good QoL
Use pride merc for maximum dmg output, if you don’t mind having to use pots and revive merc from time to time

Good summary although I think the difference between pure hammer vs mage is more about being able to clear more areas as mage more so than player count since hammerdin doesnt really struggle due to lack of dps but instead due to difficulty landing hammer in certain areas

This post was edited by Void511 on Mar 13 2024 09:06am

Yeah it brings versatility about areas to farm, adapt skill based on terrain and type of monsters, also fixes magic immunes.
But if we talk about best areas, where a foh build would normally farm, I mean open areas with undead/demons like CS, the mage build has a massive aoe dps increase over pure hdin.

On the other hand, pure hdin will outperform mage if you start farming areas where foh is bad.
So that would defeat the purpose of this build…

Even my crappy Pangolin is doing pretty damn well in P1 now on ladder with no Enigma. With your kinda setup and Suggestions, going on P7-P8 will be really fun.

I can even say this for sure, My Pangolin on NL going through P5 which i have done countless of times before, with a Wizzy 125 FCR build still rip through the game.

There is a hidden 50% extra damage to demons for hammers I think, so at 5.5 to 6k Hammers, you are doing pretty ok for a Hybrid

This post was edited by Hamsterbaby on Mar 13 2024 09:25am

yea true.

I ended up doing some testing so to update:
-merc survivability is fine so far. Went through souls etc with no issue except the mosaic sin that was chasing me around killed him a couple times
-i recommend using both foh and hammer on left click so that you can keep redemption up and give it time to proc during your rotation. If either are on right click it will interrupt the redemption delay and make it awkward to actually proc redemption. It is a bit awkward and takes some getting use to but it works. I doubt it will be comfortable for most players though so I'd recomend most stick to the regular insight build.

This post was edited by Void511 on Mar 13 2024 09:29am

For single target damage, Holy Bolt is also quite powerful. I would probably only use Hammers when I can't kill something with FoH/Bolt

It is but, Hammers work much better on bosses except for baal, that dick head teles every now and then, but when he summons his tentacles I will FOH them and the bolts will shot gun baal. Pretty funny.

This post was edited by Hamsterbaby on Mar 13 2024 09:33am