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Nov 6 2021 05:25am
So I have a trap assassin I have been magic finding with.
Decided to work my way toward claw/claw and develop the character beyond spirit/spirit and gull/spirit on swap

I made a chaos in a feral claw, and have a 3+ traps blade talon in the off hand.

My average weapon speed should be -30, meaning I need 42ias to reach the 9 fpa trap laying speed. I have 35ias from chaos, 20ias from my gloves so I should be hitting 9 fpa.

Can you lay traps faster than 9 fpa? I was using bos with treachery prior to going c/c and my trap layer speed was considerably faster than it is now.
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Nov 6 2021 05:55am
Both ferals claws and blade talons have -20, so you need 63 ias for 9 frames trap laying
Frames are now uncapped so you can go faster 9 frames, bos and high ias is recommended
Dunno the breakpoints for faster frames though
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Nov 6 2021 06:20am
c1 - feral claw (-20wsm)
c2 - blade talon (-20 wsm)
wsm = (c1+c2)/2 = (-20+-20)/2 = -20 wsm

-20 wsm = 63% ias needed without SIAS (skill ias aka BoS or fana aura)

so if only your described gear ias you achieved 55%ias, so no 9 laying traps (wihtout BoS)

D2R now has uncapped breakpoints, but still follow diminished returns law, we're gattering all info about the other breakpoints, because, of course, d2r has a deviance of d2, some breakpoints calc doesn't round up anymore, so is kinda trick
the good news, ppl more smart than me already figured this and we get a accurate formula to achieve more breakpoints such 8, 7 and even 6 fpa in some cases of laying traps. The other result is now we know why ppl report get the same
fpa with less ias needed, some breakpoints like 9 fpa laying traps with GT/RT (-30 wsm) in D2 should achieve this 9fpa with 42%ias now on D2R you can achieve 9fpa with the same claw with only 40% ias actually! so now i explained how
d2r fvcked all breakpoints lets to your case:

your laying traps fpa was faster because you hitted a new breakpoint, BoS+45 ias of treachery is huge, when i say huge i mean the only way to achieve more than 8 fpa without break your gear is BoS i believe..

so you have 3 options: your claws = -20wsm
a. fade+your claws = 60 ias% (before in D2 was 63%) to achieve 9 fpa laying trap without BoS
b. 113% ias needed to achieve 8 fpa laying trap without BoS
c. BoS (lv15)+your claws you hit 9 fpa w/ 0%ias needed, 8fpa w/ 9 ias% and 7fpa w/ 40% ias needed, 6 fpa w/ 117% ias needed

i hope this helped you, cya sir
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Nov 6 2021 06:35am
Not sure how it was in legacy

but with 9 FPA trap speed i am significantly faster with BOS than with fade (I guess that seems right to me)

I stacked ias and Bos on a 60 ias GT and it seemed i could go even faster than that [-30] +42 ias BP
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Nov 6 2021 06:41am
faster you mean movement speed? yeah, BoS give this too

you couldn't pass 9 fpa due to capp'd breakpoints (iirc due to animations) so in d2 you would get 9 fpa [-30 wsm] with 42% ias needed, but here in d2r you can get the same 9 fpa [-30 wsm] with only 40% ias
edit: 42% to 40% seems nothing but is huge for gear setup, so is a huge buff in some breakpoints (old and new ones)

look this video here (credits to Goomshill) you can compare how broken the animations is on legacy mode :lol:



This post was edited by ThoroBR on Nov 6 2021 06:43am
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Nov 6 2021 06:50am
Quote (ThoroBR @ Nov 6 2021 08:41am)
faster you mean movement speed? yeah, BoS give this too

you couldn't pass 9 fpa due to capp'd breakpoints (iirc due to animations) so in d2 you would get 9 fpa [-30 wsm] with 42% ias needed, but here in d2r you can get the same 9 fpa [-30 wsm] with only 40% ias
edit: 42% to 40% seems nothing but is huge for gear setup, so is a huge buff in some breakpoints (old and new ones)

look this video here (credits to Goomshill) you can compare how broken the animations is on legacy mode :lol:

https://files.catbox.moe/g53c5v.webm


Do you have the calculations that show you only need 40 ias instead of 42 now? Is eias required rounded down to 60 instead of 61?
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Nov 6 2021 06:55am
yup, i will edit here in 5min with the formulas and more in-depth explanation to this non-sense of blizzard, brb
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Nov 6 2021 07:32am
i couldn't edit more <_<

well with the "old" formula (still viable, but now when you find a eias w/ perfect xx,00 frames like 9, 7, 4, 3 and 1 frames for laying trap you must/won't round up)

so the olds calcs gave to us this:
Traps:
Eias: (120*(EIAS - Skill Ias + WSM)) / (120 - (EIAS - SkillIAS +WSM)
Frames: {16 / (1+(EIAS/100))-1}
{} = Round up

how to know the old frames: 16 / (1+(61/100))-1 = 8,93788... this would give us 9 frames (9fpa)
how to know the old ias needed: (120*(61 - 0 + -30)) / (120 - (61 - 0 +-30) = 41,79775... = 42% ias needed

So the "old calc" would give this EIAS table (just the relevant)
EIAS // frames
34 // 11
46 // 10
61 // 9
78 // 8
101 // 7
129 // 6
____________________________
Now for D2R:

All credits to @Marvel.
the "more accurate formula" ceiling((8* 256) / floor[128* (100-wsm+skillias+eias) / 100]) -1

All credits to @legen


so thats why we don't round up on the old formula when we get a perfect xx,00 frames

if you check here in this thread i made some calcs for smite this gave me 48% bcuz with 5 fpa i did the round up on a perfect xx,00 frames (5 fpa)
this gave me 48% ias needed, the reality is this video (see below) proved i was wrong, the video showed 46% ias needed exactly the eias used for a perfect xx,00 frames
the eias 101 was wrong because i round up the 5 fpa (eias 101 would give old 4,97 frames was the answer, but now the eias 100 will give 5,00 frames and still work)

using the round up frame to eias 101 (120*(101 - 37 + -30)) / (120 - (101 - 37 + -30) = 47,441860465... = 48% ias needed to achieve 5 fpa with PB (like grief) + fana aura lvl 27
not using round up frame to eias 100 now: (120*(100 - 37 + -30)) / (120 - (100 - 37 + -30) = 45,5172413793... = 46% ias needed to achieve 5 fpa with PB (like grief) + fana aura lvl 27

video proof: 46% ias needed for eias 100 (5fpa) smite skill


i hope this give enough evidence, my only credit was compiling the data of other great users like gel87, marvel. and legen (i must be forgetting someone..)
Urkel i remember you tested the auto wsm, can you show me video doing this too? this would be vital for new calcs too.. thx man!

edit: i forgot to mention what link i was refering, my other thread about smite https://forums.d2jsp.org/topic.php?t=89080823&f=148

This post was edited by ThoroBR on Nov 6 2021 07:51am
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Nov 6 2021 10:03am
Quote (ThoroBR @ Nov 6 2021 09:32am)
i couldn't edit more <_<

well with the "old" formula (still viable, but now when you find a eias w/ perfect xx,00 frames like 9, 7, 4, 3 and 1 frames for laying trap you must/won't round up)

so the olds calcs gave to us this:
Traps:
Eias: (120*(EIAS - Skill Ias + WSM)) / (120 - (EIAS - SkillIAS +WSM)
Frames: {16 / (1+(EIAS/100))-1}
{} = Round up

how to know the old frames: 16 / (1+(61/100))-1 = 8,93788... this would give us 9 frames (9fpa)
how to know the old ias needed: (120*(61 - 0 + -30)) / (120 - (61 - 0 +-30) = 41,79775... = 42% ias needed

So the "old calc" would give this EIAS table (just the relevant)
EIAS // frames
34 // 11
46 // 10
61 // 9
78 // 8
101 // 7
129 // 6
____________________________
Now for D2R:

All credits to @Marvel.
the "more accurate formula" ceiling((8* 256) / floor[128* (100-wsm+skillias+eias) / 100]) -1

All credits to @legen
https://i.imgur.com/62REwKd.png

so thats why we don't round up on the old formula when we get a perfect xx,00 frames

if you check here in this thread i made some calcs for smite this gave me 48% bcuz with 5 fpa i did the round up on a perfect xx,00 frames (5 fpa)
this gave me 48% ias needed, the reality is this video (see below) proved i was wrong, the video showed 46% ias needed exactly the eias used for a perfect xx,00 frames
the eias 101 was wrong because i round up the 5 fpa (eias 101 would give old 4,97 frames was the answer, but now the eias 100 will give 5,00 frames and still work)

using the round up frame to eias 101 (120*(101 - 37 + -30)) / (120 - (101 - 37 + -30) = 47,441860465... = 48% ias needed to achieve 5 fpa with PB (like grief) + fana aura lvl 27
not using round up frame to eias 100 now: (120*(100 - 37 + -30)) / (120 - (100 - 37 + -30) = 45,5172413793... = 46% ias needed to achieve 5 fpa with PB (like grief) + fana aura lvl 27

video proof: 46% ias needed for eias 100 (5fpa) smite skill
https://i.imgur.com/9CvQ8rY.mp4

i hope this give enough evidence, my only credit was compiling the data of other great users like gel87, marvel. and legen (i must be forgetting someone..)
Urkel i remember you tested the auto wsm, can you show me video doing this too? this would be vital for new calcs too.. thx man!

edit: i forgot to mention what link i was refering, my other thread about smite https://forums.d2jsp.org/topic.php?t=89080823&f=148


Ok thanks a lot for the info, makes sense

I dont have a video of auto wsm yet, maybe I can make one sometime soon. Personally i have only tried it in single player but I have heard from other people who can confirm that it does indeed work on the actual online server for d2r
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Nov 6 2021 01:21pm
Thanks heaps guys. Great info
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