1. Thesnipa/Clagd/Pala
2. itsrikid/Roxbury/Pala
3. Brothagoo/Sit/Barb
4.Bonnerf2/Slam/Nec
5.Stegs/Lime/Dudu
6.Tshaman/Razor/Zon
7.Pants1/Kaz/Pala
8.Quicklaunch/laserrocketfgt/Sorc
9.Worrywart/Cinder/Sorc
10.Gaseo/Bordeaux/Sorc
11.Figgis/Aladdin/Dudu
12.Nics/Rollo/Barb
13.Theweirone/Elderz/Sin

Shock Charger #1

Close but there's a small typo

The biggest issue of tiers is hard counters. "how can something be on X tier when Y character from Z tier beats it 5-0?"

There is also the issue of a coinflip matchup such as bowa v charger etc.

Then there's the issue of do we take into account their viability in TVT as well as 1v1 in the discussion.

Now think of an FOH pally, can't beat much 1v1, 5-0's barbs, great in tvt. so on all 3 accounts it's a bit of an issue to tier.

Regardless i feel fwall is a tier 1 build, solidly tier 1. With enough dr/mdr and a few other tricks it can really fuck up some builds and its viable vs almost all builds except charger.



#1

This post was edited by thesnipa on Feb 23 2017 10:17am

Correct im not Gaseo

can someone help me with hell bird, hh3//3 pls and ty.. its not lvl resd so use an hdin or something

But there's other way more complicated games that do it just fine. You make the list by counting their goodvmatchup once each for each other build on the list


Libby matchup

Zon, slightly favored
Barb, favored
Dudu, favored
Sin, even
Fireball, even
Firewall, favored
Necro, favored
Hammerdin, favored
Blizz, slightly favored

That's my opinion about libby matchups, could you make a list that argues that a firewall has comparable matchup? I've never piloted a firewall so I have no idea besides vs libby or what I've read in this thread

I definitely feel like its tier 1.5 barely behind cuz libby matchup. I'm afraid to say it but ban eth insight and fw is probably easily tier 1

This post was edited by Pants1 on Feb 23 2017 10:33am

no1 helped, maybe tomorrow gonna go to bed , rip

If you see me on after 19:00 GMT just drop me a pm and I'll do it for you.

oh i agree entirely it could be done, and i'm down to frame up the data if that talk bears fruit. the issue is if we talk about any build people can't even agree on favorable/even/unfavorable matchups. it get's sticky. then let's take it a step further to 4d chess, favorable-even-unfavorable is fine, but good methodology requires we take prevalence into account.

Simple example, at lvl 18 a fbsorc beats an iceblaster sorc. but for every IB sorc there are literally 25 zons and 25 chargers. extrapolate that to 30 dueling and the tier system is majorly affected by preference. barbs and zons come to mind.

This post was edited by thesnipa on Feb 23 2017 10:39am

Firewall is tier one
Barb is tier one
Charger is also tier one, not sure why you put something that can 1 hit 90% of llds at tier 3.