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#441
Nov 17 2021 04:19pm
Quote (ferdia @ Nov 17 2021 11:12pm)
The idea is for each class to have at least 1 viable build for tournaments.
A V/T is already quite strong when piloted by a great player as has previously been demonstrated.
you will note that i already incuded java in the may level to 31.
a kicker is now probably a 2nd main for assassins already
the skill conc has the same issues as the skill fury, but worse. you cant run down someone with conc. feel free to test tele conc though
pure zeal has a home in pure melee duels already. paladins already have 2 main builds, libby and charger, we dont need games flooded with paladins. However, I have no problem allowing a zealer to level to 31 as well.
i cant comment on poisen dagger as i dont know the build
psn nova i dont see what 1 level will do for the build, for the builds where I have said +1 level, there is a tangible improvement in the quality of life of the build
we dont need summon necro's sorry
summon druids are not viable
1 level to fissure wont do anything for the build
holy freeze is just another paladin and i already commented paladins above.

/e i also want nova sorc to be viable, but its just not and nothing i do will change that.
/e Skullflower i disagree with you that there were alot of druids around and that they did way better then other classes in both tours and tvts. the tour results are in my profile feel free to browse them. excepting twinsen (who dominated on just about anything he used, and bear in mind he was a windy not a shaper) there were no great druid players. no disrespect to the druid players intended.


Going by the winners of ur tournaments, apart from a charger winning the first ever 30 tour no other paladin has won?

Does this mean we need to buff paladins? If so we can discuss removing the prayer ban on paladins, might give them a fair chance.
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#442
Nov 17 2021 04:20pm
Quote (ferdia @ Nov 17 2021 11:12pm)

/e i also want nova sorc to be viable, but its just not and nothing i do will change that.


don't say it, don't say it, don't say it...

MAYBE WE COULD LET EM LVL TO 99

DAMNIT I said it, that was uncalled for sorry! :rofl:


(am I still undercover in my opinion that I hate the idea of letting anyone go to another lvl than 30?) I somehow feel this is a big big thing that would have possible new llders like 'dafuq is this lvl 30 duels or lvl whatever duels?' and immediately turn away from the idea of building a char.

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#443
Nov 17 2021 04:23pm
I am against banning something in a new game that has not had an oppertunity or has not had months of play testing with optimal gear. Why would you ban a build just because its better then the old version and its easy to write a rule to moderate it ? I personally dont like firewall but so what if they are stronger now. Look at the assassin class, its super strong now for a variety of reasons and I am trying not to nerf it at all.

if your reason for not allowing fringe builds to be made stronger is because it was not done before or just because, well thats just narrowminded. give a proper reason not to do it and i will listen. try to make a sound argument. i could just as easily say your wrong and im right, but i am not, i am explaining why this should be considered and the responses i am getting is "we never did it before why should we do it now" or "lol rules we dont need rules" or "ban esfw its too strong" or "ok let me level all my fringe builds x level so".

This post was edited by ferdia on Nov 17 2021 04:27pm
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#444
Nov 17 2021 04:28pm
Quote (ferdia @ Nov 17 2021 11:23pm)
I am against banning something in a new game that has not had an oppertunity or has not had months of play testing with optimal gear. Why would you ban a build just because its better then the old version and its easy to write a rule to moderate it ? I personally dont like firewall but so what if they are stronger now. Look at the assassin class, its super strong now for a variety of reasons and I am trying not to nerf it at all.

if your reason for not allowing fringe builds to be made stronger is because it was not done before or just because, well thats just narrowminded.


Well with that reasoning we can just avoid banning any builds and see how they play out? Fw is the most toxic and boring char to play against, that is super strong with trash gear. If you want your games flooded with that then by all means go ahead, but why bother with any other nerfs to other builds then? Like the no prayer on paladins will break lld if it's removed in the start

I guess the point of the rule discussion is to discuss all rules and agree on something to works for all realms?

So make a poll and see if the majority of ppl wants chars lvld past lvl 30 or not. If a majority wants it, then by all means go ahead. But if not we can stop discussing it.

Feels like the most fair way to do?
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#445
Nov 17 2021 04:33pm
Quote (ferdia @ Nov 17 2021 11:23pm)
I am against banning something in a new game that has not had an oppertunity or has not had months of play testing with optimal gear. Why would you ban a build just because its better then the old version and its easy to write a rule to moderate it ? I personally dont like firewall but so what if they are stronger now. Look at the assassin class, its super strong now for a variety of reasons and I am trying not to nerf it at all.

if your reason for not allowing fringe builds to be made stronger is because it was not done before or just because, well thats just narrowminded.


Well... agree and not, my reasoning is that the base of this thread and community is the number 30 and that certain chars and or players that now feel weakened by D2R mechanics/bugs/whatever should either be more creative in their build or exhaust every other possibility to be viable before just being allowed to go higher lvl.
I just think it to be slightly awkward to go into a first tourney dueling up against lvl 29 or 30 or 31 or 35 or whatever instead of first seeing whats what at everybody lvl 30.

Let me give a strange example: If you say build 'xx' is allowed to go to 31, what if I make that char and put just 1 point in skill 'xx' and never use it... that gives me 5 free stat points then?

edited 30 to 31 in the line above this

This post was edited by Supp13 on Nov 17 2021 04:40pm
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#446
Nov 17 2021 04:33pm
I dont see your counter argument (this was at Seb)
I do see your counter argument (this was at Supp)

if the general consensus is leave it at 30 for now and see some tournament results over the next few months, I can live with that.

This post was edited by ferdia on Nov 17 2021 04:34pm
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#447
Nov 17 2021 04:34pm
Quote (ferdia @ Nov 17 2021 11:33pm)
I dont see your counter argument.


mine?

Why don't we make a poll and see what the majority thinks?
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#448
Nov 17 2021 04:35pm
I feel like batman right now.
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#449
Nov 17 2021 04:35pm
Quote (ferdia @ Nov 17 2021 04:23pm)
I am against banning something in a new game that has not had an oppertunity or has not had months of play testing with optimal gear. Why would you ban a build just because its better then the old version and its easy to write a rule to moderate it ? I personally dont like firewall but so what if they are stronger now. Look at the assassin class, its super strong now for a variety of reasons and I am trying not to nerf it at all.

if your reason for not allowing fringe builds to be made stronger is because it was not done before or just because, well thats just narrowminded. give a proper reason not to do it and i will listen. try to make a sound argument. i could just as easily say your wrong and im right, but i am not, i am explaining why this should be considered and the responses i am getting is "we never did it before why should we do it now" or "lol rules we dont need rules" or "ban esfw its too strong" or "ok let me level all my fringe builds x level so".


You are trying to allow levels higher than 30 in a Level 30 Tournament. My arguments have nothing to do with "this is how things have always been done". It is a fundamental problem if you allow levels higher than 30 in a level 30 bracket. Not sure how else I could try to convey this point.

If you MUST try to make "fringe" builds more viable, then you can try to create specific rulesets for specific matchups. But personally I think this is a little much.
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#450
Nov 17 2021 04:35pm
Quote (ferdia @ Nov 17 2021 11:35pm)
I feel like batman right now.


you are batman :o
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