61 HRC is the problem, not the VG10. The basic model spyderco delica's and endura's are probably the most popular VG10 knives out there, and I've used some OG slipjoints in VG10 as well, and its wonderful. More stainless than D2, easier to catch an edge than D2, and at least on spyderco's heat treat they hold a better edge and for longer than 8cr, aus8/a, 440C, etc.. I haven't used any of the sandvik 12c or 14c yet, so can't compare it to that.

Also, you can never make a high carbon steel not rust, but if you force a patina on it (vinegar, mustard, gun blue, etc...) since its a different form of oxidation it will take a lot longer for red rust to start forming, which is the shit you don't want. I keep a couple Old Hickory butcher knives in the kitchen for big cuts, and they're basic bitch 1095, but they turn orange if you leave em untouched for a day. Force a patina and you can go a week without oil if you don't actually live in a swamp. Hit em with the barest glint of olive oil and they're good for a month.

As far as kitchen knives though, I'm too much of a victorinox fanboy. I finally broke down and added a 3rd knife to my main row, because its kindof a pain in the ass to chop vegetables with a semi stiff 6" curved boning knife or a 4" utility knife, so a 6" chef got added.

But you’re using different angles on the kitchen knives right?!?

The wusthof has 14 degrees per side for 28 degree cutting edge. On my bush crafting knives I do a 40 degree edge with a 30 degree back bevel for edge toughness/retention

Yeah dude I stripped my bk16 and forced a patina because the coating was really rough. Got the micarta scales too. Love it haha. Apparently wusthof uses a proprietary blend high carbon at 58 hrc. Should do an amateur better than 61 anyways. Although Spyderco doesn’t release their hrc specs, based on sharpening my sage 5 it feels definitely above 60. I’m surprised to hear their vg10is below that?
Sage 5 is s30v btw

This post was edited by Belarathon on Dec 30 2020 07:35pm

S30V (and many other modern super steels like S35VN, M390, 3v, M4, etc...) frequently need to be above 60 else you're damn near using chinese '440 stainless' with a shitty heat treat. If you ever heard anyone bitch about the edge retention on a $400+ CRK Sebenza or Inigo, which is S35VN, its because for YEARS he treated them around 58 or less. Yes, technically you do get easier sharpening, but the minute it sees cardboard boxes you better hope you carry a pocket stone and/or strop, plus the modern super steels are supposed to be very hard and very tough so it kinda defeats the purpose of using that steel, imo.

And, on a lot of this new shit you wont run into serious chipping issues until you're pushing 65 HRC. Again, this all depends on the steel though, some of this new shit may need 62+ HRC to keep up with basic 1095 at 58 just because of how the crystalline structure works out. If the VG10 I have is at that 60-61 level, idk, but it sharpens & polishes far easier than my S30V BM 940, but doesn't hold an edge quite as long. Worthwhile tradeoff, imo, especially when the endura is a third the cost of a 940. As far as belt knives, I prefer simple carbon steels 1075-1095. I love my mini bushlore, I love my Jeff White french trade knife, and I love the modified old hickory knives (so far, haven't had a chance to really go cutting with my latest mod yet).

Also, my mother decided to just hand me a couple hundred bucks for christmas and told me not to use it for bills, and I was looking real hard at a BK16 with micarta (and an ESEE 3 or 4, cant remember) but I decided I didn't need more knives. I bought a gambeson coat & chausses instead. You know you have a lot of knives when part of your reasoning for not getting another is "I have no idea where I'm going to put this, my box barely closes..."

Lmao!! Can’t praise a Patina’d micarta’d bk16 enough tbh but to make it good you need a custom sheath and the micarta scales which then raises the price to around the point that you could get something a little more high end. The standard sheath with bk16 is truly bad haha. Still, I think you might agree that nothing takes a beating like ka-bar, it’s a great investment. I prefer it over my helle temagami for every task except finer carving. What are you going to get with your couple hundy then?! Get a hatchet haha

We need the legendary customs collector up in this chat

Btw brad thanks for all the very interesting info. Didn’t know a lot of that.

This post was edited by Belarathon on Dec 30 2020 08:59pm

Yeah, the prices of a decent kydex is bad enough, god forbid you want leather. At least something like kabar is popular enough most places have a knife or template on hand and you don't have to ship them your piece first. And yes, I have a USN marked kabar that was my grandfathers when he was in the navy, and you can tell he used it to pry shit (bent tip) and cut open cans (far more rounded than a new one) and saw plenty of salt water (pitting) but its still solid as hell after 60 years. Absolutely nothing I've ever seen has told me kabars are anything less than bomb proof.

Also, I decided to get armor. Gambeson is layered & quilted cloth, cotton in this case, and ~25 layers iirc. Got a long jacket & essentially chaps (they call them chausses) made of the stuff. Thought about an axe or hatchet, but I have one of my great grandfathers hatchets in the garage that I havent grabbed a handle for yet. I'm a shit woodworker, so I won't make one for this hatchet (I have a couple axes I'm going to practice on) but I got a buddy who has a side business as a woodworker and I'm thinking about asking him if he wants to take a crack at it.

I do have a couple of pretty sweet pieces in the collection now though, including some rather rare ones. The one I'm actually enjoying the most right now is a case sodbuster with a linerlock, which they didn't make many of, and only for like 2 years. Always loved the pattern, but slipjoints still sketch me out after cutting the piss out of myself all the time as a kid with them, so the linerlock is something I really like.

Oh cool do you practice swordplay then? I have two cousins my age who are brothers and super into swordplay. When they were younger one of them build a chain mail out of coke can tabs and then told the other to swing a sword at his forearm to test it. End result: sword did not make it through, no cuts at all!...... but a broken forearm lmao. Everytime I visit home they make me practice with them using wooden swords and they basically beat the shit out of me lol. They know all the moves and how to block and parry properly. I’m just basically standing there with a curved stick trying to swing it like a bat haha
Ps I’d be too afraid of using a slip joint haha

This post was edited by Belarathon on Dec 30 2020 09:39pm

Good man

str8 up this thread looks like a conversation between serial killers