XD ended up going with just lbolt/normal throw anyways

i really really like the idea of invis reg throws, free mana and cannot see means even Tofu1 cannot dodge all nuke.



that guy likely has some insight!

seems like sacrificing for kb on your gloves (or howltusk, but eh, circ >>>) in lieu of good kb javas would be better than going all-in on the physical fury throws
mana would be the only bar here, because a 20 pvp damage unblockable bolt with knockback is going to do more than a 57 pvp damage blockable missable invisible throw projectile- it might have an expected value around 12 pvp damage after mitigation
there's also the question of fury effectiveness against someone who isn't using viper+string. It adds the lightning damage to both the projectile and subprojectiles, so even with only 1 target it can hit twice per throw, and 1-300 fury will do +8 pvp damage vs 75% light / 0 mdr. Of which half is unblockable. Actually that's pretty shit and ignorable, and since everyone has mdr that won't matter
but given zephyr also has no knockback and basically 0 damage it seems like you'd definitely benefit from kb there too

I just imagine knockback bolts as being better in most matchups until the mana runs out. How long can that 15 per bolt be sustained?

This post was edited by Goomshill on Nov 26 2018 11:33am

I wouldn't use kb gloves but kb on my javs is welcome, wish I could find some good ones

Yeah within the same couple days of posting thread I decided against Fury. I was new to the char so I had to consider it

europ builds with stealth and often nats boots are more common now. so a bit of an MDR loss there. some FCR belt users as well. but yeah string/magi still on like 75% of chars that could use them or more.

but my main point is, whats so important about gloves that its not worth just using a +1java/kb or +10% ias/kb craft? With bolt, fury & ga all carrying it and kb being so critical for a zon who sidesteps people and interrupts their next move, I'm very loathe to use trangs on my damach zon in HLD but whats the opportunity cost in lld, a +2/10 glove or deaths or bloodfist? If you're using 2/10s anyway, I imagine that the build could be done with the 0/10/kb or 1/0/kb and be a lot more annoying to approach.

a pair like these give plenty of bonuses over simple 1/kb or 10/kb

dex, replife, 2x res stacks, 1x more skill OR 10 ias

personally i never even likes using deaths set on a hybrid zon, the dmg difference without the 2x skills is substantial. also replife isn't abundant on this build in some setups. 2x sojs lock up the rings, string locks up belt, boots could be rep boots but i dont like that. ammy can have, sshroud has, and circ could have. shield could too for that matter i suppose. i just know the gear he's using and which pieces do and dont have rep,and know 5 more on gloves is not to be overlooked here.



that said ive never seen a pair of 1jav/kb gloves, those would be worth testing to see if they work.

historically i just use a Nef up'd rogues iirc, and wsg KB if i need it. can lead to death or bullshit dodgelocks tho.

kb ga is annoying, but kb bolt is frustrating

throw + w = KB bolt

obviously that doesn't work against some builds who u need a shield up vs, and it's not nearly as effective as a pair of KB javs. but who has 4/30/kb javs? i looked for a long ass time and only ever a few pairs came up....