Wow I guess I really feel like top level bowas, necros, windys, would all lose vs libby. Where traps and fireballs are even. I yearn to test

In in favor of 10 rep limit on prayer skilled. Makes kaz have best on slot items

Maybe so, especially for necro and windy, but if they are top level players for the classes then I believe it would be even. Libby is an extremely op class vs the bottom 95%. Still very strong vs the top 5% of each class, but not at #1 status imo. There will always be advocates for each way of thinking though. I know Rikid thinks hdin/libby is boss as well. I just pat his head and say "that's nice, dear" when he starts on about his hdin strats

I always considered libby #2 only to fireball

Have you dueled any of the new necro setup with str bugged stealth? its distinctly different than the vmagi matchup

I did too but in the last couple years barb items have been buffed up to the point that your average barb is using max ias/150+ed/erep nagas and can out-dps anything in lld.

Barbs used to be pretty good, but when most were using robos or robo/honor build you could afford to get caught by them a few times per duel and be totally fine, maybe even more than that. Nowadays you will die after being caught 1-2 times by a barb unless you're an es sorc pretty much. They also have 3k life and some are really good with their teleswaps and have good ping. So while a barb can make a very large number of mistakes per duel and still win, most casters can only afford to make 1 mistake per duel. And some of these barbs like brothagoo are really pro with their teles as well, however that wouldn't help as much in the bvh duel ofc.

Barbs basically got buffed up better than any other char type by this mass botter/item creation era which brought them up a lot higher. Consider that jawn beat your hdin using robos, now imagine a barb player on his level using ereps and jewels that did not exist at that time.

Please stop

Haha sorry just bored at work so I have time for these big paragraphs!

Paragraphs are cool but like you're scaring me barbs will be in my nightmares are ill see right through their weapons

My opinion from my own experience

tier 1

Fb
Fw
Ls trap
teledruid ( maybe tier 2 for tvt. )
barb ( def tier 1 for tvt, tier 1 or 2 for 1v1 )

tier 2

blizz
lightsorc
libby & hdin ( Probably tier 1 for tvt considering how versatile it is and good for 1vX and aura support, vigor for team rushing or hammer fields to protect team etc )
bowa
plague/ga
charger
necro

While all in tier 2 can be strong if played well, for both 1v1s and tvt they do have at least 3 or more disadvantage matchups each imo.

tier 3

v/t
shaper
cs java
kicker
uncommon builds etc.

(builds that are at a disadvantage in more than half of the 1v1 m/u's.)
Could be more precise with 4 tiers but cba maybe forgot some builds.

This post was edited by Twinsen on Feb 24 2017 10:50am