"Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."

Just wondering how people feel about this, still applicable today? If not, why?

Link relating to the Vatican's assets -> http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20061201175736AAx89Vt

So... is the pope going to heaven? I know a lot of money is donated to various charities, but I'm not convinced that that is where 100% of the money goes. Thoughts?

It is not talking about the literal rich man. It is talking about the person who gets consumed with riches, and loses sight of the kingdom.

Luke 16:19-24

19 “There was a rich man who was dressed in purple and fine linen and lived in luxury every day. 20 At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores 21 and longing to eat what fell from the rich man’s table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.

22 “The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham’s side. The rich man also died and was buried. 23 In Hades, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. 24 So he called to him, ‘Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.’


so...?

But woe unto you that are rich! for ye have received your consolation. -- Luke 6:24
Go to now, ye rich men, weep and howl for your miseries that shall come upon you. -- James 5:1

This post was edited by STANUL on Jul 5 2012 06:53pm

Taking scripture out of context to support your cause is usually not the right thing to do...

James 5 -

5 Now listen, you rich people, weep and wail because of the misery that is coming on you. 2 Your wealth has rotted, and moths have eaten your clothes. 3 Your gold and silver are corroded. Their corrosion will testify against you and eat your flesh like fire. You have hoarded wealth in the last days. 4 Look! The wages you failed to pay the workers who mowed your fields are crying out against you. The cries of the harvesters have reached the ears of the Lord Almighty. 5 You have lived on earth in luxury and self-indulgence. You have fattened yourselves in the day of slaughter.[a] 6 You have condemned and murdered the innocent one, who was not opposing you.

^^ I really don't see how that changes anything

and that was just my half-assed google searching, thanks for posting the whole thing

It changes everything... It is talking about those who are CONSUMED in money, and care about nothing else. Your passage from Luke is also taken out of context. It begins in verse 14. Read back a few more verses and it makes more sense as to who he was talking to, and why he was saying it.

I'm honestly trying to understand here... at what point does one become "consumed" by money? When accumulating wealth takes precedent over alleviating human suffering? Is it ok to want something that is the product of slave labor, simply because you don't own the slaves? I mean that's like saying dying from reckless endangerment isn't suicide

Well in James it talked about the person who had had workers work their land and they didn't pay them (greed). It also talked about living life based on self-indulgences (which is a sin) as well as hoarding money in the last days. Again, the concept that money is the ONLY thing that matters in your world. This doesn't have to be just money either. Anything that consumes your life and takes your eyes off God, people, and the kingdom is a sin.

What Dune1 said. This verse applies equally to just about everyone in any "rich" nation that lives on self-indulgence, and covets wealth and material goods. Ie, modern society. People value their wealth and "stuff" over God, and idolize it.

For instance, the obsessive nature of those that buy certain gadgets, like Apple products, which are produced by near slaves in slave like conditions in other countries.

Alright, so as long as your life does not entirely revolve around money, you're good. Thank you for your patience with me, I swear I'm not trying to troll.

What does this mean for regular working people? What if you are conscious that your luxuries come at the cost of an enormous amount of suffering? I'm by no means a wealthy person in American standards (I'm actually on the lower end of the spectrum...), but I live like a king compared to most of the world. Is it ok to participate in the manipulation of people you'll never see in your whole life?

i.e. you choose to buy Nike shoes for $50 as opposed to an off-brand pair for $75, which is more expensive because the workers make a decent wage and receive health benefits. Is this greed? Is coveting anything that is a status symbol in this way a sin?




O.O

But yeah that's pretty much exactly what I was getting at. I guess I know a lot of people who are going to hell

This post was edited by STANUL on Jul 5 2012 07:45pm