My friend is a very serious right wing individual and he is Christian/believes in God.
He claimed to me that he fully believes in evolution and he does not like gays at all (just some quick background information on him). He told me he heard from a ''hardcore Christian'' that EVERYONE on earth is born gay and that it is our job & duty to not sin and change to being straight. This friend of his was supposedly quoting the bible.
Now my friend tried telling me this and convincing me of this and I couldn't help but laugh. Because I do not believe that is the case at all and I do not even think that it says anything remotely close to that in the bible.

Anyway, my question is & I'm curious if anyone knows the bible inside out and if it says this anywhere in it. Because what he is trying to tell me just seems to be ludicrous to me. And feel free to post anything else regarding this general topic.
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This would make me wary of his claims right off the bat. I've spent time studying evolution and creation and have found no compelling reason to believe that evolution is correct much less supported by the bible. Secondly, if "does not like gays at all" is a quote then he's off the mark there as well. Homosexuality is a sin, but it's clear that Christians are to hate the sin and love the man. Sin comes in many forms and most people make sin a lifestyle just like homosexuality whether they realize it or not.



I'd like to see the verse that says this. I don't think it exists. Humans are born with a "sin nature" because of what Adam and Eve did in the Garden of Eden. Before then, man was unaware of the differences between good and evil. That sinful nature doesn't mean that we're all born compulsive murders and adulterers; rather that we have the capacity and inclination to sin.

This post was edited by Durance Of Love on May 8 2011 05:15pm

What did your research find about "God" ?

i heard they found a thread of his robe inside the arc that is inside a mountain, along with noah's cell phone.

About as much substantive, empirical evidence as evolution has in its favor; that is to say none. There's no way to tie existing data and evidences to the creation (God-made or otherwise) of the universe without large leaps in estimation. The estimated age of the universe has been increasing by enormous amounts since the advent of 'modern science' and it's frankly arrogant to assume theories are factual about the state of earth billions of years ago when we've only existed for 1/2600000th of the age of the universe according to current evolutionary theory.

The studying I've done about evolutionary evidence has been littered with falsified and/or estimated data which is the main source of my disbelief. There is zero empirical evidence for the theory of evolution, yet it is treated as fact. The pillars of evolution as taught in the classroom are largely erroneous and serve as the same factors in the template of a religion sans a deity. It's an alternate answer to our existence and purpose, but not more factually correct than the bible.

The amount of data and theories surrounding theories of creation is too lengthy to list here, but suffice it to say no one has the answer. The bible teaches that God created everything and most common iterations of evolution teaches that everything always was. Neither is provable, both require faith. Could God have used evolution to create life? It's possible, but not in character with the God of the bible nor mentioned anywhere in the bible.

ask him what verse says were all gay at birth

@durance
empirical observations are not the only observations science can make
bacterial resistance to penicillin is enough to validate evolution theory. although macro evolution is not concrete it is alot more than falsified and erroneously estimated. you must ask yourself why modern animal fossils are not found with fossils of ancient extinct species. the simple answer is because they did not coexist

There are many kinds of evolution, yes. The bible mentions that the living will bring forth after their kind. Small changes within a species is observable, but only to a limit. As with bacteria, types of organisms can develop or evolve resistances to drugs or radiation, but not to an infinite degree. That which I disagree with is macro evolution or speciation. There are animals, such as the Coelacanth, which have produced index fossils for eras millions of years ago that still exist today. That doesn't mean that modern animals didn't coexist with them as they clearly do today. As well as blood cells found in dinosaur bones and shoeprints inside dinosaur tracks among other occurrences. There's no way for me to address every inconsistency in evolution or even part of its evidence in the realm of fossils, the subject matter is simply too large. I'm always willing to look at writings on the subject and as I've said, I don't believe that it's impossible for God to have used that mechanism to create life, rather that it would be out of character.

That being said, I said I've found no compelling reason to believe evolution as irrefutable fact because for every proof I've seen disproofs. I've not been convinced by what I've seen that the age of the earth is able to be accurately estimated or that it is indeed as old as modern evolutionary theory suggests. That is largely the source of my disbelief as it's the linchpin for evolution.



You're right, but they're the most reliable when correctly recorded and much more so than extrapolation especially involving times and distances as large as are used.

This post was edited by Durance Of Love on May 8 2011 08:22pm

Regarding evolution (which is not the main question), Christians do not deny that biological evolution takes place. That is, a change in an animals species over time. Where many/most Christians (any many scientists) find fault with Darwin's evolution is Natural Selection, which states that random mutations take place over time.

Regarding homosexuality, there is nowhere in the Bible that says everybody is born gay. However, it does say in Genesis 1 that animals and plants reproduce "after their kind".

this sounds like a serious troll lol

Actually, most Christians also agree that natural selection occurs, it's macro-evolution that has no empirical proof or evidence. That is, one species evolving into a different species. Some people claim bacteria as a form of this, but guess what, it's still bacteria, it hasn't changed into something else entirely.

To answer the original question, I would politely ask him for verse references on where he came to his conclusions, and see if he'll open up a more direct dialogue on the subject.

Njaguar,

In the Intelligent Design movement going on right now, as well as in Christian philosophy, I have found many people do not support Natural Selection because of the element of random mutation. They typically try to argue for "irreducible complexity" to combat this. You do bring up a good point though.