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Mar 14 2011 11:42pm
Quote (Kamikizzle @ Mar 15 2011 01:40am)
where are the verses in the bible that actually say satan is:
a) an angel
b) an angel who was cast out of heaven specifically for rebelling against god


i believe somewhere in the book of ezekiel
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Mar 15 2011 08:04am
Quote (cadizzle1392 @ Mar 14 2011 10:42pm)
i believe somewhere in the book of ezekiel


do you know which specifically?
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Mar 15 2011 08:17am
Quote (Kamikizzle @ Mar 15 2011 10:04am)
[FONT='Times New Roman']do you know which specifically?[/FONT]

Luke 10:18
[Jesus] replied, “I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven."

Isaiah 14:12
How you have fallen from heaven,
morning star, son of the dawn!
You have been cast down to the earth,
you who once laid low the nations!

Note: "Lucifer" is the Latin name for Venus, which is known as the morning star because you can see it in the morning.

Then there's also Ezekiel 28. That verse is being addressed to two Earthly kings but most people take it to have a dual meaning, adopting a literal translation in addition to the figurative one that is implied by the context

28:13-19 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=ezek%2028:13-19&version=NIV <-- linked because pasting it here would take a lot of space
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Mar 15 2011 08:48am
Quote (bentherdonethat @ Mar 15 2011 07:17am)
Luke 10:18
[Jesus] replied, “I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven."

Isaiah 14:12
How you have fallen from heaven,
  morning star, son of the dawn!
You have been cast down to the earth,
  you who once laid low the nations!

Note: "Lucifer" is the Latin name for Venus, which is known as the morning star because you can see it in the morning.

Then there's also Ezekiel 28. That verse is being addressed to two Earthly kings but most people take it to have a dual meaning, adopting a literal translation in addition to the figurative one that is implied by the context

28:13-19 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=ezek28:13-19&version=NIV <-- linked because pasting it here would take a lot of space


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucifer#The_Morning_Star_in_Isaiah_14:12

ive seen the verse in isaiah however there seems to be some scholarly debate on whether or not the term morning star is actually being applied to satan or the actual morning star
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Mar 15 2011 09:03am
Quote (Kamikizzle @ Mar 15 2011 10:48am)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucifer#The%5FMorning%5FStar%5Fin%5FIsaiah%5F14:12

ive seen the verse in isaiah however there seems to be some scholarly debate on whether or not the term morning star is actually being applied to satan or the actual morning star

Yeah, there are debates on pretty much every verse that can either be taken literally or figuratively. I'm not surprised by that. Those are just the verses I could find that could be used to indicate that Satan was an angel that was cast out of Heaven.
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Mar 15 2011 09:16am
Quote (bentherdonethat @ Mar 15 2011 08:03am)
Yeah, there are debates on pretty much every verse that can either be taken literally or figuratively. I'm not surprised by that. Those are just the verses I could find that could be used to indicate that Satan was an angel that was cast out of Heaven.


its not figuratively vs literally its the consistency of the use of the greek/latin word in other parts of the bible that refer to the actual morning star and not satan
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Mar 15 2011 09:41am
Quote (Kamikizzle @ Mar 15 2011 11:16am)
its not figuratively vs literally its the consistency of the use of the greek/latin word in other parts of the bible that refer to the actual morning star and not satan

Yeah, but even if the writers were literally referring to the morning star, it's possible to interpret that figuratively as referring to Satan, so there is also a problem with interpretations.

Another interesting consistency problem arises in the words that are all translated as Hell. There are four words that are translated to "Hell," and they include Sheol, Hades, Tartarus, and Gehenna. For an analysis of these words in relation to the Bible, see http://www.inplainsite.org/html/hell_sheol_hades_or_gehenna.html
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Mar 15 2011 04:35pm
Quote (cadizzle1392 @ Mar 14 2011 11:54pm)
my bad u right i didnt mean 2 put that
i ment u can overcome temptation when walking in the spirit
thx for correcting me, i am only human!


Sorry, didn't intend on offending you.
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Mar 15 2011 09:21pm
Quote (Kisssofdeath @ Mar 15 2011 06:35pm)
Sorry, didn't intend on offending you.


none taken watsoever
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Mar 17 2011 04:52pm
I beleive god created the angel out of love even knowing what would happen another thought is I beleive He wanted to make a heavan made up of his children that loved him.
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