d2jsp
Log InRegister
d2jsp Forums > Off-Topic > General Chat > Christian Fellowship > Such Nonsense > " There Is No Hell "
Prev1345678Next
Closed New Topic
Admin
Posts: 24,840
Joined: Sep 24 2002
Gold: 43,367.72
Trader: Trusted
Jun 15 2011 08:32am
Quote (Vio @ 15 Jun 2011 03:59)
First of all, I'm just not going to respond to weasleface anymore. I'm perfectly fine with people disagreeing with me, but he's just ridiculing me, and the argument is going in circles with every post he makes.

nate86: You miss the part where I'm actually saying that I don't believe in an actual heaven the way it is described in the Bible. When I read about heaven, I find it to be a metaphor to all that's good in life. God judges us continuously, and what we do has very direct consequences, already way before we die. That's the way I see it, and I don't see a reason why this couldn't be true.


Read the book of Job, preferably with a study guide. There are many verses in the bible that make it clear that when good/bad things happen, we're not necessarily being rewarded or punished directly by God. Specifically in the book of Job, it outlines numerous examples of "bad people" that seem to prosper, and never face punishment (in this life). Certainly you can witness the same around you, good people that have horrible lives and circumstances, and seemingly bad people that have great lives that act with impunity.

From a free will perspective, this makes complete sense; if you were punished directly for each bad thing you did, pretty soon you'd stop doing bad things, thus negating your free will. Likewise if you're constantly rewarded for good behavior. Why do you think dogs are so trainable? Because we punish for bad, and reward for good. The dog ends up being a "dumb" creature that merely follows our commands. This is not what God wants from us, he wants us to do things in his glory without reward or punishment, of our own free will.
Member
Posts: 59,681
Joined: Dec 8 2009
Gold: 169.78
Jun 15 2011 09:08am
Quote (UncleMuscles @ Jun 13 2011 08:12pm)
I find it more and more, people believing there isnt a hell....

it is clearly stated in the bible and Jesus talks about it numerous times.... so what is this " theory " that there is no hell?
if there wasnt a hell, then we would be able to do whatever we want and there would be zero consequences.... we could just kill ourselves and go to heaven....

I truly believe this is a lie from satan.... hes decieving so many people to think that HE isnt real and that HELL isnt real.... so that more and more people will fall into sin... hes just sitting back and laughing!

I am a firm believer in heaven and hell. You will be judged! but I do not fear hell! because i know my destination after this life! This world is not my home!

What are your thoughts, and if you believe there isnt a hell, try and prove it.



for the same reason you believe in the "theory" of a Hell.
different religion.
Member
Posts: 20,253
Joined: Apr 30 2008
Gold: 5,267.97
Jun 15 2011 09:39am
Quote (njaguar @ Jun 15 2011 04:32pm)
Read the book of Job, preferably with a study guide. There are many verses in the bible that make it clear that when good/bad things happen, we're not necessarily being rewarded or punished directly by God. Specifically in the book of Job, it outlines numerous examples of "bad people" that seem to prosper, and never face punishment (in this life). Certainly you can witness the same around you, good people that have horrible lives and circumstances, and seemingly bad people that have great lives that act with impunity.

From a free will perspective, this makes complete sense; if you were punished directly for each bad thing you did, pretty soon you'd stop doing bad things, thus negating your free will. Likewise if you're constantly rewarded for good behavior. Why do you think dogs are so trainable? Because we punish for bad, and reward for good. The dog ends up being a "dumb" creature that merely follows our commands. This is not what God wants from us, he wants us to do things in his glory without reward or punishment, of our own free will.


I probably won't be reading it - at least not anytime soon, but from the things you've said, I think I generally agree with the idea. Still, I think living as a good person will give you more chance to have a prosperous life. Of course, there are people who know perfectly how to exploit innocent people, and they'll end up having everything they want while said innocent people life horrible lives. These are exceptions though, in my opinion. Just like not everybody who prays will gain prosperity, not every good person will. Still, I believe that God wants to motivate us with the good things in life.
Member
Posts: 32,093
Joined: Oct 11 2008
Gold: 18.00
Jun 15 2011 10:08am
Quote (Heights @ Jun 15 2011 09:29am)
I told you. The same Hebrew word is used for "hell", "the grave", "the pit" ... H7585, look it up!



^ what does this have to do with this "hell" you believe in?


you have been massively decieved. That is all.

whatever church your going to... get out of it
Member
Posts: 20,253
Joined: Apr 30 2008
Gold: 5,267.97
Jun 15 2011 10:19am
Quote (weasleface @ Jun 15 2011 06:08pm)
you have been massively decieved. That is all.

whatever church your going to... get out of it


Can you post any logical reason why you think he's "deceived"?
Member
Posts: 32,093
Joined: Oct 11 2008
Gold: 18.00
Jun 15 2011 12:04pm
Quote (Vio @ Jun 15 2011 12:19pm)
Can you post any logical reason why you think he's "deceived"?


I'm talking about the "no heaven & hell" part.

And ya there is tons of verses making it obvious there is heaven and hell.

I must have read it like a thousand times where it says "God sits on his throne in heaven" or something along those lines.
And when Jesus said "I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise" on the cross.

and tons more of course.
Member
Posts: 33,012
Joined: Jan 21 2008
Gold: 120.00
Jun 15 2011 12:25pm
like isaid earlier,

satan wants to deceive people into thinking that HE isnt real... and that hell isnt real.... so that way people will turn away from god because they will have nothing to fear....

why would satan want to be noticable.... if he was so obvious then people would instantly turn to god...... hes obviously going to be sneaky and tricky about this sort of thing...

and we know that satan is infact real....

Satan was cast out of heaven after Adam and Eve were created, because God said the Creation was still "very good" on day 6 after man had been created.

Lucifer was created perfect in all his ways, but iniquity was found in him. It was not put there by God. Lucifer created it.
( this is found in Ezekiel 28:15 )

Like man, the angels were created perfect, and with a free will.

Satan wanted to be God. The Bible tells us in 2nd Corinthians 4:4 that Satan has become the "god of this world". And Revelation 20:10 tells us that he will be eternally punished for it.

When Lucifer was cast out of Heaven, one third of all the angels were cast out with him. (Rev.12:4,9)

Satan was lifted up because of his beauty, he corrupted the wisdom by reason of his brightness (This is in Ezekiel 28:17)
Member
Posts: 20,253
Joined: Apr 30 2008
Gold: 5,267.97
Jun 15 2011 01:43pm
Quote (weasleface @ Jun 15 2011 08:04pm)
I'm talking about the "no heaven & hell" part.

And ya there is tons of verses making it obvious there is heaven and hell.

I must have read it like a thousand times where it says "God sits on his throne in heaven" or something along those lines.
And when Jesus said "I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise" on the cross.

and tons more of course.


I'm talking about logical reasons, not Biblical verses. The verses are the statements, but these statements should have reasonable evidence, from other sources.
Admin
Posts: 24,840
Joined: Sep 24 2002
Gold: 43,367.72
Trader: Trusted
Jun 15 2011 01:56pm
Quote (Vio @ 15 Jun 2011 14:43)
I'm talking about logical reasons, not Biblical verses. The verses are the statements, but these statements should have reasonable evidence, from other sources.


You're on the wrong subforum. Consider this is a friendly verbal on the matter (and my other post on the other topic). The context of this discussion (and subforum) is with regards to Christianity. The Bible forms an integral basis for Christianity.
Member
Posts: 20,253
Joined: Apr 30 2008
Gold: 5,267.97
Jun 15 2011 02:09pm
Quote (njaguar @ Jun 15 2011 09:56pm)
You're on the wrong subforum. Consider this is a friendly verbal on the matter (and my other post on the other topic). The context of this discussion (and subforum) is with regards to Christianity. The Bible forms an integral basis for Christianity.


And different interpretations of the Bible aren't welcome here? I find that insulting.
Go Back To Christian Fellowship Topic List
Prev1345678Next
Closed New Topic