we know that God has revealed himself to all people and that all men have rejected God

romans 1:19-20
since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20 For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse.

Are you saying that when God created the world, he intended for most of the human race to go to hell, only saving a select few? There's no choice in whether you're saved or not?

"hell" is merely the grave, ie. the world of the dead, not a literal place of eternal torment as many Christians still believe.

"This is the evil in everything that happens under the sun: The same destiny overtakes all. The hearts of men, moreover, are full of evil and there is madness in their hearts while they live, and afterwards they join the dead." - Ecc 9:3 (niv)

"For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing; they have no further reward, and even the memory of them is forgotten." - Ecc 9:5 (niv)

"Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with all your might, for in the grave, where you are going, there is neither working nor planning nor knowledge nor wisdom." - Ecc 9:10 (niv)

(bold mine) - the word here translated 'grave' is the SAME WORD that is translated 'hell' in the old testament in the KJV. the word is 'sheol' (it's a Hebrew word, literally meaning 'the world of the dead'). Its Greek equivalent in the new testament is 'hades' (also translated 'hell' in the KJV).

In addition, there are 11 more instances of the word 'hell' in the new testament, 9 of them spoken by Jesus himself, one in James' epistle, and the other in 1 Peter. the word that is translated "hell" in 10 of them is "gehenna" which literally means, "valley of the sons of Hinnom". Type that into Google and see what you get. It is spoken of many times in the old testament - see Jer 7:31 and Jer 32:35 for two examples. the 11th occurrence of the word 'hell' in 1 Peter is a totally different word ('tartarus').

if you are interested in the topic, PM me for more information.

This post was edited by Heights on May 21 2011 04:57am

Doubtful. He may have known that would occur, but that is different from intended.

Post #11 sort of answers this. You have to think back to understand this question, initially all of mankind did know God, once you back it up to the very beginning first 2 humans. Those that chose to turn their backs on God doomed themselves and their entire generational line, unless individuals within it were able to come to God through happenstance (missionaries, etc).

I see this accusation a lot, and it's natural to feel angry at God and blame him, but you cannot forget the role that their ancestors took, and exclude them from blame. A good analogy is some parents with children, whom decide to cross a large desert without food or water. Their actions may doom themselves and their children.

Some may consider this part of a generational sin thing, which you're not accountable for, but I'm not sure if it applies in this situation. I have also heard others say that those that never had a chance to know God/Christ still have a chance at salvation, if they lived a "Christ-like" life. I haven't really seen any scripture to back up "only Christ-like behavior", though, and plenty that contradicts such a viewpoint.

So let's break this down for a moment, some people will blame God, and accuse him of being "mean/evil/whatever", but what have you done to rectify the situation? Perhaps this is even more of a reason and calling to do missionary work to help save these people, and if you get down to the nitty gritty, perhaps the only person to blame is yourself for doing nothing to help these people. It's like standing by and watching people die in a fire, when perhaps you could have ran in and saved them, or helped to put out the fire. Use that passion for a good purpose!

so what your saying is all of the current human race is condemed for the actions of a few people that we have no knowledge of who they are truely in flesh? Never knew them, isnt that ultimiatly like...being discriminative

This post was edited by RavenKnot on May 21 2011 07:43am

Did you read what I wrote at all? Please study basic Christianity 101. I was addressing a very specific question, which you are basically repeating. I'll give you a start in your studies; everyone is born into sin, and fall short of the glory of God. Discrimination implies a level of unfairness, which, if you think of God in this manner, that is probably your first problem.

So we must prove ourselves?

e: Hey now, your post doesn't say
edited on etc etc etc... unfair advantage.

This post was edited by jtd on May 21 2011 07:49am

If you truly are interested, start with something like this:
http://www.google.com/search?q=how+to+be+saved+as+a+christian
http://www.sbc.net/knowjesus/theplan.asp

And ultimately you should speak to a pastor/clergyman if you're truly interested in this aspect.

this has helped to answer alot of my questions, ty ty!

helped alot building up my faith also!

According to the Bible sin entered into the world through one man, Adam. All men are born with the capacity to sin; therefore all are in need of salvation. (Romans 5:12-14; Romans 3:23)

Which means we all need salvation, and we can get this through jesus. I found this on a website so i havent checked its validicity :

Stages of Salvation:

1.Repentance - means to change one's mind, a turning away from sin; a genuine feeling of regret or remorse toward sin. (Ezekiel 18:30)
2.Regeneration - means to be born of the Spirit of Jesus Christ; to accept Jesus as Lord and Savior; to be justified, made right with God; to be forgiven of one's sins. (John 3:3; I Corinthians 6:11)
3.Sanctification - to make holy; the process of growing to Christian maturity. (John 17:19)
4.Glorification - the final stage of salvation; the process of going home to be with the Lord; dwelling in heaven with Jesus. Perfection is reached in the stage of glorification. ( St. John 7:39; St. John 2)
a.Salvation - means deliverance from the bondage of sin
b.Sin - rebelling against God; falling short of the standard of God


So to answer the initial question, they could be sent to hell, but only if they lead a life pure of sin or have remorse and seek forgiveness, and depending on your standpoint with scripture weither they seek this forgiveness by accepting jesus as lord and saviour or weither they seek this from god will determine if they are not.

This post was edited by SUPACALIFRAGILISTICEXPALIDOCIOUS on May 21 2011 09:02am