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Mar 30 2022 06:08am
Florida lawmakers are advancing a pair of bills that would bar school districts from encouraging classroom discussions about sexual orientation or gender identity – what critics are calling "Don't Say Gay" bills.

Nearly a dozen states have introduced bills that would direct what students can and cannot be taught about the role of slavery in American history and the ongoing effects of racism in the U.S. today.

A Tennessee school board removed "Maus," a Pulitzer Prize-winning graphic novel about the Holocaust, from its curriculum.


1/ You cannot criticize cancel culture when you are burning books




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Mar 30 2022 06:34am
Schools have always had the ability to curtail the speech of students to maintain orderly learning environments, and governments have always had the ability to set curriculum of schools to decide what students are taught. There's no first amendment right for teacher to teach students about subjects outside their curriculum. The easy example of this is teaching religion. Private citizens have a first amendment right to their own religion, and to their expression of it. Teachers and students alike have a right to their religious expression. However, teachers may not use public classrooms to indoctrinate children into their religions. That would itself violate the first amendment. That's the basis of Engel v Vitale, Abington School District v. Schempp and Tinker v Des Moines among others. Private schools are under no such obligation. What bounds schools are given is a matter of the jurisdiction of government authorities regulating them, and that goes to local, state and federal government. What we have here is a state law superceding local government, which is within their jurisdiction.

When it comes to speech in schools in particular, all these nuanced precedents for first amendment boundaries and rights are necessary because schools lay at an uncomfortable intersection between the rights of an individual to express themselves and a government telling them how to think. If you give all the teachers at a public school the "freedom of speech" to lead christian prayers every morning and teach bible verses, you're violating the first amendment by having the state impose religion on students. If you restrict students from being able to pray on their own private time on school grounds, you're violating the first amendment by suppressing their religion. To navigate those difficulties, the supreme court precedent is to weigh compelling interests and substantial disruptions, to favor individual expression and scrutinize imposition of beliefs.

And falling on the wrong side of imposition of beliefs without any compelling interest, is what you get when teachers are telling kids age kindergarten to 3rd grade about sexual orientation or gender identity, which is not age appropriate or developmentally appropriate by either state standards or any sane standards. Its the right of parents to decide what is appropriate for their children to learn about such matters and when, not for the state to impose its own dogmatic beliefs on children to indoctrinate them into the latest social cult.
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Mar 30 2022 06:36am
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Mar 30 2022 06:56am
That depends on what the book is.
Can't hide abc pedo culture behind free speech.
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Mar 30 2022 07:11am
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Mar 30 2022 07:34am
being against demented propaganda is the hill to die on.
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Mar 30 2022 07:35am
preventing pedos access to lil kids isnt a "free speech" issue

nobody is so stupid that they cant see teaching this stuff to lil kids is a pathway for pedos to get at the kids. so when they are for it there is no mystery what they are really about.

just so its clear to ev1 what its really about
"where coming for your children"
"A Message From the Gay Community" Performed by the San Francisco Gay Men's Chorus
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ArOQF4kadHA

This post was edited by TiStuff on Mar 30 2022 07:54am
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Mar 30 2022 07:40am
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Mar 30 2022 07:46am
anyway just to drive that point home again-

Replace "Don't Say Gay" with "Don't Say God"

Public schools are forbidden from teaching the doctrine of jesus christ in their classrooms. School districts can't even pass regulations requiring them to teach christianity. That's not a violation of the first amendment, its a protection guaranteed by it. When the government is forcing ideology onto children in a classroom, restrictions on what they're being taught aren't restrictions on free speech, they're restrictions on compulsory speech, the opposite of free speech. All the supposed liberals and MSM lined up today to take shots at this law are channeling the spirit of the chuds who crusaded against Madalyn O'Hair and cheered for her to be dismembered. But besides the hypocrisy, the argument is a red herring. This is a matter of curriculum and school board vs local vs state vs federal regulation on what children should be taught, all of which could be reasonably within the bounds of legal curriculum, and a representative government has reason to favor parents choosing their children's sexual education over a state imposing it upon them.
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Mar 30 2022 07:52am
Quote (sirthom @ Mar 30 2022 07:56am)
That depends on what the book is.
Can't hide abc pedo culture behind free speech.


i thought speech, literature, imagery etc didnt matter. just actions.

speaking about pedo stuff, as you define it, isn't violence. actions are violence, not words.
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