d2jsp
Log InRegister
d2jsp Forums > Off-Topic > General Chat > Political & Religious Debate >
Poll > Harper's, Elites, The Left, And Cancel Culture
12321Next
Add Reply New Topic New Poll
  Guests cannot view or vote in polls. Please register or login.
Member
Posts: 22,442
Joined: Mar 3 2007
Gold: 76.11
Jul 7 2020 07:40pm
Earlier today, Harper's posted a letter co-signed by some of the biggest names in liberal literary, arts, and activist spaces. Such prominent co-signers include Noam Chomksy, JK Rowling, Gloria Steinem, Margaret Atwood, and countless others. This letter is an admonishment about the so-called "Cancel Culture" that is becoming increasingly associated with the discourse and dissent in left-leaning spaces. They speak out against the "new set of moral attitudes and political commitments that tend to weaken our norms of open debate and toleration of differences in favor of ideological conformity", particularly in the face of an upcoming electoral battle to unseat President Trump come November and in the backdrop of the various social justice movements that are being highlighted in the current times. The letter: https://harpers.org/a-letter-on-justice-and-open-debate/

The prevailing argument is that only through solidarity and unification that persists even when, or especially when, ideological purity and consensus is not achieved, will the left be able to counteract the right.

Quote (Harper's Letter)
The free exchange of information and ideas, the lifeblood of a liberal society, is daily becoming more constricted. While we have come to expect this on the radical right, censoriousness is also spreading more widely in our culture: an intolerance of opposing views, a vogue for public shaming and ostracism, and the tendency to dissolve complex policy issues in a blinding moral certainty. We uphold the value of robust and even caustic counter-speech from all quarters. But it is now all too common to hear calls for swift and severe retribution in response to perceived transgressions of speech and thought.


Quote (Harper's Letter)
This stifling atmosphere will ultimately harm the most vital causes of our time. The restriction of debate, whether by a repressive government or an intolerant society, invariably hurts those who lack power and makes everyone less capable of democratic participation. The way to defeat bad ideas is by exposure, argument, and persuasion, not by trying to silence or wish them away. We refuse any false choice between justice and freedom, which cannot exist without each other.


Many agree with this sentiment, beyond just the elites who co-signed, but also among the general population. However; of course, there are still many others who disagree. This letter has been met with criticisms highlighting that there is no such thing as "Cancel Culture", and that this is merely an attempt by elites within the left to avoid or assuage any sense of accountability. Some had the following to say:

Quote (Hamilton Nolan)
This entire spectacle of a letter, published in one of America’s most prestigious magazines, signed by dozens and dozens of famous writers and journalists and academics, declaring breathlessly that “We refuse any false choice between justice and freedom, which cannot exist without each other,” is almost intolerably exasperating. Its very existence is a devastating counterargument to its central point. Would it be rude to point out to these esteemed thinkers that the fact that they were considered prestigious enough to be invited to sign this letter is proof that they are not, in fact, being silenced? That, rather, this collective wallowing in self-pity over “censoriousness” by a group of people employed by Harvard and Princeton and M.I.T. and the Brookings Institution and The Atlantic and The New York Times and a host of other elite institutions is evidence that perhaps they doth protest too much? If being a billionaire best-selling author like J.K. Rowling or the dean of Columbia Journalism School like Nick Lemann is somehow indicative of being particularly at risk for “public shaming and ostracism,” I would like to humbly volunteer to trade places with them.


I don't personally have a Twitter, so I'm unsure how this affects which comments get displayed once you click on the post about the letter that Harper's put up on Twitter. But, the response seems to be largely negative in response. Here are the first/top comments that come up when I clicked to see the comments:



Source: https://twitter.com/Harpers/status/1280495875165425670

This post was edited by Handcuffs on Jul 7 2020 07:44pm
Member
Posts: 35,291
Joined: Aug 17 2004
Gold: 12,730.67
Jul 7 2020 08:37pm
Cancel culture is disgusting. The fact that our brands are being polarized is an incredibly disturbing trend. Anyone who participates in cancel culture should have it turned on them tenfold. If you participate in an event that results in the unjustified job loss of an individual, you should not only lose your job, but you should lose your hands as well (not permanently of course).
Member
Posts: 64,763
Joined: Oct 25 2006
Gold: 0.00
Jul 7 2020 08:46pm
Quote (thundercock @ Jul 7 2020 09:37pm)
Cancel culture is disgusting. The fact that our brands are being polarized is an incredibly disturbing trend. Anyone who participates in cancel culture should have it turned on them tenfold. If you participate in an event that results in the unjustified job loss of an individual, you should not only lose your job, but you should lose your hands as well (not permanently of course).


Funny thing is I didn't really hear about anybody on the right complaining when people were fired for being gay, or trans, or atheist, or whatever. It only seems to have become a problem when their shitty behavior started having consequences.

Yeah, always gonna be a few people caught in the crossfire, but on the whole I don't see cancel culture as a large departure from the norm in America.
Member
Posts: 35,291
Joined: Aug 17 2004
Gold: 12,730.67
Jul 7 2020 09:25pm
Quote (Thor123422 @ Jul 7 2020 07:46pm)
Funny thing is I didn't really hear about anybody on the right complaining when people were fired for being gay, or trans, or atheist, or whatever. It only seems to have become a problem when their shitty behavior started having consequences.

Yeah, always gonna be a few people caught in the crossfire, but on the whole I don't see cancel culture as a large departure from the norm in America.


I think it's a bit different because it's organic and local. I'm not justifying that sort of behavior but I find it absolutely disgusting when people in Seattle team up with people in Detroit, Boston, etc. to target an individual in Oklahoma City.
Member
Posts: 22,442
Joined: Mar 3 2007
Gold: 76.11
Jul 7 2020 09:35pm
Quote (thundercock @ Jul 7 2020 07:37pm)
Cancel culture is disgusting. The fact that our brands are being polarized is an incredibly disturbing trend. Anyone who participates in cancel culture should have it turned on them tenfold. If you participate in an event that results in the unjustified job loss of an individual, you should not only lose your job, but you should lose your hands as well (not permanently of course).


Who do you feel has unjustly lost their job as a result of Cancel Culture?
Member
Posts: 35,291
Joined: Aug 17 2004
Gold: 12,730.67
Jul 7 2020 09:39pm
Quote (Handcuffs @ Jul 7 2020 08:35pm)
Who do you feel has unjustly lost their job as a result of Cancel Culture?


Anyone who lost their job.
Member
Posts: 105,148
Joined: Apr 25 2006
Gold: 10,475.00
Jul 7 2020 09:46pm
Quote (Handcuffs @ Jul 7 2020 11:35pm)
Who do you feel has unjustly lost their job as a result of Cancel Culture?




Aunt Jemima?
Member
Posts: 61,688
Joined: Mar 14 2006
Gold: 28.77
Jul 7 2020 09:48pm
Right wingers started cancel culture. This is what revenge looks like. If you don't like people taking revenge, don't do things that you wouldn't want done to you. The Golden Rule. We used to learn that. Republicans abandoned it. They'll scream in your face that you're a fag and Jesus wants to burn you in Hell, but they will never follow the words of Jesus.

This post was edited by inkanddagger on Jul 7 2020 09:48pm
Member
Posts: 64,763
Joined: Oct 25 2006
Gold: 0.00
Jul 7 2020 09:50pm
Quote (inkanddagger @ Jul 7 2020 10:48pm)
Right wingers started cancel culture. This is what revenge looks like. If you don't like people taking revenge, don't do things that you wouldn't want done to you. The Golden Rule. We used to learn that. Republicans abandoned it. They'll scream in your face that you're a fag and Jesus wants to burn you in Hell, but they will never follow the words of Jesus.


Basically lol

They spent a literal centuries canceling people for mixing race, being gay, being atheist, etc. because they lived in small communities and had the advantage on banding together. Now that the community has expanded and they have less power they turn into whiny bitches. That's basically how conservatism works though. It's fair until they're losing, then they change the rules.
Member
Posts: 22,442
Joined: Mar 3 2007
Gold: 76.11
Jul 7 2020 09:51pm
Quote (thundercock @ Jul 7 2020 08:39pm)
Anyone who lost their job.


I think that may be a different conversation entirely though. Do you think that an employer, universally, shouldn't be allowed to fire an employee for things that they say?

Quote (inkanddagger @ Jul 7 2020 08:48pm)
Right wingers started cancel culture. This is what revenge looks like. If you don't like people taking revenge, don't do things that you wouldn't want done to you. The Golden Rule. We used to learn that. Republicans abandoned it. They'll scream in your face that you're a fag and Jesus wants to burn you in Hell, but they will never follow the words of Jesus.


Cancel Culture is merely the left's version of the right's "Political Correctness".
Go Back To Political & Religious Debate Topic List
12321Next
Add Reply New Topic New Poll