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Jan 16 2023 01:58pm
Quote (IceMage @ Jan 11 2023 05:32am)
I never thought you were an idiot but this post proves otherwise. I'm not mad, just disappointed.

Trump had classified documents that he clearly withheld from the government trying to retrieve them. Biden had classified documents that he gave to the government after they were discovered.

Just look at the potential charges Trump is facing. They all focus on the fact that he withheld and obstructed, not that he had the documents. If he had simply given them back to their rightful owner, he wouldn't be in this mess.


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Jan 16 2023 02:10pm
isnt owning a corvette whyte supremacy?
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Jan 16 2023 02:51pm
Quote (TiStuff @ Jan 16 2023 03:10pm)
isnt owning a corvette whyte supremacy?


Def contributing to climate change he’s producing so much toxins more than a volcano! I bet he farted on the seat to!
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Jan 16 2023 03:56pm
Quote (IceMage @ 11 Jan 2023 05:32)
I never thought you were an idiot but this post proves otherwise. I'm not mad, just disappointed.

Trump had classified documents that he clearly withheld from the government trying to retrieve them. Biden had classified documents that he gave to the government after they were discovered.

Just look at the potential charges Trump is facing. They all focus on the fact that he withheld and obstructed, not that he had the documents. If he had simply given them back to their rightful owner, he wouldn't be in this mess.


Biden had classified documents that he stored in a larger variety of places than Trump, places which were significantly less secured. He did this for a significantly longer period of time than Trump (6+ years) and has far less of an argument in his defense regarding authority to declassify. Trump resisted handing out some of these documents and most definitely didn't adhere to the proper declassification process.

From a purely technical, legal point of view, Trump's mishandling of classified documents might be worse because it touches on obstruction of justice. However, from a moral point of view, the two cases aren't much different, the differences roughly cancel each other out. After the Mar-a-Lago raid, Biden gleefully commented on how irresponsible it is to possess or mishandle classified documents - and now, he has irrefutably been outed as a hypocrite.
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Jan 16 2023 07:42pm
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Jan 16 2023 04:56pm)
Biden had classified documents that he stored in a larger variety of places than Trump, places which were significantly less secured. He did this for a significantly longer period of time than Trump (6+ years) and has far less of an argument in his defense regarding authority to declassify. Trump resisted handing out some of these documents and most definitely didn't adhere to the proper declassification process.

From a purely technical, legal point of view, Trump's mishandling of classified documents might be worse because it touches on obstruction of justice. However, from a moral point of view, the two cases aren't much different, the differences roughly cancel each other out. After the Mar-a-Lago raid, Biden gleefully commented on how irresponsible it is to possess or mishandle classified documents - and now, he has irrefutably been outed as a hypocrite.


We're working with the facts we know. Assuming those facts, it's true Biden had classified documents in more places than Trump did(the FBI hasn't searched other Trump properties and there's no reason to believe Trump's lawyers would search and reveal any classified documents, so I'm skeptical of that talking point), and they were arguably less secure(although that argument doesn't go very far), but the legal argument for indicting Trump pretty much landed on facts outside of him holding classified documents without authorization. You can argue he was president, and presidents can declassify anything. The problem is that there's zero evidence he ever declassified any of the documents that he held. We could venture into the space of "I declassified in my mind" but that argument doesn't seem to hold merit in minds outside the Trump cult.

The potential indictment hinges on the obstruction aspect. Which, so far, appears to be different from how Biden handled this.

The short story, based on the evidence so far, is that Biden took some classified documents with him, and gave them back when revealed. Trump stole classified documents, and refused to return them when asked by the government.

What Biden did is bad. What Trump did is criminal.

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Jan 16 2023 08:07pm
Quote (IceMage @ 17 Jan 2023 02:42)
The short story, based on the evidence so far, is that Biden took some classified documents with him, and gave them back when revealed. Trump stole classified documents, and refused to return them when asked by the government.

Why do you think that Biden "took" classified documents, but say that Trump "stole" his?

Quote
What Biden did is bad. What Trump did is criminal.

Wrong. What both men did was criminal. Possession of classified documents as a private citizen is a crime in and off itself, no matter how it happened or what the intent behind it was. Rank-and-file federal employees would get their whole life ruined by the FBI/DoJ if caught doing what Trump and Biden did.

Quote
We're working with the facts we know.
[...]
(the FBI hasn't searched other Trump properties and there's no reason to believe Trump's lawyers would search and reveal any classified documents, so I'm skeptical of that talking point)

Lmao, you start your post pointing out that we shouldn't speculate and stick to known facts, only to then devolve into speculation about Trump's nefarious, surely-worse-than-what-we-know behiavor one sentence later.

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Jan 16 2023 08:12pm
Quote (Redeemed777 @ Jan 16 2023 12:51pm)
Def contributing to climate change he’s producing so much toxins more than a volcano! I bet he farted on the seat to!


that ok he was wearing his diaper
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Jan 16 2023 08:22pm
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Jan 16 2023 09:07pm)
Why do you think that Biden "took" classified documents, but say that Trump "stole" his?


Wrong. What both men did was criminal. Possession of classified documents as a private citizen is a crime in and off itself, no matter how it happened or what the intent behind it was. Rank-and-file federal employees would get their whole life ruined by the FBI/DoJ if caught doing what Trump and Biden did.


Lmao, you start your post pointing out that we shouldn't speculate and stick to known facts, only to then devolve into speculation about Trump's nefarious, surely-worse-than-what-we-know behiavor one sentence later.


It's a concept called "consciousness of guilt". If one person immediately gives back classified documents, and the other person refuses to give them back while lying about giving them back, it's a clear distinction.

What Biden did was potentially criminal. It would venture into clearly criminal if he was notified by the government and refused to return the documents. Like Trump did. This isn't complicated.

Trump's case obviously has more facts than we have with the Biden case. It's not biased to point that out.
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Jan 16 2023 08:26pm
Quote (IceMage @ Jan 16 2023 06:22pm)
It's a concept called "consciousness of guilt". If one person immediately gives back classified documents, and the other person refuses to give them back while lying about giving them back, it's a clear distinction.

What Biden did was potentially criminal. It would venture into clearly criminal if he was notified by the government and refused to return the documents. Like Trump did. This isn't complicated.

Trump's case obviously has more facts than we have with the Biden case. It's not biased to point that out.


a biden dinadu
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Jan 17 2023 02:58am
Dems clearly decided to cut Biden loose, guess they realized they can't prop him up (literally) for another four years.
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