d2jsp
Log InRegister
d2jsp Forums > Off-Topic > General Chat > Political & Religious Debate >
Poll > Trump 2020 > Trump Vs. Pack O' Dems
Prev1943944945946947983Next
Add Reply New Topic New Poll
  Guests cannot view or vote in polls. Please register or login.
Member
Posts: 64,763
Joined: Oct 25 2006
Gold: 0.00
Jun 26 2021 11:16pm
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Jun 27 2021 12:09am)
At least back in 2016, Trump voters had the higher education level. This might be in the process of flipping though, iirc, Biden very narrowly carried college-educated voters in 2020.

Note the Democrats can have a large number of high info voters and, at the same time, also a large number of low info folks.


Democrats appeal to minority voters who have been historically kept from higher education. To have a real comparison you have to look at the intra-demographic rates, not whole-voter rates. So break it down by demographic, then look at education within those demographics and see the slant.

This is called Simpson's Paradox, where you can have X perform better than Y in every sub-group, but when you group the data together it appears that Y is better than X. It's something you have to account for in things like clinical trials and comparing education systems. Texas gets a bad reputation for its test scores because it has a lot of latinos who historically score low, but if you break it down by ethnic groups Texas performs pretty good in every category compared to other states.




https://www.cnn.com/election/2020/exit-polls/president/national-results/6

Here's an exit poll that lets you sort by demographic. Gonna format data College Grad / Non College Grad

Black: D: 84% / 88% R: 15%/11% Republicans get a small lead in college graduate blacks, but since they get such a small portion of the vote it looks more significant than it is.
White: D: 51/32 R: 48/67 Whites are massively more likely to vote Republican if they have no college degree
Latino: D: 62/66 R: 36/31 Republicans have a small lead in college graduates in the Latino community

From this data it's clear that among monorities, it's almost evenly split, but among whites, Republicans dominate the no-college-degree set of the population.





We had this conversation a week or two ago but I was too busy at the time to find something like this and forgot. But here it is now.

This post was edited by NetflixAdaptationWidow on Jun 26 2021 11:30pm
Member
Posts: 46,889
Joined: Sep 5 2016
Gold: 100.00
Jun 26 2021 11:47pm
Quote (NetflixAdaptationWidow @ Jun 26 2021 10:16pm)
Democrats appeal to minority voters who have been historically kept from higher education. To have a real comparison you have to look at the intra-demographic rates, not whole-voter rates. So break it down by demographic, then look at education within those demographics and see the slant.

This is called Simpson's Paradox, where you can have X perform better than Y in every sub-group, but when you group the data together it appears that Y is better than X. It's something you have to account for in things like clinical trials and comparing education systems. Texas gets a bad reputation for its test scores because it has a lot of latinos who historically score low, but if you break it down by ethnic groups Texas performs pretty good in every category compared to other states.




https://www.cnn.com/election/2020/exit-polls/president/national-results/6

Here's an exit poll that lets you sort by demographic. Gonna format data College Grad / Non College Grad

Black: D: 84% / 88% R: 15%/11% Republicans get a small lead in college graduate blacks, but since they get such a small portion of the vote it looks more significant than it is.
White: D: 51/32 R: 48/67 Whites are massively more likely to vote Republican if they have no college degree
Latino: D: 62/66 R: 36/31 Republicans have a small lead in college graduates in the Latino community

From this data it's clear that among monorities, it's almost evenly split, but among whites, Republicans dominate the no-college-degree set of the population.





We had this conversation a week or two ago but I was too busy at the time to find something like this and forgot. But here it is now.


cool a poll, nothing can ever go wrong with one of those, most trusted data ever.
Member
Posts: 49,890
Joined: Jun 19 2006
Gold: 3.88
Jun 26 2021 11:55pm
Quote (TiStuff @ Jun 27 2021 03:47pm)
cool a poll, nothing can ever go wrong with one of those, most trusted data ever.


Mate you trust bichute links.
Member
Posts: 46,889
Joined: Sep 5 2016
Gold: 100.00
Jun 27 2021 12:01am
Quote (Plaguefear @ Jun 26 2021 10:55pm)
Mate you trust bichute links.

ya right bitchute is false cause you say so...................
have another one
⁣Try Locking these people down again!
https://www.bitchute.com/video/n1PTtf6auNtD/
Member
Posts: 54,065
Joined: May 26 2005
Gold: 4,945.67
Jun 27 2021 12:06am
Quote (NetflixAdaptationWidow @ 27 Jun 2021 07:16)
Democrats appeal to minority voters who have been historically kept from higher education. To have a real comparison you have to look at the intra-demographic rates, not whole-voter rates. So break it down by demographic, then look at education within those demographics and see the slant.

This is called Simpson's Paradox, where you can have X perform better than Y in every sub-group, but when you group the data together it appears that Y is better than X. It's something you have to account for in things like clinical trials and comparing education systems. Texas gets a bad reputation for its test scores because it has a lot of latinos who historically score low, but if you break it down by ethnic groups Texas performs pretty good in every category compared to other states.




https://www.cnn.com/election/2020/exit-polls/president/national-results/6

Here's an exit poll that lets you sort by demographic. Gonna format data College Grad / Non College Grad

Black: D: 84% / 88% R: 15%/11% Republicans get a small lead in college graduate blacks, but since they get such a small portion of the vote it looks more significant than it is.
White: D: 51/32 R: 48/67 Whites are massively more likely to vote Republican if they have no college degree
Latino: D: 62/66 R: 36/31 Republicans have a small lead in college graduates in the Latino community

From this data it's clear that among monorities, it's almost evenly split, but among whites, Republicans dominate the no-college-degree set of the population.

We had this conversation a week or two ago but I was too busy at the time to find something like this and forgot. But here it is now.


I get this argument, but whether it's a valid counterargument to mine depends on if political interest and being informed correlates more with intelligence or with actual education level. If it's the former, then your argument applies that we have to take into account the structural factors which cause minorities to have lower educational attainment. If the determining factor is the actual education level (and indirectly the type of jobs that come with it), then your point is moot though.


Generally speaking, I would characterize the Democratic coalition as one between functional elites and the professional-managerial class on the one side and downscale minorities on the other, while working- and lower-middle- class whites form the bedrock of the Republican coalition.

Member
Posts: 64,763
Joined: Oct 25 2006
Gold: 0.00
Jun 27 2021 12:13am
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Jun 27 2021 01:06am)
I get this argument, but whether it's a valid counterargument to mine depends on if political interest and being informed correlates more with intelligence or with actual education level. If it's the former, then your argument applies that we have to take into account the structural factors which cause minorities to have lower educational attainment. If the determining factor is the actual education level (and indirectly the type of jobs that come with it), then your point is moot though.
Generally speaking, I would characterize the Democratic coalition as one between functional elites and the professional-managerial class on the one side and downscale minorities on the other, while working- and lower-middle- class whites form the bedrock of the Republican coalition.


Democrats get higher educated whites, but not higher income whites. Democrats get a strong lead in blacks because Republicans still openly court racist agitators in the south. For them it's not about education or intelligence or anything more than basic political knowledge, it's about one party being openly hostile to them and the other at least giving lip service to their problems.

Republicans get a larger share of whites, but they are not strongly divided on lines of income, so your characterization is wrong. You don't get to simultaneously argue that Kentucky would be more favorable to liberal policies since it used to be a Democratic union state and then in this thread argue that Democrats don't still have a massive base of union voters.

Among whites the breakdown is the following

Less than 50k : more than 50k
D: 44/39
R: 55/60

Less than 100k : more than 100k
D: 41:40
R: 59:59

So no, they are split almost evenly along income.

This post was edited by NetflixAdaptationWidow on Jun 27 2021 12:19am
Member
Posts: 54,065
Joined: May 26 2005
Gold: 4,945.67
Jun 27 2021 12:31am
Quote (NetflixAdaptationWidow @ 27 Jun 2021 08:13)
Republicans get a larger share of whites, but they are not strongly divided on lines of income, so your characterization is wrong.

https://i.imgur.com/QTd7oeF.png


Here, age is the big confounder. Age is positively correlated with income and with voting Republican. Yuppies and college-graduates lean Democrat, with one group having particularly high and the other particularly low income. Trump voters skew working-class, but also older, two factors which offset and lead to a very even partisan breakdown across income brackets.

But yes, the conventional wisdom probably understates how strong the support for Republicans still is among high-income whites ($100k+).

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Jun 27 2021 12:31am
Member
Posts: 64,763
Joined: Oct 25 2006
Gold: 0.00
Jun 27 2021 12:48am
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Jun 27 2021 01:31am)
Here, age is the big confounder. Age is positively correlated with income and with voting Republican. Yuppies and college-graduates lean Democrat, with one group having particularly high and the other particularly low income. Trump voters skew working-class, but also older, two factors which offset and lead to a very even partisan breakdown across income brackets.

But yes, the conventional wisdom probably understates how strong the support for Republicans still is among high-income whites ($100k+).


Age does not predict voting in whites, blacks, or latinos

18-29 / 30-44 / 45-64 / 65+

White
D: 44/41/40/41
R: 53/57/59/58

Black
D: 89/78/90/92 (odd slump in the 30-44 category though)
R: 10/19/10/7

Latino
D: 69/62/62/68
R: 28/34/36/30
Member
Posts: 54,065
Joined: May 26 2005
Gold: 4,945.67
Jun 27 2021 01:25am
Quote (NetflixAdaptationWidow @ 27 Jun 2021 08:48)
Age does not predict voting in whites, blacks, or latinos

18-29 / 30-44 / 45-64 / 65+

White
D: 44/41/40/41
R: 53/57/59/58

Black
D: 89/78/90/92 (odd slump in the 30-44 category though)
R: 10/19/10/7

Latino
D: 69/62/62/68
R: 28/34/36/30


Where do you have your data from? On the CNN page that I linked, the age breakdown by race shows a 45-59 bracket, not 45-64, and it shows whites to be 38% vs 61% in this bracket, not 40/59.
The numbers for latinos are also different from yours.

Member
Posts: 64,763
Joined: Oct 25 2006
Gold: 0.00
Jun 27 2021 01:33am
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Jun 27 2021 02:25am)
Where do you have your data from? On the CNN page that I linked, the age breakdown by race shows a 45-59 bracket, not 45-64, and it shows whites to be 38% vs 61% in this bracket, not 40/59.
The numbers for latinos are also different from yours.


Oh, I was just filtering by race and using the age at the top. There's a separate way to group them that you are referencing further down the page.

This post was edited by NetflixAdaptationWidow on Jun 27 2021 01:36am
Go Back To Political & Religious Debate Topic List
Prev1943944945946947983Next
Add Reply New Topic New Poll