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#91
Nov 25 2018 08:21am
You dont need corruption. Socialism fails based on its own lack of merit alone.
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#92
Nov 25 2018 08:56am
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Nov 25 2018 04:02pm)
E-XAC-T-LY!!!!

and this one of the main reasons why democratic, free, capitalistic societies are inherently superior to socialist systems: in a democratic, free, market-based system, power is more evenly distributed, and corrupt politicians can more easily be removed from office. in such a system, it takes corruption to be a lot more widespread to bring down the system itself.

by contrast, in socialist systems, there is little to no democratic control of the leaders, there is no competition between individuals, products and ideas to keep things in check, and a disproportionate amount of power and control lies with the leadership of the ruling, socialist party. socialism only works in undemocratic, unfree systems - and in such a system, it only takes a handful of people (the leadership of the communist/socialist unity party) to be corrupted to drag the entire country down.


You don't get the point, or maybe you're just trying to turn it into a strawman.

Socialism inherently does not lead to a lack of democracy, and many democracies around the world are successfully maintaining/implementing certain socialist ideas. Lack of democracy stems entirely from corruption, which is possible in any type of political system.

Quote (EndlessSky @ Nov 25 2018 04:21pm)
You dont need corruption. Socialism fails based on its own lack of merit alone.


And similarly, capitalism fails based on how it encourages exploitation. The only thing that works is a decent balance of the two.

This post was edited by Leevee on Nov 25 2018 09:00am
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#93
Nov 25 2018 09:02am


Quote (Leevee @ Nov 25 2018 10:56am)
You don't get the point, or maybe you're just trying to turn it into a strawman.

Socialism inherently does not lead to a lack of democracy, and many democracies around the world are successfully maintaining/implementing certain socialist ideas. Lack of democracy stems entirely from corruption, which is possible in any type of political system.



And similarly, capitalism fails based on how it encourages exploitation. The only thing that works is a decent balance of the two.

Youre a joke. You havent cited any real life examples.
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#94
Nov 25 2018 09:07am
lets go for anti-intellectualism meme



This post was edited by Saucisson6000 on Nov 25 2018 09:08am
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#95
Nov 25 2018 09:09am
Quote (EndlessSky @ Nov 25 2018 05:02pm)
https://i.redd.it/nvkxwafcwg021.jpg


Youre a joke. You havent cited any real life examples.


The inexistence of a middle class in certain countries is a good example. The exploitation of an entire continent is a good example. The continued support for Saudi Arabia is a good example.

You're a joke if you seriously think that capitalism has never led to corruption.
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#96
Nov 25 2018 09:43am
Quote (Leevee @ 25 Nov 2018 15:56)
You don't get the point, or maybe you're just trying to turn it into a strawman.

Socialism inherently does not lead to a lack of democracy, and many democracies around the world are successfully maintaining/implementing certain socialist ideas. Lack of democracy stems entirely from corruption, which is possible in any type of political system.



And similarly, capitalism fails based on how it encourages exploitation. The only thing that works is a decent balance of the two.


can you name me a single socialist country that is a democracy?
and for the record, I am talking about true socialism, not europe style "social democracy", which is just "capitalism with a well-developed welfare state"!
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#97
Nov 25 2018 10:17am
Quote (Leevee @ Nov 25 2018 11:09am)
The inexistence of a middle class in certain countries is a good example. The exploitation of an entire continent is a good example. The continued support for Saudi Arabia is a good example.

You're a joke if you seriously think that capitalism has never led to corruption.


Corruption leads to that not capitalism.

Keep doubling down on failure with no examples.

You make it sounds like the government never hurts corporations :wacko:
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#98
Nov 26 2018 12:08pm
Quote (EndlessSky @ Nov 25 2018 06:17pm)
Corruption leads to that not capitalism.

Keep doubling down on failure with no examples.

You make it sounds like the government never hurts corporations :wacko:


Not sure why you say I'm doubling down, when you just agreed with what I said.

Quote (Saucisson6000 @ Nov 25 2018 05:07pm)
lets go for anti-intellectualism meme

https://cdn-images-1.medium.com/max/1920/1*hgO4uOd-rCxaQdRpySsKEw.jpeg


Damn, good job! If I had the ability to draw, I would have made the following:

- Panel 1: A few people gather in front of a wall; all of them have some sticks.
- Panel 2: A "leader" shows a blueprint for a ladder; the rest build that ladder with the sticks they brought.
- Panel 3: The "leader" ascends the ladder first.
- Panel 4: The "leader" pulls the ladder up, and lets the rest that it is his ladder anyway.

Any ideology can look ridiculous if you just misunderstand it badly enough.

This post was edited by Leevee on Nov 26 2018 12:10pm
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#99
Nov 26 2018 12:09pm
so... we're still waiting on examples for the aforementioned "mass starvation in capitalist societies" and "a socialist country which is a democracy". :bouncy:

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Nov 26 2018 12:10pm
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#100
Nov 26 2018 12:16pm
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Nov 26 2018 12:09pm)
so... we're still waiting on examples for the aforementioned "mass starvation in capitalist societies" and "a socialist country which is a democracy". :bouncy:


while i disagree with Ink on his premise i wouldn't touch the topic with a 10 foot pole either. you'd waste about 10 pages going back and forth over definitions only to be left with the same disagreement.

the entire nordic model is based, afaik, on this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy

but then you'd need to establish whether Ink meant in his original statement that type of socialism, and/or that type of democracy.

we see it time and again, democrats call the nordic countries successful socialism, only to be told by capitalists it isn't true socialism because they have a free market aspect of their economy. its ever shifting goalposts.

at a simple glance capitalist countries fail to meet the demands of disasters, especially in antiquity. look at the dust bowl, for example.
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