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#91
Dec 2 2017 09:36am
Quote (dro94 @ Dec 2 2017 10:23am)
Because I don't believe that the government should be able to take half of anyone's income regardless of how rich they are.

Pre-emptively responding to what I think you might touch on next - I'm not arbitrarily coming up with a tax rate, my belief is that it should be primarily based on factors like potential tax revenue vs inefficiencies caused by disrupting incentives to work, reinvestment of profits and so on. I would take information on the aforementioned factors and try to create a tax policy that is efficient but also fair, which then goes into the subjectivity that we'll disagree on. A 65% tax rate isn't efficient (objectively true in most cases) and I don't believe it's fair (my subjective opinion).


On your general bracket idea theres the issue of negative incentives for hiring additional people in order to not be considered a 'big' business, and punishing successful businesses with higher rates.

Really i was only attempting to illuminate the case against absurdly high taxes, which are creeping into the overton window these days. (like the above commenter)

to the extent that taxation exists i too think it should be low, fair and efficient.
(whats actually "fair" is not exactly agreed upon these days. hyper-progressive and perpetually/punitively higher taxes are considered the 'fair share' in some circles.)

This post was edited by cambovenzi on Dec 2 2017 09:36am
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#92
Dec 2 2017 09:45am
Quote (cambovenzi @ Dec 2 2017 04:36pm)
On your general bracket idea theres the issue of negative incentives for hiring additional people in order to not be considered a 'big' business, and punishing successful businesses with higher rates.

Really i was only attempting to illuminate the case against absurdly high taxes, which are creeping into the overton window these days. (like the above commenter)

to the extent that taxation exists i too think it should be low, fair and efficient.
(whats actually "fair" is not exactly agreed upon these days. hyper-progressive and perpetually/punitively higher taxes are considered the 'fair share' in some circles.)


Yeah there are inefficiencies caused in any system where there are brackets, it's unclear the extent of how inefficient that is though. I can't see it being that bad when most countries are operating a marginal tax rate where you'd only get taxed at the higher rate for amounts above the former rate.

Tax rates approaching 50% and above are considered fair in some circles but I'd challenge your perception that the majority of people on the left also believe it. The whole SJW feminist communist smear used against anyone with left leaning views is not only inaccurate but more importantly is not conducive to a good debate.

This post was edited by dro94 on Dec 2 2017 09:46am
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#93
Dec 2 2017 09:47am
Quote (dro94 @ 2 Dec 2017 16:10)
Rich individuals in top 1% of income bracket past a threshold (eg $200k) - 35%
Big businesses - 17.5%
SME's - 0-12% depending on revenue & PBIT


It's pretty hard to differenciate alot of small businesses acting like a big family, this could benefit to some specific kind of communities.
Imo;

- Nice VAT on luxury and very superior products/possessions for the "rich"
- Corporate + very big business getting a good flat like that 18%, or better: just a strong enough governement to stop their tax evasion.

All lower and smaller businesses get like 12%, and then a specific situation for individuals like stand alone consultants, doctors, home services... Usually it's about including them in the social security process.
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#94
Dec 2 2017 09:52am
Quote (Saucisson6000 @ Dec 2 2017 10:47am)
It's pretty hard to differenciate alot of small businesses acting like a big family, this could benefit to some specific kind of communities.
Imo;

- Nice VAT on luxury and very superior products/possessions for the "rich"
- Corporate + very big business getting a good flat like that 18%, or better: just a strong enough governement to stop their tax evasion.

All lower and smaller businesses get like 12%, and then a specific situation for individuals like stand alone consultants, doctors, home services... Usually it's about including them in the social security process.


https://www.mises.ca/the-poverty-of-luxury-taxes/


a low flat rate seems reasonable tho
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#95
Dec 2 2017 09:59am
Quote (cambovenzi @ 2 Dec 2017 16:52)
https://www.mises.ca/the-poverty-of-luxury-taxes/
a low flat rate seems reasonable tho


nonono,

buying food = like 0-5% tax
buying a ferrari, giant 4x4 = 30% tax

that is reasonable eventually.
Theres also should be "correction" taxes on polluting products or unhealthy food too (last one considering a country civilized enough to have central healthcare system)
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#96
Dec 2 2017 10:00am
Quote (Saucisson6000 @ Dec 2 2017 10:59am)
nonono,

buying food = like 0-5% tax
buying a ferrari, giant 4x4 = 30% tax

that is reasonable eventually.
Theres also should be "correction" taxes on polluting products or unhealthy food too (last one considering a country civilized enough to have central healthcare system)


What that does is incentivizes the rich to buy luxury goods elsewhere and butchers the local industries harming the poorer workers

This post was edited by cambovenzi on Dec 2 2017 10:03am
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#97
Dec 2 2017 10:11am
Quote (cambovenzi @ 2 Dec 2017 17:00)
What that does is incentivize the rich to buy luxury goods elsewhere and butchers the local industries harming the poorer workers


Theres 2 things;
- VAT is nice to be sure they will be forced to pay, i means its a guarantee against frauds.
- Pollution/waste too, it can be a private jet but also all the plastic shits imported from china.


"harming the poorer workers" isnt honest statement... Because the next step of this kind of speech is;
"oh look, those giant companies/businesses are creating so much jobs..., we owe them"
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#98
Dec 2 2017 10:29am
Quote (Saucisson6000 @ Dec 2 2017 11:11am)


"harming the poorer workers" isnt honest statement... Because the next step of this kind of speech is;
"oh look, those giant companies/businesses are creating so much jobs..., we owe them"


that makes no sense.
its an honest statement with observable results
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#99
Dec 2 2017 10:42am
Quote (cambovenzi @ Dec 2 2017 10:52am)
https://www.mises.ca/the-poverty-of-luxury-taxes/


a low flat rate seems reasonable tho


didn't know you were a flat taxer cam

no exemptions, 10% across the board type stuff?
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#100
Dec 2 2017 10:44am
Quote (cambovenzi @ 2 Dec 2017 17:29)
that makes no sense.
its an honest statement with observable results


You must understand im starting my views considering a good governement is in place, with responsabilities...
The observable results here are a gigantic waste of goods for a very poor result.
How is it acceptable that today, considering the pollution and environment destruction we are facing, that people can buy without a single extra tax private jets, yatch, or big 4x4 for a single driver...
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