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Jul 6 2020 11:08pm
Quote (Handcuffs @ Jul 6 2020 11:59pm)
A continuation of my limitless capacity for being petty. Here's a quote from the Department of Homeland Security which affirms that immigration enforcement is DIVIDED AMONG SEVERAL DIFFERENT AGENCIES AND NOT ENTIRELY DEPENDENT ON THE EXISTENCE OF A SINGLE ONE SUCH AS ICE:

Source: https://www.dhs.gov/immigration-statistics/enforcement-actions


I predict this post will be totally ignored
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Jul 6 2020 11:11pm
so abolish ICE but keep enforcing the same immigration policy with other agencies

sounds like progress to me :shrug:
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Jul 6 2020 11:21pm
Quote (Thor123422 @ 7 Jul 2020 07:07)
>Those people advocating to abolish ICE are X
>Is engaged in a conversation with somebody advocating to abolish ice but is not X
>Continues to repeat that they are interested in X


I am obviously talking about the elected officials and activists who are rallying behind the "abolish ICE" slogan, not about random dudes on a webforum.

If the country really decided to abolish ICE, the follow-up immigration policies would be shaped by these elected officials, and swayed by the input from these activists. And like I said: these groups are not interested in going back to the pre-2003 policies, they want the country's immigration system to become more 'open' and soft.
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Jul 6 2020 11:22pm
Quote (proccy @ Jul 7 2020 12:11am)
so abolish ICE but keep enforcing the same immigration policy with other agencies

sounds like progress to me :shrug:


Or.... we could abolish ICE and take a different approach using the remaining enforcement agencies.

Gonna give you a minute to clean up since your head probably exploded and reformed.
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Jul 6 2020 11:32pm
Quote (Thor123422 @ Jul 6 2020 10:22pm)
Or.... we could abolish ICE and take a different approach using the remaining enforcement agencies.

Gonna give you a minute to clean up since your head probably exploded and reformed.


"different approach" sounds like reform to me

if they are enforcing the laws that are on the books, perhaps the laws need to change

85 posts later we finally got to that point after all
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Jul 6 2020 11:44pm
Quote (proccy @ Jul 7 2020 12:32am)
"different approach" sounds like reform to me
if they are enforcing the laws that are on the books, perhaps the laws need to change
85 posts later we finally got to that point after all


Would have been easier to get to the point without your and other people's insistence that abolishing ICE would mean abolishment of immigration policy as a whole.
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Jul 6 2020 11:47pm
Quote (Thor123422 @ Jul 6 2020 10:44pm)
Would have been easier to get to the point without your and other people's insistence that abolishing ICE would mean abolishment of immigration policy as a whole.


so keep enforcing your immigration laws, i don't care what you call the agency :P Thread moot at this point
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Jul 7 2020 12:10am
On-going for several years now has been concern with whether or not the US has "lost 1,500+" unaccompanied minors who were placed with sponsors across the country. It seems that between the two extremes of "They've lost of all of them!" and "We've lost none of them!", is the truth:

Quote (New York Times (2018))
The Trump administration is unable to account for the whereabouts of nearly 1,500 migrant children who illegally entered the United States alone this year and were placed with sponsors after leaving federal shelters, according to congressional findings released on Tuesday.

The revelation echoes an admission in April by the Department of Health and Human Services that the government had similarly lost track of an additional 1,475 migrant children it had moved out of shelters last year.

In findings that lawmakers described as troubling, Senate investigators said the department could not determine with certainty the whereabouts of 1,488 out of 11,254 children the agency had placed with sponsors in 2018, based on follow-up calls from April 1 to June 30.


People concerned about this believe it irresponsible for the US government to place children with sponsors and not have a system in place that keeps track of them, increasing the likelihood that they become abused or subjected to human trafficking. One prominent example that let this concern really catch wind was:

Quote (Snopes)
In July 2015, the U.S. Department of Justice indicted a ring of traffickers led by Aroldo Castillo-Serrano and accused them of smuggling children into the United States. They were also accused of lying to Health and Human Services’ Office of Refugee Resettlement (ORR) by posing as relatives in order to gain custody of children in its care and use them for forced labor in Marion, a city north of Columbus. The federal indictment, filed in U.S. district court in Ohio accuses Castillo-Serrano and his conspirators of forcing the children to live in squalid trailers and work six or seven 12-hour days a week, using threats and physical violence as coercion.

According to the Justice Department, Castillo-Serrano pleaded guilty in August 2015 to counts related to trafficking. He was sentenced to more than 15 years in prison and ordered to pay restitution to the victims.


However, the DHHS contends that they're not responsible for the whereabouts of unaccompanied minors placed with sponsors after they've been placed, aside from a voluntary phone call. If the sponsors don't answer, or if the number is disconnected, then there's very little effort beyond this phone call made to confirm the whereabouts and well-being of the children. A fairly high percentage of these children are with sponsors who do answer the calls (84%), and so a minority of sponsors actually do not get in contact with the DHHS. The main explanation provided by the DHHS for why sponsors don't answer calls from a federal agency is because many of them are undocumented immigrants themselves, and avoid interactions with the federal government as a result.

Sources:

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/18/us/politics/us-migrant-children-whereabouts-.html

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/28/us/trump-immigrant-children-lost.html?action=click&module=RelatedCoverage&pgtype=Article&region=Footer

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/did-obama-administration-children-human-traffickers/

This post was edited by Handcuffs on Jul 7 2020 12:11am
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Jul 7 2020 12:46am
Ya know what I haven't heard about lately?
I haven't heard about 90-100K refugees storming our borders, per month. I haven't heard about all kinds of problems from muslim legal or illegal immigrants. Trump and ICE must be doing something right.

Ya know what I have heard about?
I've heard that the left/Dems are doing everything in their power legal and illegal to mess with the economy and the pandemic. In other words to try to make the Trump presidency look bad before Nov. 3rd.

What organization or group was it that said... the protests won't aid in the spread of the coronavirus, but political rallies would? Funny how that works.

This topic is just more left/Dem crapola.

Absolutely nothing the Left or the Dems have done have been helpful to this country or it's legal citizens, for the last 3-4 years... minimum.



/e Oh yeah, almost forgot. This entire topic is just more of the same.






This post was edited by Ghot on Jul 7 2020 12:49am
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Jul 7 2020 12:58am
Quote (Ghot @ Jul 7 2020 01:46am)
Ya know what I haven't heard about lately?
I haven't heard about 90-100K refugees storming our borders, per month. I haven't heard about all kinds of problems from muslim legal or illegal immigrants. Trump and ICE must be doing something right.

Ya know what I have heard about?
I've heard that the left/Dems are doing everything in their power legal and illegal to mess with the economy and the pandemic. In other words to try to make the Trump presidency look bad before Nov. 3rd.

What organization or group was it that said... the protests won't aid in the spread of the coronavirus, but political rallies would? Funny how that works.

This topic is just more left/Dem crapola.

Absolutely nothing the Left or the Dems have done have been helpful to this country or it's legal citizens, for the last 3-4 years... minimum.

/e Oh yeah, almost forgot. This entire topic is just more of the same.


You haven't heard about it because America is full of Covid and they already came early in Trump's administration when it was clear he is a weak leader.
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