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Sep 10 2017 08:43am
Quote (Thor123422 @ Sep 9 2017 04:15am)
So... the fact that I can increase my IQ by a good 10 points just by practicing taking the test means nothing?

The fact is that IQ is a pretty useless comparison unless the education level, income level, and about ten other factors are all held largely constant.

Even then it's not predictive on its own because different cultures value different facets of IQ differently.


Anyway, you just did it again. You actually went out of your way to ignore everything that is inconvenient to your position.

Yours is a view of purposeful ignorance. Whether it's to boost your own ego or just laziness I can't say, but I'm glad people like you who keep yourselves ignorant eventually lose out to those who don't.


Not trying to nitpick....but 10 IQ points is less than a standard deviation so any increase or decrease by that much isn't super significant (and is expected). In regards to everything else, tl;dr.
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Sep 10 2017 10:24am
Quote (Thor123422 @ Sep 9 2017 04:15am)
So... the fact that I can increase my IQ by a good 10 points just by practicing taking the test means nothing?

The fact is that IQ is a pretty useless comparison unless the education level, income level, and about ten other factors are all held largely constant.

Even then it's not predictive on its own because different cultures value different facets of IQ differently.


Anyway, you just did it again. You actually went out of your way to ignore everything that is inconvenient to your position.

Yours is a view of purposeful ignorance. Whether it's to boost your own ego or just laziness I can't say, but I'm glad people like you who keep yourselves ignorant eventually lose out to those who don't.


This was studied deeply by individuals like Jason Richwine. A far deeping understanding than you have. IQ is 15% upbribging and 85% genetic. If you study your balls off you can still fall 85% short.
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Sep 10 2017 01:09pm
Quote (EndlessSky @ Sep 10 2017 10:24am)
This was studied deeply by individuals like Jason Richwine. A far deeping understanding than you have. IQ is 15% upbribging and 85% genetic. If you study your balls off you can still fall 85% short.


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Sep 10 2017 01:11pm
Quote (majorblood @ Sep 9 2017 02:38am)
do you not think that IQ can be a relatively useful indicator of these things?

earlier you recommended resources on this, what are your favorite resources for IQ related studies?

/e also there are different types of IQ which cover the things you mention such as spacial reasoning, linguistic intelligence, and others. Asians typically score high on spacial reasoning while ashkenazi jews on the linguistic.


It can be a useful indicator, but it's still not a great indicator. We're talking about the social sciences here, where a p value of 0.6 is acceptable.

Honestly any university textbook will get you started and give you further resources.
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Sep 10 2017 01:20pm
Quote (Thor123422 @ Sep 10 2017 03:09pm)


#80iqlogic
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Sep 10 2017 01:21pm
Quote (EndlessSky @ Sep 10 2017 01:20pm)
#80iqlogic


You mean how you take the word of a political commentator on an academic subject?

I agree, that's pretty dumb.

Quote
In terms of group differences, people of northeast Asian descent have higher average IQ scores than people of European lineage, who in turn have higher average scores than people of sub-Saharan African descent. The average score for Hispanic Americans falls somewhere between the white and black American averages. Psychologists have tested and long rejected the notion that score differences can be explained simply by biased test questions. It is possible that genetic factors could influence IQ differences among ethnic groups, but many scientists are withholding judgment until DNA studies are able to link specific gene combinations with IQ.


This post was edited by Thor123422 on Sep 10 2017 01:25pm
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Sep 10 2017 01:32pm
I did a bit of reading on Jason Richwine.

He doesn't make statements nearly as strong as what you posted as far as I can tell.

You just did what the media loves to do. Take tempered statements from scientists and blow them out of proportion. (it appears)



Still strange that he works at the Heritage foundation, so I'm sure I'm missing some piece of the puzzle on what he's written. You don't get a job there by being an unbiased professional....

This post was edited by Thor123422 on Sep 10 2017 01:33pm
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Sep 10 2017 01:50pm
Quote (Thor123422 @ Sep 10 2017 03:32pm)
I did a bit of reading on Jason Richwine.

He doesn't make statements nearly as strong as what you posted as far as I can tell.

You just did what the media loves to do. Take tempered statements from scientists and blow them out of proportion. (it appears)



Still strange that he works at the Heritage foundation, so I'm sure I'm missing some piece of the puzzle on what he's written. You don't get a job there by being an unbiased professional....


Notably your brain.

This post was edited by EndlessSky on Sep 10 2017 01:51pm
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Sep 10 2017 01:52pm
what many people dont seem to understand is this: the intellectual ceiling of a person is heavily influenced by his or her genes, yes. but to reach one's potential requires good nutrition, an intellectually stimulating environment while growing up, good education and so on. IQ tests measure a proxy quantity for the intellectual capabilities of someone, not their potential ceiling. so if, for example, a significantly higher percentage of minorities than of whites live in poverty, then those minorities will, on average, stay farther below their intellectual potential than whites. therefore, IQ differences between ethnicities coupled with a genetic contribution to intellect still dont necessarily imply that people of color are born intellectually inferior or anything like that.

yes, it is imaginable that there are really differences between ethnicities on a genetic level with respect to intellect, but if such differences exist, their influence will most likely be smaller than the "environment" aspect. and there are other aspects too, like higher IQ people being more successful on average, and successul and/or smart people tending to mate with each other instead of with poor/stupid folks. this "social selection" effect certainly also plays into it and over time increases spreads in measured IQ.

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Sep 10 2017 01:53pm
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Sep 10 2017 01:53pm
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Sep 10 2017 03:52pm)
what many people dont seem to understand is this: the intellectual ceiling of a person is heavily influenced by his or her genes, yes. but to reach one's potential requires good nutrition, an intellectually stimulating environment while growing up, good education and so on. IQ tests measure a proxy quantity for the intellectual capabilities of someone, not their potential ceiling. so if, for example, a significantly higher percentage of minorities than of whites live in poverty, then those minorities will, on average, stay farther below their intellectual potential than whites. therefore, IQ differences between ethnicities coupled with a genetic contribution to intellect still dont necessarily imply that people of color are born intellectually inferior or anything like that.

yes, it is imaginable that there are really differences between ethnicities on a genetic level with respect to intellect, but if such differences exist, their influence will most likely be smaller than the "environment" aspect. and there are other aspects too, like higher IQ people being more successful, and successul and/or smart people tending to mate with each other instead of with poor/stupid folks. this "social selection" effect certainly also plays into it and over time increases spreads in measured IQ.


This was answered with a real numeric value within the last page...
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